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God and Jesus : Is Jesus a man or God?
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 Message 1 of 8 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551  (Original Message)Sent: 12/3/2006 3:07 AM
 
Isa. 53: 3.  He is despised and rejected of men; a man of sorrows, and acquainted with grief: and we hid as it were our faces from him; he was despised, and we esteemed him not.
 
1Tim. 2: 5.  For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
 
Numbers 23: 19.  God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good?
 
Now I sit here hour after hour trying to find and show you all the truth of God's Word.  When will you accept the Word for what IT says and not what some false church tells you it says?  You had better, if you seriously desire to have salvation and eternal life.
 
Now, Isa. 53: 3  said that Jesus was a MAN OF SORROWS.
1Tim 2: 5 said Jesus is a man who mediates between God and me.  (that is right now, too.)
 
But look at Numbers 23; 19,  this says that God is NOT A MAN, NEITHER THE SON OF MAN.
 
Now is Jesus the Son of Man?  HUH?  God is not the Son of Man.  God is not a man.  God is not half man and half God either.  This is the height of blasphemy!
 
Are you going to deny this Word?  If you cling to this dual natured person, you are calling God a lie.  It means the Catholic popes and all their idols gods mean more to you than the truth of God.  You cannot bring yourself to turn loose that whore's teachings.
 
Both the trinity lie and the Jesus only lie DECLARE THAT JESUS WAS BOTH GOD AND MAN.    In other words picture it -- the myths of half man and half horse.
 
See that dual thing is where it came from - mythology = idol gods of the heathen.
 
Is your god a dual being?  Mine is surely NOT.   And I don't care how many come by, poke fun at me, belittle me, curse me, take up arms with me, or whatever you come up with,  I AM TEACHING TRUTH. AND I STAND ON IT.  Take the whole world but give me the  TRUE JESUS. 
 
Jesus is A man even now in Heaven.
By: Jo Smith 
 
 


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 Message 2 of 8 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 12/3/2006 3:08 AM
Now about incarnation:
 
<DIR>

in•car•na•tion \'in-'kär-"nÀ-sh�?/FONT>n\ n 1 : the embodiment of a deity or spirit in an earthly form 2 cap : the union of divine and human natures in Jesus Christ 3 : a person showing a trait or typical character to a marked degree 4 : the act of incarnating : the state of being incarnate

That is copied from my Websters.

Now do you see from this meaning that this teaching is saying that a deity or spirit took upon itself human nature?  Do you see that it claime that Jesus was a union of divine and human natures?  What this litterally means is that Some part of Jesus, the spirit part was first a divine or god person and then that god person left that existance and came to earth and got into Mary's womb and grew there, finally being born as any other human baby.  Only this baby now has inside him the nature of God.

In other words it calls this Scripture a flat lie:

Heb. 2 : 7.  Thou madest him a little lower than the angels; thou crownedst him with glory and honour, and didst set him over the works of thy hands:

Here we are told that Jesus was made lower than the angels.  Now angels are lower than God.  So he was not made with God inside him as part of his own being.


 8.  Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him.


 9.  But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.

Once again declaring Jesus to be made lower than the angels, for the suffering of death.  Now if any part of Jesus HAD been God, he could not have died.  If you say he could then you make the same mistake the Catholics made by saying that God became a mortal man. Romans 1 declares this to be of a reprobate mind, to Call the eternal God a mortal man.

If you say Jesus was not a mortal man, then you deny that he came in the flesh.


 10.  For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.
 11.  For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,


 12.  Saying, I will declare thy name unto my brethren, in the midst of the church will I sing praise unto thee.
 13.  And again, I will put my trust in him. And again, Behold I and the children which God hath given me.


 14.  Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;


 15.  And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.


 16.  For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.


 17.  Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.

Now this declares that Jesus took on him the seed of Abraham, a mortal man.  It declares that Jesus was MADE LIKE UNTO HIS BRETHREN.

It also says Jesus was tempted in all points like we are.  This proves he could not have been God. 

If Jesus were made like unto us, his brethren, then he could NOT HAVE HAD THE GOD NATURE AS PART OF HIMSELF.

Do we have in incarnate spirit?  Nope.  Then Jesus could not have had either.  Else he was not made like unto us.

Know what?  Not one of you believing this lie got it from reading the Word of God.  Know how I know this?  Because it is not in the Word of God, for it is a LIE.

Know where you got it?  From the hand-me-down lies from the mamma whore church, the catholics popes.  Now all the little churches followering suit are her daughters. God declares all of these will wind up in the lake of fire.

This is serious business.  It is a matter of eternal life or death.

If you call God a lie, you are domned to hell.  God never at any time stated that he or any part of him left Heaven and came into Mary's womb and then was this:

I have actually heard preachers, and some very prominant ones at that, stating that Jehovah was here in diapers;  Jehovah without any teeth.  Yes ,dear friend that is where this lie has taken people into their carnal minds.

Now if you think Jesus was an incarnate spirit, please give me at least one verse saying this.  But you know there has to be at least two.

Now somebody give me those two verses which would establish this to be true.  And if you can, please tell me why God lied.  For I quoted above here where he said Jesus was made like unto us humans. 

Are humans dual natured folks?  With a spirit of God as our innermost being?  If not then Jesus could not have been either.

It is just that the entire church world has swallowed down that catholic lie that Jesus was God incarnate.  This is that false jesus Paul said they would bring up.  And that is exactly why they claim he was born on Dec. 25.  For this was the date Tamuz, another 'incarnate' god, born of a woman, was supposed to have been born on.

Know where that lie came from.  Go study some myths of heathen idol gods and you will quickly find that they all have this lie ---- that a woman birthed god.  this god was incarnate;  both man and god.

It is of the devil!!!!!!!

No apologies to anyone.  I teach truth which I  READ  OUT  OF  GOD'S WORD AND QUOTE HERE FOR YOU ALL TO READ.

Take the time to read the Psalms messages I have posted here.  They all prove what I am saying.  And the Book is full of proof.

Incarnate is of the devil.  It originated from the devil and it will wind up in hell.  God has no Mother.  I tell you truth.  God never left heaven and was born of a woman.  Only in mythology does this stuff happen.

May God help you all to open your eyes and deny this whore teaching and accept the ingrafted Word which is able to save your souls.

THIS IS SERIOUS BUSINESS.


Reply
 Message 3 of 8 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 12/3/2006 3:09 AM
 
Almost everyone reads and interprets Psalms as if it is speaking primairly about King David.  Now that is a shame and false as can be.
 
To believe this is to cheat yourself of all the joy and glory which is revealed in Psalms about Jesus.  Truth and secrets are revealed in the Prophets and Psalms about Jesus which are not even revealed in the N.T.
 
So to think it is about David is to totally miss all the glory and understanding you receive about Jesus in these books.
 
Without know this, it is impossible to ever really know the truth.  But know why the church people cannot see that it is about Jesus?  Because if they read it right, that it is Jesus, then all the false teachings concerning Jesus and God would immediately disappear.  You cannot read Psalsm and see that it is in truth Jesus, and cling to either the lie of trinity or Jesus only.  Now that is why people would rather claim it is all about David.  Jesus is even called David in lots of Scripture.  He is also called many other human names.  This is also a secret most people miss in the Word.
Truth of the matter is,  I don't think very many people, including preachers ever study the Word.  So they will miss salvation.
 
Jo

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 Message 4 of 8 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 12/3/2006 3:12 AM
 
John 8: 24.  I said therefore unto you, that ye shall die in your sins: for if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
 25.  Then said they unto him, Who art thou? And Jesus saith unto them, Even the same that I said unto you from the beginning.

 26.  I have many things to say and to judge of you: but he that sent me is true; and I speak to the world those things which I have heard of him.

 27.  They understood not that he spake to them of the Father.

 28.  Then said Jesus unto them, When ye have lifted up the Son of man, then shall ye know that I am he, and that I do nothing of myself; but as my Father hath taught me, I speak these things.
 29.  And he that sent me is with me: the Father hath not left me alone; for I do always those things that please him.
 
Now read that.  v24,  Jesus said if ye believe not that I am he, ye shall die in your sins.
Now people took that and said Jesus was saying if you don't believe that I am God,      ---- but was he saying that?
Nope. 
v28--He told them here he was the Son of Man.  When ye have lifted up the Son of man,  then shall YE KNOW  THAT  I AM HE. 
I AM HE. ----- WHO?  THE SON OF MAN.  is not that what he said?
 
See he said  I AM HE ------ THE SON OF MAN.  HE DID NOT SAY  I AM GOD.  HE SAID  I AM SON OF MAN.  I AM.  I AM.  BUT WHO?  I AM THE SON OF MAN.
 
No go find a verse, even one where Jesus said  I AM GOD.  Where is it People?  where is that verse?
 
Not in God's word.

Reply
 Message 5 of 8 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 12/3/2006 3:15 AM
Now I mean no rebuke  anyone  when I teach as I do.  But I MUST. 
When one says this or any Scripture can mean a certain thing and nothings else, and espcially when that theory is based solely on made up stuff which is NOT taught anywhere in Written Word, then you must assume that you are missing what is being said.
 
No that is NOT what is meant.  It cannot be, for it crosses all other Scripture.  There is not even ONE SINGLE SCRIPTURE,  I MEAN NOT EVEN ONE VERSE In all the Word which says anything about Jesus or God being INCARNATE.  That is a Satan inspiried term.  It is totally foreign to God's Word.
 
Now if you have a concordance look that word up.  If not, there are concordances online which you may use.  See for yourself that this word is NOT WRITTEN ANYWHERE IN GOD'S WORD.
 
So it cannot be true!  You are accepting some man's word over God's Word to say this.
 
No, nowhere did Jesus ever claim to be God.  Neither did any apostle claim that Jesus was God.  Do you all realize that Jesus was a MORTAL MAN?  I have asked this so many times.  Somebody had better start listening and get some truth.  God grows weary himself with dealing with people who flat refuse to accept his clear Word.
 
Realize that iF you believe or teach anything which is not what God said, then you are calling God a lie!
 
God never said Jesus was God;  he always said Jesus was his SON.
 
The FATHER is a KINGDOM OF SPIRITS.   THE SON IS A KINGDOM OF HUMANS.
 
Jesus belongs to us, the human kingdom.  To deny this is  ANTI-CHRIST.
To deny that Jesus came in the flesh is ANTI-CHRIST.
 
If he came in the flesh, then he was human, of the Son kingdom.
 
This means he was a mortal man.  It is reprobate to call God a mortal man. Romans 1.
 
So all true revelation must fit these true teachings.  You cannot find and quote one single verse which said Jesus was God.  I want someone to show me that.  God set Jesus to be our personal God after he ascended to Heaven,  but He is still a man in Heaven.
 
There is ONE God AND one mediator  BETWEEN  God and men, the MAN Christ Jesus.
 
No Abraham saw prophecy for the Day when Jesus would live on earth, also when he would be resurrected.  That is what is means Abraham  SAW my day - it means he UNDERSTOOD IT.  TO have the understanding opened means to see. 
 
The Jews may have said Jesus was saying he was God,  but they were wrong. They lied as they always did.  They had no truth. they were in darkness and they stayed in darkness.  Why you think they crucified Jesus?  You think they did this with their 'eyes' open?  Of course not.
 
I am is God.  Not Jesus.  Jesue was telling them  before Abraham was  God was.  That is what he said.  He did not say he was I am  nor did he say he was God.
 
He aksed the rich young ruler who called him good,  why do you call me good,  only one is good and that is God.  So see he was saying to this man,  I am not God.
 
If you say Jesus was God, then you must say,  THAT  SINFUL MAN  KILLED  GOD.  Do you realize that God cannot die?  If he could, then he would not be God?
 
My, My.  How could people stay this blind so long?  You are believing the Catholic lies over the truth of God's Word.  JESUS  WAS NOT GOD. he was a mortal man.
 
There is no truth is that teaching to set anyone free.  Besides all this,  The Word, and The Father was speaking inside Jesus.
 
Ex. 1: 13.  And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his name? what shall I say unto them?

 14.  And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.

 15.  And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, The Lord God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.
 
Now read that.  Regardless of what people say,  this Scripture is only saying that I Am is a name.  A name of God.
 
So Jesus was telling them that God, the one named I Am was before Abraham.  Jesus said I say only what my Father tells me to say - so he was saying what I teach came from God, it is truth.  Before Abraham lived, this God knew all things.  And He tells me what to say.
 
Now I want someone to find a verse where Jesus claimed to do or say anything of his own account.  Go to it , all of you;  for all of you claim Jesus was God.  If so then why did he say I can of mine OWN SELF  DO NOTHING?
 
GIVE ME SCRIPTURE FOR THIS,  WHERE DID JESUS SAY I AM GOD, OR I CAN DO THINGS ON MY OWN?

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 Message 6 of 8 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 12/3/2006 3:20 AM
 
Jesus was not saying I am ,  as in I am going to town.  No.  He was saying before Abraham was, the one named I Am was.
 
Jesus was never named I Am.
 
It is not meaning what we mean when we say  I am.....  it is not English.  It is God's Language.  Until you learn this, you will forever read lies into God's Word - trying to interpret it from English.
 
John 8: 38.  I speak that which I have seen with my Father: and ye do that which ye have seen with your father.
 39.  They answered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If ye were Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham.

 40.  But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham. 
 (why did Jesus have to hear this from God?  He was supposed to BE GOD according to all of you)?

 41.  Ye do the deeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; we have one Father, even God.
 42.  Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
 43.  Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.

 44.  Ye are of your father the devil,
 
Now analyze this:
Jesus was speaking what he saw with his Father.  He said those Jews were speaking what they saw with their father.  but who did he say that father was?
v44- the devil.
 
So how did they speak truth?
He said I do what I see with my Father. and you do what you see with your father, the devil.  So how were those Jews with the devil? 
 
If you think Jesus had to be before time with his Father, then you must assume that those Jews were also before time with their father, the devil.  How are they speaking from the devil?  did u never consider this? 
 
But now read v40---So you think those Jews thought Jesus was God, do you?  Well I say NO!
 
Jesus said they were seeking to KILL JESUS.  Now I can assure you all of one thing,  those Jews might not have been of God, but they certainly did not entertain for one instance that they could or would KILL GOD.
 
Do you really think that those Jews thought Jesus was God and they were trying to KILL GOD?
 
Whew!!!  None of you could really think this!  Surely not.  Those people never for one instance thought Jesus was God and neither did Jesus' disciples.  Never.  They all knew he was NOT  GOD.
 
But the disciples accepted Jesus as their God after He was resurrected.  For this was the plan of God.

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 Message 7 of 8 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 12/3/2006 3:22 AM
 
Jesus said Satan deceiveth the  WHOLE WORLD.  Now I ask you,  how then is this whole church world right?  Every church teaches that Jesus was God.
 
So if Satan deceived them all, how is it that they all know the truth?
 
I submit to you all, that they are ALL DECEIVED;  YES THEY ARE ALL WRONG.  Where are the  FEW  who find the truth? 
 
Those Jews did the very same thing all of the people to day are doing - accussing Jesus of claiming to be God.
 
Yes it is false witness against Jesus.  He did NO SUCH THING.  It is the original sin.  Jesus did not commit that original sin of setting himself up as God.  He was a man.

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 Message 8 of 8 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 12/3/2006 3:28 AM

John 8:


<NOBR>Joh 8:56</NOBR> Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw it, and was glad.
<NOBR>Joh 8:57</NOBR> Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?
<NOBR>Joh 8:58</NOBR> Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
<NOBR>Joh 8:59</NOBR>

Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by


   I  know that most people use this verse, which is only telling how the Jews were falsely accusing, to say that Jesus did indeed claim to be God and equal with God.
 
But Jesus was not saying that, either then or now.  People use this verse and say that Jesus did claim to be God.  But Jesus did no such thing!  It was just a lie then, as it is now with the entire church world claiming this same lie.
 
Every church claims that Jesus was God and co-equal with God.  But it is just not true.  If so, then Jesus lied when he said My Father is GREATER than I.
 
How could he be greater than Jesus if they were equals?  How could a mortal man be equal to the Eternal immortal God?
 
People today are making this same false accusation against Jesus and backlash anyone like myself who sees that it is not true and is not afraid to stand on the truth of God's Word.
 
God showed me this;  not some man or any church.  For truth of the matter is I don't know of anyone else who teaches it as God showed me.  I believe God, and I will never change from what He told me; for it agrees completely with the Written Word from the first to the end.
 
No other doctrine can say this.  I have already brought out many, many places where both doctrines cross the Word and asked all who believe either the trinity lie or the Jesus only lie to give one Verse which states what they say.  Know what?  So far no one has been able to do so, and they never will.
 
Jo

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