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Lu 2:40

And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, filled with wisdom: and the grace of God was upon him.

The grace OF GOD was UPON him [Jesus]. Now if Jesus actually WERE God, this could not be said. It would not be true language, that the grace of God was upon Him.

Lu 2:52

And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God and man.

Again, if Jesus were God, this could not be said..........Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favour with God.

How could he increase in favour with God, if he were God?

From: joie

Sent: 1/11/2004 10:35 PM

Hebrews 1

1. God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2. Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;
3. Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
4. Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.
5. For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
6. And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.
7. And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.
8. But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.
9. Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows.
10. And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:
11. They shall perish; but thou remainest; and they all shall wax old as doth a garment;
12. And as a vesture shalt thou fold them up, and they shall be changed: but thou art the same, and thy years shall not fail.
13. But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?
14. Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

From: joie

Sent: 1/11/2004 10:36 PM

Hebrews 2

1. Therefore we ought to give the more earnest heed to the things which we have heard, lest at any time we should let them slip.
2. For if the word spoken by angels was stedfast, and every transgression and disobedience received a just recompence of reward;
3. How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;
4. God also bearing them witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?

From: joie

Sent: 1/11/2004 10:38 PM

9. But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.
10. For it became him, for whom are all things, and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons unto glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.
11. For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,
12. Saying, I will declare thy name unto my brethren, in the midst of the church will I sing praise unto thee.
13. And again, I will put my trust in him. And again, Behold I and the children which God hath given me.
14. Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
15. And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.

From: joie

Sent: 1/11/2004 10:39 PM

16. For verily he took not on him the nature of angels; but he took on him the seed of Abraham.
17. Wherefore in all things it behoved him to be made like unto his brethren, that he might be a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make reconciliation for the sins of the people.
18. For in that he himself hath suffered being tempted, he is able to succour them that are tempted.

From:

Isaiah·

Sent: 1/11/2004 11:06 PM

Hebrews 3
¹   Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus;
²   Who was faithful to him that appointed him, as also Moses was faithful in all his house.
³   For this man was counted worthy of more glory than Moses, inasmuch as he who hath builded the house hath more honour than the house.
⁴   For every house is builded by some man; but he that built all things is God.
⁵   And Moses verily was faithful in all his house, as a servant, for a testimony of those things which were to be spoken after;
⁶   But Christ as a son over his own house; whose house are we, if we hold fast the confidence and the rejoicing of the hope firm unto the end.
⁷   Wherefore (as the Holy Ghost saith, To day if ye will hear his voice,
⁸   Harden not your hearts, as in the provocation, in the day of temptation in the wilderness:
⁹   When your fathers tempted me, proved me, and saw my works forty years.
¹⁰   Wherefore I was grieved with that generation, and said, They do alway err in their heart; and they have not known my ways.
¹¹   So I sware in my wrath, They shall not enter into my rest.)
¹²   Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
¹³   But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin.
¹⁴   For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;
¹⁵   While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.
¹⁶   For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses.
¹⁷   But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness?
¹⁸   And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?
¹⁹   So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.

From:

Isaiah·

Sent: 1/15/2004 10:22 PM

Hebrews 5
¹   For every high priest taken from among men is ordained for men in things pertaining to God, that he may offer both gifts and sacrifices for sins:
²   Who can have compassion on the ignorant, and on them that are out of the way; for that he himself also is compassed with infirmity.
³   And by reason hereof he ought, as for the people, so also for himself, to offer for sins.
⁴   And no man taketh this honour unto himself, but he that is called of God, as was Aaron.
⁵   So also Christ glorified not himself to be made an high priest; but he that said unto him, Thou art my Son, to day have I begotten thee.
⁶   As he saith also in another place, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.
⁷   Who in the days of his flesh, when he had offered up prayers and supplications with strong crying and tears unto him that was able to save him from death, and was heard in that he feared;
⁸   Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered;
⁹   And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;
¹⁰   Called of God an high priest after the order of Melchisedec.
¹¹   Of whom we have many things to say, and hard to be uttered, seeing ye are dull of hearing.
¹²   For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat.
¹³   For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe.
¹⁴   But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil.

(More of my conversation with Apostolicminister.)

Apostolicminister, I tried several days ago to join your group. I have not heard from you accepting me. Maybe you cannot send me the acceptance since I did not let my address show. If this is the case, please let me know. If I am not welcome there, please let me know.

If I need to resubmit the application, please let me know.

Now You have said you do not believe the baby Jesus was God. You also said the man Jesus who died on the cross was not God. So how then do you say he is the only one? How can you say he was God? You have denied He was God.

Which is it? Either He was God or He was not. Which do you believe?

How bout where John said The Father sent the Son to be the Saviour of the world? 1John 4: 14.

12. No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.

15. Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God.

1John 5: 5. Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

Now all of the verse say to confess that Jesus is the SON OF GOD -- I have never found one verse which tell me to confess or believe that Jesus is God.

If you can show me that then I will concede to your teaching.

I am not speaking of where Thomas called the risen Christ My Lord and my God. That is personal. God set Jesus as our personal God. I know you do not understand this right now, but if you open your heart up, God can show you.

From: joie

Sent: 5/21/2003 11:53 PM

Satan has deceived most people with this lie that they need to know Hebrew and Greek to understand God's Word. That is a big lie.

Did you realize that the KJV is an exact TRANSLATION, by people moved on and led by God, people who knew both languages, into our English?

Now if they have already TRANSLATED it, what need do I have to try to RE-TRANSLATE IT? It is sheer foolishness.

I let God show me in Scripture what another Scripture or word means. Those English words have a spiritual meaning not evident in any dictionary, not even Strong's.

These same words in Hebrew or Greek carry the same English meaning they did in the original, BUT THE ORIGINAL LANGUAGE WORDS HAD THE SAME SPIRITUAL MEANING THE ENGLISH WORDS MEAN SPIRITUALLY.!

This is a great secret. That is what is meant by No Scriptrue is of any PRIVATE interpretation --- it means every word, every Scripture in the Word has ANOTHER SCRIPTURE OR VERSE WHICH EXPLAINS IT.

No Scripture can be understood without another Scripture. If you try to isolate one verse or word, or statement and intrepret it yourself, you are wrong. You must find the meaning somewhere else in the Word.

While you spent your time studying another language, because you did not think God could teach you straight from His Word ~~~~~~~ I was spending my time studying the WORD.

That is why God himself teaches me -- I took the time to study HIS WORD. I LOVE IT.

From: joie

Sent: 5/25/2003 11:31 PM

The Father was speaking, the Son was standing, the Spirit was decending. What 'bout that....One God.

How was he decending down from heaven as a bird, = a dove,

Perhaps you think He had wings?

and lighting upon himself, and then speaking from heaven while he stands in water upon earth?

huh?

And you see that all as Jesus?

Jesus is the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost.(apos. min)

I did this one a while ago; a very good one ; a lot of work into it; then lost it. made me just sick. But anyways I will try to reconstruct this.

Your words:

What about the 'ONE' God? Now I ask you, how many do you suppose Paul was speaking of when he said, "You are ALL ONE?".

Figure it!

Did God have 'wings'? Well let the Word of God tell you~~~~

(do you believe the Word?)

Psm. 91: 4. He shall cover thee with his feathers, and under his wings shalt thou trust: his truth shall be thy shield and buckler (how bout that? not only wings, but feathers)

Psm. 68: 13. Though ye have lien among the pots, yet shall ye be as the wings of a dove covered with silver, and her feathers with yellow gold

Psm. 63: 7. Because thou hast been my help, therefore in the shadow of thy wings will I rejoice

Psm. 61: 4. I will abide in thy tabernacle for ever: I will trust in the covert of thy wings. Selah.

Psalms 57

1. Be merciful unto me, O God, be merciful unto me: for my soul trusteth in thee: yea, in the shadow of thy wings will I make my refuge, until these calamities be overpast.

Psm. 36: 7. How excellent is thy lovingkindness, O God! therefore the children of men put their trust under the shadow of thy wings.

Psm. 17: 8. Keep me as the apple of the eye, hide me under the shadow of thy wings,

Now is that enough Scripture? There is more, but I think that is sufficient.

There is not even one single Scripture saying that Jesus is the name of the Father and the Holy Ghost. You are just twisting Scripture to say this.

You will never see any real truth until you get upon the right foundation. Every revelation in the whole word depends upon this true revelation of who Jesus really is.

Peter had the true foundation. When Jesus asked Peter, Who do you say that I am. Peter spoke prophecy to the Christ; He said, thou art the Christ, the SON OF THE LIVING GOD.

He never said you are God. Jesue verified that this was a true revelation to Peter, not from flesh and blood, but from his Father in Heaven.

Your Jesus only doctrine makes all of Jesus' own words seem foolish. He said, My Father is greater than I.

He said, not my will, but YOURS BE DONE.

He said I came not to do my will but the will of my Father. I do always the things which please my Father. ( and you want to do away with that?)

You want to call him a lie - you want to say, Oh yes, Jesus I know you did do your own will; for you are the only one.

Now you are the silly one.

Another thing, I asked you to begin with to do only one point at a time, USING THE KJV SCRIPTURES. BUT YOU CANNOT DO THAT. You are 'fillibustering'. to hide the fact that you cannot deal with Word.

I have posted scripture after scripture proving God is not Jesus and you just ignore it. I am not going to sift through miles of pasted, in tiny print, stuff from Strongs or any other man-made stuff.

I have answered some of your points, then you just ignore it and re-do the same ones. So have it your way.

But you cannot deal with the true Word.

Still haven't seen you deal with this. Now your little 'sneer' was answered in the affirmative

from the Word of God, but you have just ignored it. Why?

Important Announcement The MSN Groups service will close in February 2009. You can move your group to Multiply, MSN’s partner for online groups. Learn More
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