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What is civil disobedience? Is it moral or amoral? Can you name any examples in history? |
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 | | From: trisha | Sent: 7/24/2008 8:25 PM |
So what do you call the first church's refusal to bow down and worship Caesar, instead being fed to the lions? Sounds like civil disobedience to me. Where the Gospel is concerned...that is what I call to suffer for the gospels sake. lol many think they suffer for the gopels sake here..it is thier own doing.lol Africa where they pluck out eyes if you preach the Gospel truth...that is horrid.. |
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I looked up civil disobedience on wikipedia and found this: Civil disobedience is the active refusal to obey certain laws, demands and commands of a government, or of an occupying power, without resorting to physical violence. It is one of the primary tactics of nonviolent resistance. In its most nonviolent form (known as ahimsa or satyagraha) it could be said that it is compassion in the form of respectful disagreement. Also, Mahatma Gandhi outlined the following rules: - A civil resister (or satyagrahi) will harbour no anger.
- He will suffer the anger of the opponent.
- In so doing he will put up with assaults from the opponent, never retaliate; but he will not submit, out of fear of punishment or the like, to any order given in anger.
- When any person in authority seeks to arrest a civil resister, he will voluntarily submit to the arrest, and he will not resist the attachment or removal of his own property, if any, when it is sought to be confiscated by authorities.
- If a civil resister has any property in his possession as a trustee, he will refuse to surrender it, even though in defending it he might lose his life. He will, however, never retaliate.
- Retaliation includes swearing and cursing.
- Therefore a civil resister will never insult his opponent, and therefore also not take part in many of the newly coined cries which are contrary to the spirit of ahimsa.
- A civil resister will not salute the Union Flag, nor will he insult it or officials, English or Indian.
- In the course of the struggle if anyone insults an official or commits an assault upon him, a civil resister will protect such official or officials from the insult or attack even at the risk of his life.
Civil disobedience certainly didn't start in India, but just because someone may not like to apply the term to what the early Christians did, doesn't mean the definition gets rewritten. |
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 | | From:  Kiki40 | Sent: 7/24/2008 10:22 PM |
So what do you call the first church's refusal to bow down and worship Caesar, instead being fed to the lions? Sounds like civil disobedience to me. | I'm sure that it does. But your ears are not what defines acceptable and unacceptable activities in which the Christian may engage. The word of God is. Man's authority is valid so long as it does not cross God's. Technically, Christians not only refused to worship Caesar, but they also actively engaged in the worship of the one true God. That's not passive resistence. That's aggressive defiance. |
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The weapons of our warfare are not carnal. Civil disobedience is for those who only have carnal weapons at their disposal. - Kiki Kiki are you trying to "spiritualize" this??? lol  |
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How can any person who knows the LORD, say that to disobey the powers of the Adversary, in a civil fashion, is but carnal? WHAT CONFUSION!!! Those who refused to bow to Caesar did not rise up and declare physical warfare against Rome!!! They had no swords or chariots or spears. . . They didn't attempt to sack Rome. Their warfare was SPIRITUAL and they were fed to the lions for it. Alas, it becomes apparent that crafty men have crept into the churches unawares to teach false doctrine and to twist truth so that the bitter is set forth for the sweet! Of course this should come as no suprise seeing as how so many are in the employ of Caesar today. These would have us to believe that Civil Disobedience is to disobey that which is civil when it means precisely the opposite! So the lie is being preached from the pulpit... Well, I will teach the truth: Civil Disobedience means to disobey in a civil manner and I'm all for that if it means obedience to the WORD of GOD. These, who upheld the WORD of GOD, were FAITHFUL MARTYRS - not criminals! GOD have mercy! Kiki check yourself... Pray... Or keep a civil tongue. Have you considered herbs, maybe... Soy products are good, I hear. .. Ginkgo biloba... Black Cohosh... Here, check out this link: Health for Women Never think that tyranny is Godly. Never believe that fascism is of the LORD. You have a voice and there is LIBERTY in JESUS. The very tenants of AMERICAN JUSTICE are founded upon this precept! Speak up and fear not. Preach the truth and lie not. Remember that there is no authority except that which is authority indeed. GOD will never contradict Himself and any law that contradicts GOD's law IS no law at all. Any unjust law is no law at all... And that my friends, came out of the mouth of an anti-polygamist. If it were not for Civil Disobedience there would no United States of America. GOD BLESS |
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JT....civil disobedience does NOT mean disobedience in a calm, lighthearted manner. IT MEANS TO DISOBEY LOCAL, COUNTY, STATE, CITY, TOWN, FEDERAL LAWS. |
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JT....civil disobedience does NOT mean disobedience in a calm, lighthearted manner. IT MEANS TO DISOBEY LOCAL, COUNTY, STATE, CITY, TOWN, FEDERAL LAWS. True, but not necessarily all at once; and not necessarily to all said "laws"; and not necessarily by means of violence or force; but even peacably and respectfully allowing each their own, rendering unto GOD that which is GOD's and unto Caesar that which is Caesar's. The Holy Spirit bears witness that MARRIAGE is the LORD's territory and domain. The Scripture never tells us, at any time, to render unto Caesar anything Caesar wants. 
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Christians are supposed to obey all laws of the "governor"....this means local, state, county, town, city, federal.....to the best that they are Biblical...meaning there are no laws in effect that go against the Bible...such as murder, adultery, bigamy, etc... |
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 | | From:  Kiki40 | Sent: 7/25/2008 6:11 AM |
Romans 13:1 Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. In case you have a question concerning the word "higher": It means anyone who has authority over you. And in case you'd lke to know if "powers" mean "spiritual" ones: They are not. 2Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. Even civil resistance qualifies as resisting the ordinance of God. 3For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: 4For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. 5Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake. Um...does that mean even when government is being a meany cat? 6For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing. 7Render therefore to all their dues: tribute to whom tribute is due; custom to whom custom; fear to whom fear; honour to whom honour. Looks like it to me. Even the necessity of being subject to the institution of slavery: Titus 2:9 Exhort servants to be obedient unto their own masters, and to please them well in all things; not answering again; 10Not purloining, but shewing all good fidelity; that they may adorn the doctrine of God our Saviour in all things. 11For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, 12Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; 13Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ; 14Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works. 15These things speak, and exhort, and rebuke with all authority. Let no man despise thee. 1Put them in mind to be subject to principalities and powers, to obey magistrates, to be ready to every good work, Principalities? Isn't that word used to reference Satan's dominion?
http://cf.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?strongs=746&t=KJV Yep. And we are to be subject to principalities. Arche is used of originators, primarily of doctrine...aka, The Apostle Paul...as well as simply "leaders." 8This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men. 9But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain. Where would "civil disobedience" fall in consideration of the "good works" that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain? The authority we have in the Lord is to remind everyone that they are to be subject to whatever government they are under. There is a parallel teaching with this one concerning the requisite of the child of God to be obedient to them that "have the rule over you." That is in reference to specific offices of authority like a pastor, a husband, and parents. 10A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject; http://cf.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?strongs=141&t=KJV In case you're wondering if anybody here qualifies for an heretick. 11Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself. 'Nuf said. 
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Correct, Anita Any law that is just is given by GOD to the governors who are put into leadership by GOD. GOD does not endorse corruption in high places, highjacked votes, same sex marriage, and unjust "laws". GOD does not honour tyranny and fascism. Neither does the LORD suffer robbery, murder, adultery, fraud, and the registered licensing of marriage without consequence. Man's law suffers adultery without penalty but GOD's law is truer than this. Man's law suffers murder and abortion and adultery with much more lenience than GOD's law. Man's law makes merchandise of people whereas GOD's law points them in the direction of righteousness and Liberty in the LORD. Man's law points the populace in the direction of self-rightness and licentiousness but the honest heart knows that no piece of paper writ makes a thing right. GOD's law is above Man's law and it is by far, the higher standard; for GOD's law is GOD's commandments and His commandments are not grievous. His yoke is easy and His burden is light. Yet the Book that the magistrates would have a citizen to swear upon or to take oath by is not permited to be opened in a court of law and the ten commandments are often barred from being exposed in any court of law. Corruption in high places prevails. The poor and needy are taxed and the people are fleeced with writs and contracts of marriage and unlawful divorcement. Abortion is legal and "justice" has a price. Ask any hollywood movie star if polygamy isn't legal for them. If they are honest they'll tell you anything is legal if the price is right. Serial monogamy ... Serial polygamy... It's all the same... Marrying and giving in marriage... A proverbial meat market... People for sale and children too. There is nothing new under the sun and the rich get richer while the poor get poorer. The faces of the poor are still ground into the earth and the weight of the corporate fat cat sits stolid upon the shoulders of the over-taxed middle class as the elites, who own the banks and industries (and the media), point their gaze in the direction of the poor man. It is not nearly the poor who are bringing our nations to their knees but the knees of the middle class are beginning to buckle and the elitists say let the chips fall where they may. Honest men in politics? In these latter days? That's not what the BIBLE says. Christians need to know what times they are living in and the time will come when a Christian will have to make a choice between obeying GOD or obeying Caesar. GOD bless you |
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Any one else that took part in the Aldermaston Campaign for Nuclear Disarmament marches of the 1950's in England please own up! Bob Wood |
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BOB you are a very lovable man. GOD bless you. |
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