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| | | From: joie (Original Message) | Sent: 7/23/2005 12:30 AM |
| From: joie (Original Message) | Sent: 3/27/2005 1:52 PM | ~ Who Wrote Revelation ~ The Scriptural truth is that John the Baptist wrote the book of Revelation, NOT John the disciple. This is solidly proven in the Word, itself. When you take any man's word for things, instead of finding the Scriptural answers, it will always be wrong; it matters not when that person lived. Much of history has been told and re-told; and deliberately changed to suit someone's purpose. History is certainly NOT a reliable source of TRUTH. You must go by the Word. What is the Revelation? It is the revelation of Jesus Christ. Re 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to show unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: Rev. 1:2 Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw. Now, stop and study this. This says that this John (a servant) bore record of Jesus. It also says he bore record of all things that he saw. He saw who Jesus was. He told the world who the Son of God is. So, who is revealed in the Word to have done this? Go to John 1:8 (speaking of John the Baptist)-He was not that Light, but was sent to BEAR WITNESS OF THAT LIGHT. Bear witness and bear record means the same thing. I ask you to find one Word which designates John the disciple to do this. Now, another proof is this: Revelation is a prophetical book; therefore HAD to have been written by a prophet. Now since, the prophets stopped with John the Baptist, him being the last one, it had to be this John. Proof: Luke 16:16-The law and the prophets were UNTIL JOHN: since that time the kingdom of God is preached and every man presseth into it. That stopped the prophets. Since that time, preaching is God's way of getting the Word of God to people. So, since it had to be a prophet who wrote Revelation, it had to be John the Baptist. More proof: Back in Rev. 1:1-and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John. This is saying an angel brought this message to this John. Angels were used by God to bring the Word of God to the prophets. This was not done so to the NT. writers. The disciples were personally taught by Jesus. He opened their understanding AFTER his resurrection. They were not taught by an angel. That was the method of bringing the Word to prophets; strictly OT. method. Not only that, but the prophets are the ones called 'servants'. The disciples were not called Servants. John's whole purpose was to prepare the way of the Lord; to reveal him to the world; to bear record of Jesus. The disciple did not bear this record; John the Baptist did. John said he was in the wilderness for the Word of God. He is the one who stayed in the wilderness until his showing to Israel. He received this revelation of Jesus BEFORE he started his ministry. God had given him a sign by which he would know the one he had written about. John bore record of Jesus when he baptized him. Read Jesus' own words: John 5:33-Ye sent unto John, and he BARE WITNESS unto the truth. v36-But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do , bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me. Mt 3:1 In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea, 3:2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand. Mt 3:3 For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight. This shows that John the Baptist was such an important man in the plan and works of God, that he was prophesied of by the Prophet Isaiah. It was told that he stayed in the wilderness until his showing to Israel. He was the one who received the revelation of the Son of God and made the way for Jesus. John was an Old Testament Prophet, and the very last one of them. Therefore, He was the one that an angel came to and gave the word of God to. John the disciple was no prophet. None of the NT ministers were of this type of prophet. They were taught the Word and had their understanding opened by Jesus, not an angel. At the Baptism of Jesus, John declared that God had spoken to him previously about this Son of God and given him a sign by which he would know when he met the One. This alone proves that John the Baptist was the one to whom God had given the revelation of Jesus to and the one to reveal Jesus to the world. John the Baptist is the one who prepared the way for Jesus and bore witness of Jesus. No Scripture shows that John the disciple bore witness of Jesus nor that he made the way for Jesus. Only a prophet of the Old Testament type could have written the prophetical Book of Revelation. Re 1:9- I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ. Now history teaches us that John the disciple was EXILED or imprisoned on the isle of Patmos. But I find no Scripture saying this. This is the one and only time Patmos is mentioned in Scripture. There is no mention here of being exiled or imprisoned here. It is made-up stuff. How long will people continue to accept made-up stuff instead of studying and accepting the truth of the Written Word of God? Being in this isle of Patmos is also the wilderness which John the Baptist stayed in until his showing to Israel. Here on this isle, John the Baptist was given the last prophetical Book of the Scriptures, the REVELATION OF JESUS CHRIST. See, that it said John was on this isle FOR THE WORD OF GOD. He was not there as a prisoner. He was not there for punishment or anything of that nature. He was there to receive the Word of God, the REVELATION of Jesus Christ. After having written this marvelous Book, John came preaching the kingdom of Heaven and repentance to Israel. His entire purpose for doing so was to reveal the Son of God to the world. John the Baptist is the one who BORE WITNESS OF JESUS, so says the Written Word of God. John 5:33 Ye sent unto John, and he bare witness unto the truth. 5:34 But I receive not testimony from man: but these things I say, that ye might be saved. 5:35 He was a burning and a shining light: and ye were willing for a season to rejoice in his light. 5:36 But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father hath given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father hath sent me. John 1:6 There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. 1:7 The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe. Now the above verses are CLEARLY speaking of John the Baptist. We have no record where the Jews, to whom Jesus was speaking in John 5:33, ever sent unto any John except the Baptist, to inquire of the truth. The John which the Jews sent unto, is the same John who bore witness of the true Light, Jesus. This is the very purpose God sent John to the world, to bear witness of Jesus, the Light. Those two Scriptures alone placed together, prove beyond a doubt that John the Baptist is also the Revelator. To reveal is the same as to make known or bear witness of someone. Only John the Baptist prepared the way for Jesus. That is what the Revelation is about, making the way for Jesus and revealing Him to the world. This was accomplished by John the Baptist. Now, one last Scripture; the words of the John who wrote the book: Rev. 22:8-And I John saw these things, and heard them. And when I had heard and seen, I fell down to worship before the feet of the angel which showed me these things. v9-Then saith he unto me, See thou do it not: for I am they fellowservant, and of thy BRETHREN THE PROPHETS, and of them which keep the sayings of this book: worship God. Now see, this angel told this John that he was the fellow servant of his BRETHREN, THE PROPHETS. This clearly identifies this John as a PROPHET. The prophets ended with John the Baptist. So says the Word of God. Jesus himself taught his disciples; not an angel. Lu 16:16 The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it. Mt 11:7 And as they departed, Jesus began to say unto the multitudes concerning John, What went ye out into the wilderness to see? A reed shaken with the wind? Mt 11:9 But what went ye out for to see? A prophet? yea, I say unto you, and more than a prophet. 11:10 For this is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee. Mt 11:13 For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John. 11:14 And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come. The above verses prove that the Jews sent unto John the Baptist and that the law and prophets were only until John. These verses prove solidly that John the Baptist is the one who made the way for Jesus, as the prophesied Elijah. This proves John the Baptist was the true Revelator, who was the one to reveal Jesus. By: Jo Smith | |
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| | | From: joie | Sent: 9/18/2005 4:31 AM |
Let me tell you one thing, GraveRobber, my understanding is NOT LOGIC. neither is it flawed, for it came straight from God. It is revealing the Word of God by the Word of God.........which none of you do.....you just 'spew' out words. You just mock me and think that proves something. Now you say the Baptizer did not write the Revelation, but where is any Scriptural proof? You have NONE. Yet you dispute all the many Scriptures I gave which SOLIDLY prove the John the Baptist wrote the Revelation,,,,,,,,for it is the REVEALING OF JESUS CHRIST. Now for proof: | There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. | | The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe. | | He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light. | | That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world. |
| John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me. | | And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace. | | For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ. | | No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him. | | And this is the record of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou? | | And he confessed, and denied not; but confessed, I am not the Christ. | | And they asked him, What then? Art thou Elias? And he saith, I am not. Art thou that prophet? And he answered, No. | | Then said they unto him, Who art thou? that we may give an answer to them that sent us. What sayest thou of thyself? | | He said, I am the voice of one crying in the wilderness, Make straight the way of the Lord, as said the prophet Esaias. |
| The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to show unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: [this means a prohet]the disciple was no prophet.] | | Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw. |
Now that proves that John the Baptist is the one who wrote the Revelation, for he is the one who bore record of Jesus. That Book is the revealing of Jesus. That is what John was sent for. He was prophecied by the prophet Isaiah. He is the one who went before Jesus and prepared the way for him. He is the one who cried Grace, Grace to Jesus. |
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The author of the Book of Revelation identifies himself as John (1:4, 9; 21:2; 22:8), a prophet (1:1�?; 22:6�?). He was familiar enough with his readers to call himself their "brother and companion in tribulation" (1:9). He indicates that he was exiled to the island of Patmos (1:9) off the west coast of Asia Minor (modern Turkey) and that on the "Lord’s Day" (Sunday) he was caught up "in the Spirit" (1:10) and saw the visions recorded in his book. An examination of the Greek language of the book of Revelation reveals that it has some strong similarities with the Gospel and Epistles of John, but also some striking stylistic differences. The author seems to think in Hebrew and write in Greek. As a whole, this evidence points to John the Apostle, who spent his latter years in Ephesus or on the island of Patmos. The earliest church tradition was unanimous in attributing the Book of Revelation to John. Although later voices have found problems with this identification, the apostle John remains the strongest candidate for authorship. The Book was probably written during the latter years of the reign of the Roman Emperor Domitian (a.d. 81�?6). 1. Canonical authority and authorship.—The inquiry as to the canonical authority of the Revelation resolves itself into a question of authorship. Was St. John the apostle and evangelist the writer of the Revelation? The evidence adduced in support of his being the author consists of (1) the assertions of the author, and (2) historical tradition. - (1) The author’s description of himself in the 1st and 22d chapters is certainly equivalent to an assertion that he is the apostle. He names himself simply John, without prefix or addition. He is also described as a servant of Christ, one who had borne testimony as an eye-witness of the word of God and of the testimony of Christ. He is in Patmos for the word of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ. He is also a fellow sufferer with those whom he addresses, and the authorized channel of the most direct and important communication that was ever made to the Seven Churches of Asia, of which churches John the apostle was at that time the spiritual governor and teacher. Lastly, the writer was a fellow servant of angels and a brother of prophets. All these marks are found united in the apostle John, and in him alone of all historical persons.
- (2) A long series of writers testify to St. John’s authorship: Justin Martyr (cir. 150 a.d.), Eusebius, Irenæus (a.d. 195), Clement of Alexandria (about 200), Tertullian (207), Origen (233). All the foregoing writers, testifying that the book came from an apostle, believed that it was a part of Holy Scripture. The book was admitted into the list of the Third Council of Carthage, a.d. 397.
2. Time and place of writing.—The date of the Revelation is given by the great majority of critics as a.d. 95�?7. Irenæus says: "It (i.e., the Revelation) was seen no very long time ago, but almost in our own generation, at the close of Domitian’s reign." Eusebius also records that, in the persecution under Domitian, John the apostle and evangelist was banished to the island Patmos for his testimony of the divine word. There is no mention in any writer of the first three centuries of any other time or place, and the style in which the messages to the Seven Churches are delivered rather suggests the notion that the book was written in Patmos. 3. Interpretation.—Modern interpreters are generally placed in three great divisions: - (a) The Historical or Continuous expositors, in whose opinion the Revelation is a progressive history of the fortunes of the Church from the first century to the end of time.
- (b) The Præterist expositors, who are of opinion that the Revelation has been almost or altogether fulfilled in the time which has passed since it was written; that it refers principally to the triumph of Christianity over Judaism and Paganism, signalized in the downfall of Jerusalem and of Rome.
- (c) The Futurist expositors, whose views show a strong reaction against some extravagances of the two preceding schools. They believe that the whole book, excepting perhaps the first three chapters, refers principally, if not exclusively, to events which are yet to come. Dr. Arnold, in his sermons "On the Interpretation of Prophecy," suggests that we should bear in mind that predictions have a lower historical sense as well as a higher spiritual sense; that there may be one or more than one typical, imperfect, historical fulfillment of the prophecy, in each of which the higher spiritual fulfillment is shadowed forth more or less distinctly.
Joie, Revelation was written by the Apostle John, not John the Baptist. Now, let sleeping dogs lie. |
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| | | From: joie | Sent: 9/22/2005 4:40 PM |
| The author of the Book of Revelation identifies himself as John (1:4, 9; 21:2; 22:8), a prophet (1:1�?; 22:6�?). He was familiar enough with his readers to call himself their "brother and companion in tribulation" (1:9). He indicates that he was exiled to the island of Patmos (1:9) off the west coast of Asia Minor (modern Turkey) and that on the "Lord’s Day" (Sunday) he was caught up "in the Spirit" (1:10) and saw the visions recorded in his book. An examination of the Greek language of the book of Revelation reveals that it has some strong similarities with the Gospel and Epistles of John, but also some striking stylistic differences. The author seems to think in Hebrew and write in Greek.
Robber, once again you went OUTSIDE the Word of God for you thoughts. You will NEVER find truth that way. But of course it is all you know how to do. You do not know how to find truth in the Book of Truth. The Lord's Day is SUNDAY??? Huh? Now where in the Scripture did you find that little tid bit? Shows you have no Scriptural understanding or studying at all. [You should do a study IN SCRIPTURE, on the Day of the Lord. I have several TRUE messages in here, in fact an entire thread, on that subject. but of course I know you do not wish to see that truth.] Now the very fact that Revelation was written by a PROPHET, as a PROPHETICAL Book PROVES it had to be John the BAPTIST. The WORD OF GOD states that the law and PROPHETS WERE UNTIL JOHN. Jesus himself said this....and....SINCE then the Kingdom of Heaven is preached. John the disciple was no PROPHET. He was an APOSTLE, preaching the kingdom of Heaven. And anyone who sees any similiarity between Revelation and John's books is surely IMAGINING STUFF. You are only going on the word of Catholic leaders who certainly had no truth. 'The author SEEMS to think in Hebrew and write in Greek?' What??? Now where on earth did that silly stuff come from? | I proved by the Scripture, not some Catholic leader, that John the Prophet, not John the Apostle and disciple, wrote Revelation. You have proven nothing except that you do not go to the Word of God for answers. 'let sleeping dogs lie'?????? what on earth is that supposed to mean? If you are trying to shut me up and allow your lies to prevail here, you are certainly wasting your time. I wrote the TRUTH OF GOD'S WORD.....AND THAT TRUTH WILL PREVAIL FOR ETERNITY........JUST BECAUSE YOU FOLKS WHO ONLY FOLLOW 'TRADITION' DO NOT LIKE IT, DOES NOT CHANGE IT. I wrote the truth and that stands. |
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The Lord's Day is SUNDAY??? Huh? Now where in the Scripture did you find that little tid bit? Shows you have no Scriptural understanding or studying at all. Jo, The "Lord's Day" is the first day of the week, Sunday. The "Lord's Day" is Christian Day of Worship: First day of the week, Sunday: - Mark 16:9 Matt. 28:1,5,6,9.
- John 20:19 [vs. 1,11-16.]
- John 20:26
- Acts 20:7
- 1 Cor. 16:2
- Rev. 1:10
The "Lord's Day" is the weekly festival of our Lord’s resurrection, and identified with "the first day of the week," or "Sunday," of every age of the Church. Scripture says very little concerning this day; but that little seems to indicate that the divinely-inspired apostles, by their practice and by their precepts, marked the first day of the week as a day for meeting together to bread bread, for communicating and receiving instruction, for laying up offerings in store for charitable purposes, for occupation in holy thought and prayer. The "Day of the Lord" and the "Lord's Day" are NOT the same event. The "Day of the Lord" is a special day at the end of time when God’s will and purpose for mankind and His world will be fulfilled. Many Bible students believe the Day of the Lord will be a long period of time rather than a single day—a period when Christ will reign throughout the world before He cleanses heaven and earth in preparation for the eternal state of all mankind. But others believe the Day of the Lord will be an instantaneous event when Christ will return to earth to claim His faithful believers while consigning unbelievers to eternal damnation. Amos 5:18�?0 is probably the earliest occurrence in Scripture of the phrase, "day of the Lord." According to Amos, that day would be a time of great darkness for any in rebellion against God, whether Jew or Gentile. The day would be a time of judgment (Is. 13:6, 9; Jer. 46:10), as well as restoration (Is. 14:1; Joel 2:28�?2; Zeph. 1:7, 14�?6; 1 Thess. 5:2; 2 Peter 3:10). Jo, I'm NOT Catholic! I am a "born-again" Christian. I believe the Bible as the Word of God, inerrant and without fault. I believe in the occupation of the Holy Spirit within the believer. Go to my place of worship and see the beliefs for yourself: www.treeoflifechurch.org/ Just because John calls himself a "prophet" does not mean that it is not the "apostle" who wrote the Book of Reveleation. The word "apostle" is sometimes used in the New Testament in a general sense of "messenger" or "one sent forth." For instance, when delegates of Christian communities were charged with conveying those churches�?contributions to a charitable fund, they were described by Paul as "messengers [apostles] of the churches" (2 Cor. 8:23). Jesus also used the word this way when He quoted the proverb, "A servant is not greater than his master, nor he who is sent [literally, "an apostle"] greater than he who sent him" (John 13:16). Jesus Himself is called "the Apostle . . . of our confession" (Heb. 3:1), a reference to His function as God’s special Messenger to the world. See? Even though Jesus was the Savior, Son of God, the Messiah, he was also called an "Apostle" as well (Heb 3:1). Prophets received their call or appointment directly from God. Some prophets, like Jeremiah or John the Baptist, were called before birth (Jer. 1:5; Luke 1:13�?6), but their privilege was not a birthright. Their authority came from God alone whose message they bore (Ex. 7:1). Prophets sometimes became quite dramatic and acted out their messages. Isaiah went naked and barefoot for three years (Is. 20:2�?). Ezekiel lay on his left side for 390 days and on his right side for 40 more (Ezek. 4:1�?). Zechariah broke two staffs (Zech. 11:7�?4). Making themselves a spectacle, prophets not only aroused curiosity but also invited the scorn of their peers (Jer. 11:21). Except for God’s call, prophets had no special qualifications. They appeared from all walks of life. They included sheepbreeders and farmers like Amos (Amos 7:14) and Elisha (1 Kin. 19:19) but also princes like Abraham (Gen. 23:6) and priests like Ezekiel (Ezek. 1:3). Even women and children became prophets (1 Sam. 3:19�?0; 2 Kin. 22:14). In rare circumstances, God used the hesitant or unruly to bear his message. Balaam prophesied (Num. 22:6�?4:24) the Lord’s message but was actually an enemy of God (2 Pet. 2:15�?6; Rev. 2:14). Saul certainly was not in fellowship with God when he prophesied (1 Sam. 10:23�?4). Some prophets were called for a lifetime. But sometimes prophets spoke briefly and no more (Num. 11:25�?6). In either case, a prophet spoke with the authority of the Holy Spirit (Num. 11:29; 24:4). One trait characterized them all: a faithful proclamation of God’s word and not their own (Jer. 23:16; Ezek. 13:2). Jesus�?reference to Himself as a prophet in John 12:49�?0 rests upon this standard of faithfully repeating God’s word to people. Many scholars deny that prophecy includes the prediction of future events. But fulfillment was, in fact, the test of a prophet’s genuineness (Deut. 18:20�?2). Whether prophets�?words were fulfilled within their lifetime or centuries later, they were filfilled to the letter (1 Kin. 13:3; 2 Kin. 23:15�?6). But regardless of the time of fulfillment, the prophets�?messages applied to their generation as well as to ours. The main role of the prophet was to bear God’s word for the purpose of teaching, reproving, correcting, and training in righteousness (2 Tim. 3:16). Whether warning of impending danger or disclosing God’s will to the people, they were similar in function to the modern preacher in the church. Prophets were referred to as messengers of the Lord (Is. 44:26; Hag. 1:13), servants of God (Amos 3:7), shepherds (Zech. 11:4, 7; Jer. 17:16), and watchmen (Is. 62:6). So far as their predictive powers are concerned, the Old Testament prophets find their New Testament counterpart in the writer of the Apocalypse; but in their general character, as specially illumined revealers of God’s will, their counterpart will rather be found, first in the great Prophet of the Church and his forerunner, John the Baptist, and next in all those persons who were endowed with the extraordinary gifts of the Spirit in the apostolic age, the speakers with tongues and the interpreters of tongues, the prophets and the discerners of spirits, the teachers and workers of miracles. 1 Cor. 12:10, 28. That predictive powers did occasionally exist in the New Testament prophets is proved by the case of Agabus, Acts 11:28, but this was not their characteristic. The prophets of the New Testament were supernaturally-illuminated expounders and preachers. Jesus was also called a "prophet" (Matthew 21:11, Luke 24:19) and He came after John the Baptist.Jesus had many, many names and there is no reason that John the Apostle could not be called an apostle, disciple, elder, bishop, teacher, rabbi, priest, prophet, etc. John the apostle was also a prophet. |
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The "Lord's Day" is the first day of the week, Sunday. The "Lord's Day" is Christian Day of Worship: First day of the week, Sunday: - Mark 16:9 Matt. 28:1,5,6,9.
- John 20:19 [vs. 1,11-16.]
- John 20:26
- Acts 20:7
- 1 Cor. 16:2
- Rev. 1:10
The "Lord's Day" is the weekly festival of our Lord’s resurrection, and identified with "the first day of the week," or "Sunday," of every age of the Church. Scripture says very little concerning this day; but that little seems to indicate that the divinely-inspired apostles, by their practice and by their precepts, marked the first day of the week as a day for meeting together to bread bread, for communicating and receiving instruction, for laying up offerings in store for charitable purposes, for occupation in holy thought and prayer. The "Day of the Lord" and the "Lord's Day" are NOT the same event. [GraveRobber]
You are sure saying a lots of stuff in this post which is NOT Scriptural. Now I checked every reference you gave, and not one of them said what you are saying. Not one of them Accredited Sunday with being the Lord's Day. Is this how all false doctrine gets carried to the winds? I am quite sure it is. People repeat, and repeat and repeat, until almost everyone is so indoctrinated that nothing can open their sealed minds. You all had better learn to go by what the word REALLY SAYS. quit surmissing. It will get you into trouble, spiritually. God hates for you to add even ONE Word to his Word. are you not afraid to put man's words ahead of God's Word? I sure am. Now the Word shows that the NT Church met together EVERY SINGLE DAY TO BREAK THE BREAD. They did this DAILY. In fact I have a message in here, on the Law board, called Daily. In this I gave many Scriptures proving they met every day. So which one of those days is the Lord's Day? Grace is the Lord's Day and it is every day. Sunday as a day of worship, came through the Catholics and they got it from idolatry. The Word of God does not even mention one time, this 'weekly festival' you mentioned. Where did you get that? I have never read it in the Word of God. Now all 1Cor. 16:2 said is to lay up the stuff they were sending to the Saints, to set it aside on the first day of the Week, that they were not busy gathering it after He arrived. How did you read weekly worship into this? It is not there. | And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you |
Now you gave the above verse. I ask, how in this world did you read Sunday worship and Lord's Day into that verse? Huh? I just don't get it. And you are equating the NT prophets with the OT prophets. They are vastly different. Their jobs were vastly different. Then what do you do with this: The law and prophets were UNTIL JOHN. Since then the kingdom of Heaven is preached. Jesus said that. Are you desputing with him? The OT prophets ended with John the Baptist. You have given no support at all to dispute that John the Baptist wrote Revelation. John the disciple was NO OT PROPHET. He could not have written Revelation. He was not sent to BARE WITNESS OF JESUS......JOHN THE BAPTIST WAS. I suggest you go READ THE MESSAGE. |
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| Freeborn, Concerning 1 Corinthians 16:1-2, I mentioned this verse only to make one point. Paul said, "Now, concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order to the churches of Galatia, even so do ye. Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come." (KJV) This verse is saying, "When you collect money for God’s people, I want you to do exactly what I told the churches in Galatia to do. That is, each Sunday each of you must put aside part of what you have earned. If you do this, you won’t have to take up a collection when I come." ~ Contemporary English Version The point is that they met each Sunday, the first day of the week. Look at a calender, what is the first day of the week? Acts 20:7, "And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight." (KJV) Again, this verse says that "the disciples came together to break bread" on "the first day of the week." This is Sunday. Freeborn, you said, "Now you gave the above verse. I ask, how in this world did you read Sunday worship and Lord's Day into that verse? Huh? I just don't get it." First lesson my friend, read the Scripture in context. Look at John 20:19, it says, "Then the same day at evening, being the first day of the week, when the doors were shut where the disciples were assembled for fear of the Jews, came Jesus and stood in the midst, and saith unto them, Peace be unto you." (KJV) See? The "first day of the week," Sunday, is when the disciples met. Again, in John 20:26, "And after eight days again his disciples were within, and Thomas with them: then came Jesus, the doors being shut, and stood in the midst, and said, Peace be unto you." (KJV) See? Eight days after the Jesus came to the disciples in John 20:19, Jesus appeared again to Thomas so he would believe in John 20:26. The point is, that the disciples met on Sunday, the first day of the week. Mark 16:9, "Now when Jesus was risen early the first day of the week, he appeared first to Mary Magdalene, out of whom he had cast seven devils." (KJV) Again, the first day of the week, Sunday is when Jesus fist appeared to Mary. The point is that the "first day of the week" is Sunday, "the weekly festival of our Lord’s resurrection." Do you see now; or are you still in the dark? Matthew 28:1, "In the end of the sabbath, as it began to dawn toward the first day of the week, came Mary Magdalene and the other Mary to see the sepulchre." (KJV) The Sabbath is on Saturday, Sunday is the "first day of the week." The Lord's Day is the first day of the week, or Sunday; the day especially associated with the Lord Jesus Christ. A special honor was reserved for Sunday, the first day of the week. This was the day on which Jesus was raised from the dead; every Lord’s Day, therefore, is a weekly memorial of Christ’s resurrection. Clearly the early church assembled for worship and religious instruction on Sunday, the Lord’s Day (1 Cor. 16:2). The Lord’s Day is not to be confused with the Sabbath, the Jewish day of rest. The Jewish Sabbath corresponds with our Saturday, the seventh or last day of the week. This special day to the Jews commemorated the day on which God rested after the creation of the world. The Lord’s Day is our Sunday, the first day of the week; it celebrates the resurrection of Jesus from the dead. Under the new dispensation of grace, Christians are not to be trapped by the old legalism of observing days and seasons. The Council; Jerusalem did not include a demand for Sabbath observance in its rules for Gentile Christians (Acts 15:20, 28�?9). Some members of the early church "esteemed every day alike"; they made no distinction between days, including Jewish festivals and Sabbaths and possibly also Sunday. The apostle Paul said they were not to be judged if they were acting in good conscience out of the fear of God. Some Jewish Christians continued to observe the Sabbath and Jewish festivals. Neither should they be judged for "esteeming one day above another," Paul declared, for their behavior was guided by conscience in the fear of God. Paul believed such observance was a matter of Christian liberty, so long as the convert did not regard the observance as necessary for salvation (Rom. 14:5�?; Gal. 4:10; Col. 2:16�?7). Paul’s principle of Christian liberty about holy places and holy days comes from the Lord Jesus Christ Himself. Jesus described Himself as one who is greater than the Temple (Matt. 12:6) and said, "The Son of Man is Lord even of the Sabbath" (Matt. 12:8; Luke 6:5). When accused by the Pharisees of breaking the Sabbath, Jesus replied, "The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath. Therefore the Son of Man is also Lord of the Sabbath" (Mark 2:27�?8). The phrase "the Lord’s Day" occurs only once in the New Testament, in Revelation 1:10, where John declared, "I was in the Spirit on the Lord’s Day." In Asia Minor, where the churches to which John wrote were situated, the pagans celebrated the first day of each month as the Emperor’s Day. Some scholars also believe that a day of the week was also called by this name. When the early Christians called the first day of the week the Lord’s Day, this was a direct challenge to the emperor worship to which John refers so often in the Book of Revelation. Such a bold and fearless testimony by the early Christians proclaimed that the Lord’s Day belonged to the Lord Jesus Christ and not the emperor Caesar. Still confused about Sunday being the "Lord's Day?" I have shown you many verses that clearly state that the disciples met on Sunday, and that Sunday is the first day of the week. Do you deny the Scripture? Freeborn, everything I stated is straight from the Scriptures. I do not add to God's word, the answers are in it, if you just look. |
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He was not sent to BARE WITNESS OF JESUS......JOHN THE BAPTIST WAS. Freeborn, The Old Testament prophets often pictured God either as bearing witness against Israel (Mic. 1:2) or as challenging Israel to bear witness against Him (Mic. 6:3). God is also seen in the Old Testament as witnessing covenants between individuals (Gen. 31:50) as well as covenants between Himself and the nation of Israel or individuals (Deut. 31:19�?6). In addition to these general uses, witness is also used in connection with the distinctively religious message of the Bible. God witnesses to the believer about His assurance of salvation: "The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God" (Rom. 8:16). The Bible also declares that God has not left Himself without witness (Acts 14:17). Witness to Christ is borne by the prophets (Acts 10:43), John the Baptist (John 1:7), the Father (John 5:37; 8:18), the works of Christ (John 5:36; 10:37�?8), and Christ Himself (John 8:18). The believer’s life and word also serve as a witness to the world. Sometimes this witness to the world is represented in the witness of the apostles, who are Christ’s special witnesses—witnesses of His resurrection (Acts 1:22; 2:32; 10:41; 13:31). However, the command to witness in Acts 1:8 is for all believers. It applies to the new Christian community the similar command that was given to ancient Israel (Is. 43:10, 12). The believer’s model in witness is none other than Christ Himself (1 Tim. 6:13; Rev. 1:5). Acts 1:8, "But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth." (KJV) Freeborn, as a believer and baptized in the Holy Spirit (Acts 11:16), I bare witness unto Jesus toward you. Does this make me a prophet? No, but I could be, but I don't claim to be. Let me explain. Of the sixteen OT prophets, four are usually called the great prophets, namely, Isaiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, and Daniel, and twelve the minor prophets, namely, Hosea, Joel, Amos, Obadiah, Jonah, Micah, Nahum, Habakkuk, Zephaniah, Haggai, Zechariah, and Malachi. They may be divided into four groups: the prophets of the northern kingdom—Hosea, Amos, Joel, Jonah; the prophets of the southern kingdom—Isaiah, Jeremiah, Obadiah, Micah, Nahum, Habakkuk, Zephaniah; the prophets of the captivity—Ezekiel and Daniel; the prophets of the return—Haggai, Zechariah, Malachi. They may be arranged in the following chronological order, namely, Joel, Jonah, Hosea, Amos, Isaiah, Micah, Nahum, Zephaniah, Habakkuk, Obadiah, Jeremiah, Ezekiel, Daniel, Haggai, Zechariah, Malachi. What then are the characteristics of the sixteen prophets thus called and commissioned, and intrusted with the messages of God to his people? -
They were the national poets of Judea. -
They were annalists and historians. A great portion of Isaiah, of Jeremiah, of Daniel, of Jonah, of Haggai, is direct or indirect history. -
They were preachers of patriotism—their patriotism being founded on the religious motive. -
They were preachers of morals and of spiritual religion. The system of morals put forward by the prophets, if not higher or sterner or purer than that of the law, is more plainly declared, and with greater, because now more neeeded, vehemence of diction. -
They were extraordinary but yet authorized exponents of the law. -
They held a pastoral or quasi-pastoral office. -
They were a political power in the state. -
But the prophets were something more than national poets and annalists, preachers of patriotism, moral teachers, exponents of the law, pastors and politicians. Their most essential characteristic is that they were instruments of revealing God’s will to man, as in other ways, so specially by predicting future events, and, in particular, by foretelling the incarnation of the Lord Jesus Christ and the redemption effected by him. We have a series of prophecies which are so applicable to the person and earthly life of Jesus Christ as to be thereby shown to have been designed to apply to him. And if they were designed to apply to him, prophetical prediction is proved. Objections have been urged. We notice only one, viz., vagueness. It has been said that the prophecies are too darkly and vaguely worded to be proved predictive by the events which they are alleged to foretell. But to this might be answered; -
That God never forces men to believe, but that there is such a union of definiteness and vagueness in the prophecies as to enable those who are willing to discover the truth, while the willfully blind are not forcibly constrained to see it. -
That, had the prophecies been couched in the form of direct declarations, their fulfillment would have thereby been rendered impossible, or at least capable of frustration. -
That the effect of prophecy would have been far less beneficial to believers, as being less adapted to keep them in a state of constant expectation. -
That the Messiah of revelation could not be so clearly portrayed in his varied character as God and man, as prophet, priest, and king, if he had been the mere "teacher." -
That the state of the prophets, at the time of receiving the divine revelation, was such as necessarily to make their predictions fragmentary, figurative, and abstracted from the relations of time. -
That some portions of the prophecies were intended to be of double application, and some portions to be understood only on their fulfillment. So far as their predictive powers are concerned, the Old Testament prophets find their New Testament counterpart in the writer of the Apocalypse; but in their general character, as specially illumined revealers of God’s will, their counterpart will rather be found, first in the great Prophet of the Church and his forerunner, John the Baptist, and next in all those persons who were endowed with the extraordinary gifts of the Spirit in the apostolic age, the speakers with tongues and the interpreters of tongues, the prophets and the discerners of spirits, the teachers and workers of miracles (1 Cor. 12:10, 28). That predictive powers did occasionally exist in the New Testament prophets is proved by the case of Agabus, (Acts 11:28), but this was not their characteristic. The prophets of the New Testament were supernaturally-illuminated expounders and preachers. There were more prophets than just John the Baptist and after him. I posted earlier that Jesus was called a prophet as well, after John. The Scriptures do NOT say that John the Baptist was the last prophet ever. In Matthew 11-15 it says, "And as they departed, Jesus began to say unto the multitudes concerning John, What went ye out into the wilderness to see? A reed shaken with the wind? 8But what went ye out for to see? A man clothed in soft raiment? behold, they that wear soft clothing are in kings�?houses. 9But what went ye out for to see? A prophet? yea, I say unto you, and more than a prophet. 10For this is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee. 11Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he. 12And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force. 13For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John. 14And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come. 15He that hath ears to hear, let him hear." (KJV) This does not say that John was the last prophet. Matthew 11:13 does NOT say this. It says all the Books of the Prophets and the Law of Moses told what was going to happen up to the time of John. John may have been the last of the OT prophets, but there would be more to come. Therefore, as this message says, John the Baptsist was NOT the last and never made to the island of Patmos, which is where the author of Revelation cliams to be writing the prophecy from. John the Baptists never wrote any scrolls used for Scripture. The Book of Revelation could never have been written by John the Baptist, it could have only been written by the one who bore witness of Jesus, John the Apostle. |
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| | | From: Isaiah | Sent: 9/25/2005 8:05 AM |
Acts 5:42---And DAILY in the temple, and in every house, they ceased not to teach and preach Jesus Christ. Now, there is the New Testament day to worship and keep holy; all of them. Now how many of you desire to follow the apostles and their example? There it is; do it every day. This is not any gobble-de-gook trying to explain this 'word' and that 'word'; explain away how the Scripture was translated: this is letting the Word say what is the true answer. This said they CEASED NOT TO TEACH AND PREACH EVERY DAY. When the new testament Christians looked into the truth and saw that God had changed everything from the 10% thing in the Old Testament, to 100% in the New Covenant, most of them backed out and decided to stay with the Old Covenant---to the lose of their own soul. Acts 4:32---And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart (all in agreement)---and of one soul: neither said any of them that aught of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common. v34---Neither was there any among them that lacked: FOR AS MANY AS WERE POSSESSORS OF LANDS OR HOUSES SOLD THEM, AND BROUGHT THE PRICES OF THE THINGS THAT WERE SOLD, AND LAID THEM DOWN AT THE APOSTLES' FEET: AND DISTRIBUTION WAS MADE UNTO EVERY MAN ACCORDING AS HE HAD NEED. Now, this is the New Testament way of giving: all; 100%. Who wants to follow the apostles? Who wants to go worship every day? Who wants to hear preaching every day? Where are you? Why do you cling to the O.T. Sabbath? Because you do not want New Testament ways. Neither Saturday nor Sunday satisfies God today: it is all or nothing. Now, for another Witness of this: Heb.3:13---But exhort one another DAILY, while it is called Today; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. Now, that is what happens to those of you who only want to do this one day a week: you become hardened through decietfulness of sin. Another witness: 11Cor.11:28--Beside those things that are without, that which cometh upon me DAILY, the care of all the churches. Now, this shows Paul was into church work every day. Acts 19:9---But when divers were hardened, and believed not, but spake evil of that way before the multitude, he (Paul)--departed from them, and separated the disciples, disputing DAILY in the school of one Tyrannun. v10---And this continued by the space of two years; so that all they which dwelt in Asia heard the word of the Lord Jesus, both Jews and Greeks. Now, this shows that Paul taught every day for two whole years. Acts 17:17--Therefore disputed he (Paul) in the synagogue with the Jews, and with the devout persons, and in the market daily with them that met with him. Now, here we find that Paul taught DAILY in the SYNAGOGUES, and then outside in the market DAILY. When he left the synagogues, he didn't stop; he kept teaching outside in the market place, DAILY. Now where are you? |
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Grave Robber, You are rambling on and on without saying anything concrete. You are saying many words to try and confuse this issue. Absolutely NOTHING you have said proves one thing you say. Now, while it is true that they met on the first day of the week, it is also true as Isaiah has shown, that they met EVERY DAY. This does not set one day up as any 'weekly festival'. Now you say you do not add to the Word. I submit to you that you have added many, many words in the things you say. This 'weekly festival' is ADDED JUNK to the word of God. It is NOT WRITTEN. If it is, please give me the verse. Now I will add some more to what Isaiah has already stated proving the early, and only true Church met every day. So did Jesus. Jesus was a prophet, but it was the FIRST NT PROPHET. All the NT prophets were different from the OT prophets. They never wrote prophecy. the Word does indeed declare John the Baptist to be the LAST OT PROPHET. HE HAD TO HAVE WRITTEN REVELATION, FOR IT WAS A PROPHETICAL BOOK. John was in the WILDERNESS until his showing to Israel. In that time, he wrote the revelation of Jesus Christ. When he baptized Jesus, he stated that God had ALREADY given him revelation of this one, and gave him a sign by which he would know when he met this one. Now: | Give us this day our DAILY bread. | [surely you know this means Spiritual Bread, not natural food. Else how could we fast?]
| In that same hour said Jesus to the multitudes, Are ye come out as against a thief with swords and staves for to take me? I sat DAILY with you teaching in the temple, and ye laid no hold on me. |
Now that verse proves Jesus was of the NT and taught DAILY in the temple. So even then that temple was open and had meetings every single day, not just Saturday and certainly not just Sunday. Do you want to follow Jesus' example and teaching? Then do it daily. quit proclaiming Sunday as a special Lord's day. The Word of God DOES NOT SAY THIS. YOU ADDED THIS. | I was DAILY with you in the temple teaching, and ye took me not: but the scriptures must be fulfilled. |
Again this is Jesus' words. He taught them DAILY in the temple. | And he said to them all, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross DAILY, and follow me. |
You must follow Jesus every single day. Not just Sunday or Saturday. that is law way. | And he taught DAILY in the temple. But the chief priests and the scribes and the chief of the people sought to destroy him, |
Another witness that Jesus taught every day in the temple. See, the apostles followed THIS example set by Jesus. Your 'church' is NOT following this example. They are following the heathen's way of one day a week. | When I was DAILY with you in the temple, ye stretched forth no hands against me: but this is your hour, and the power of darkness. | | And they, continuing DAILY with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart, |
Now Acts 2 proves the true Church followed the example of Jesus, they met every day, both in the temple and in each other's homes, studying the Word. | Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church DAILY such as should be saved. | | And a certain man lame from his mother's womb was carried, whom they laid DAILY at the gate of the temple which is called Beautiful, to ask alms of them that entered into the temple; | | And DAILY in the temple, and in every house, they ceased not to teach and preach Jesus Christ. |
Now there is more than enough witnesses to make this an established TRUTH OF GOD. They met together every day, in the temple and in every house, they were teaching and preaching Jesus Christ, DAILY. | And so were the churches established in the faith, and increased in number DAILY. | | These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures DAILY, whether those things were so. | | Therefore disputed he in the synagogue with the Jews, and with the devout persons, and in the market DAILY with them that met with him. |
Paul disputed = argured--daily with everyone. He argured every day for the truth. Yet everyone tries to tell me it is wrong to argue the Word. Then this puts Paul out of it. But he did this every day, not just the first day of Week. You have no proof of your doctrine. I have solidly proven this with many, many Scriptures. Bring forth even one Scripture saying Sunday is Lord's Day, or any special day, or any weekly festival. You are teaching false doctrine. So why do I need to follow any church which teaches lies to have salvation? And I do not know of one anywhere which does not set up one day as special, either Sunday or Saturday. What about Monday? Tuesday? Paul and Peter and Jesus did this every day, even Thrusday. and Friday. So where are you? Now for one more, to prove that even in the OT under law, they did this thing DAILY: | And every priest standeth DAILY ministering and offering oftentimes the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins: | | If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of DAILY food, |
| But exhort one another DAILY, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. | | Who needeth not DAILY, as those high priests, to offer up sacrifice, first for his own sins, and then for the people's: for this he did once, when he offered up himself. |
Now there is another proof that even in the OT, under law, they did their sacrifice, or worship every day........DAILY. Where is any proof of a special ONE DAY A WEEK THING? |
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You say John the Baptist wrote no scrolls or anything. I ask HOW DO YOU KNOW? WHERE IS ANY PROOF IN THE WORD OF THIS? You have done no studying of this, you are only repeating hand-me-down tradition. Now I submit to you that by the very words of Revelation, the one who wrote this book was sent by God to BARE RECORD OF JESUS. No disciple had this commission. John the Baptist did. He was ordained to do this even in the OT Scriptures. | And this is the record of John, when the Jews sent priests and Levites from Jerusalem to ask him, Who art thou? |
That is speaking of John the Baptist, not the disciple. They never sent to John the disciple seeking record. They sent to John the Baptist. John's one and only purpose was to show Jesus to the world. He was the one sent by God to do this. He was the one who had the REVELATION OF JESUS CHRIST. John even had a supernatural birth as did Jesus. He even had the Holy Ghost before birth. No one else is ever attributed to have this. Again I told you, an angel brought the revelation to the one who wrote that Book. They only did this to OT Prophets. Jesus himself taught the disciples and opened their understanding. You have no way around it. John the Baptist is the one and only one who could have written Revelation. You are following man's tradition instead of the Written Proof in God's Word. | The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to show unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: [SERVANT MEANS HE WAS AN OT PROPHET] | | Who bare record of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw. |
this bearing record is totally different from the WITNESSING DONE BY THE DISCIPLES. |
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Fine, OK, I have shown you Scripture after Scripture about this subject yet you still refuse to see because you are spiritually blinded. I will pray for you and ask God to show the truth (Jesus) to you. This "weekly festival" is another word for celebrating the Lord's Day, Sunday. In Matthew 7:6 Jesus said, "Give not that which is holy unto the dogs, neither cast ye your pearls before swine, lest they trample them under their feet, and turn again and rend you." (KJV) I have realized that you are the swine in this Scripture, because you have taken my pearls and trampled them under your feet. By doing this you dishonor Jesus and the LORD. My pearls are the treasures God has revealed to me in His Word. You deny His word and twist and manipulate it to fit your emotions and imagination. You live in a fantasy land of false revelations about God's Word. Therefore, you are unteachable and have not entered in the kingdom as a child. You are unteachable and stubborn. I have merely shown you God's Word for what it is, the truth! May God be with you. |
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| | | From: Isaiah | Sent: 9/25/2005 8:44 PM |
Acts 16:5---And so were the churches established in the faith, and increased in number DAILY. For it to increase in number daily, they would have had to getting together daily. Acts 2:47--Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church DAILY such as should be saved. v46--And they, continuing DAILY with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart. See they went to that temple daily Luke 19:47---And he (Jesus) taught DAILY in the temple.... Where do you get this one day a week stuff from? Better come up to the New Testament Find me one New Testament command to keep Saturday; find me one which commands me to keep Sunday. And while doing it, please explain why these in the Word kept seven days a week. |
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GR, you are like so many others......when you cannot prevail and tear down the truth God has shown to me, then you can't endure the battle any longer.....why? because you have no true aminution to fight or win with. Truth will win. It does not run in the battle. It is not afraid and it does not have to resort to insults to get out of the battle. I see not one thing you have proven with the Scripture. You are only deluding your own self. For instance this: This "weekly festival" is another word for celebrating the Lord's Day, Sunday. Now I ask you, show me one single Scripture which says this stuff. You know that it is not in the word. So you frustated because you cannot find what you say in the Word, and you can't persuade me with your 'much speaking'. Where does the word say 'celebrate the Lord's Day? Where does it say this is Sunday? I want to read that. I will only be persuaded by the Written Word of God. And I happen to know that God did not say any such thing. Even in the OT rituals, they had to do the thing DAILY. Those priests had to offer up sacrifices every morning and every evening. Did you not know that? There is not one single instance in the Word of God saying we need to worship one day a week. I challenge you and everyone else to show that to me in the Word of God. Seventh Day Adventist have so deceived this world with their silly mess about needing to 'go to church on Saturday'. I used to have many of them in this group. They told us many, many times we needed to keep that seventh day sabbath. So I began to ask them to show us how to do it according to the Word of God. I also did an extensive study into this thing myself. My findings were astounding, even to me. I have that series of messages on the Law/sabbath board. I found out they were forbidden by MOSES to even go out of their door on Saturday, or Sabbath. I found out they would be killed for just picking up a stick on that day. and many such things........when I asked them to tell us how they keep this day, they all, without exception, refused to answer this question, for they COULD NOT. Some of them told me they go fishing, others went mountain climbing. When I proved by the Word that all of this was FORBIDDEN, they were so frustrated, one of them asked me to just let it go. Now they 'claimed' that it was the PHARISEES who brought up all these things. I proved by the Word that it was MOSES. the Pharisees did not even exist back then. That Adventist church has deceived millions of people into thinking 'going to church' one day a week, and that day is Saturday, is keeping this Sabbath. It is a million miles away from truth. Going to church is not even mentioned in the Word. Not one Scripture either under that law, or in the Church, tells us we should 'go to church'. Show it to me if you can. Now the 'church' picked up on this lie of ONE DAY A WEEK STUFF. Only they picked up the pagan day of Sunday, which started with the worship of the sun god. What you all gonna do when the Word witnesses against you all, that God said this worship is a DAILY business under both covenants? The adventist scream loud and long that we must go to church on saturday.........I ask ....how we gonna do that and obey Moses,,,,,,who said do not go out your door on that day? Be killed if you do. Now who is teaching lies? Who is twisting the Word. You are frustrated because you cannot tear me away from my steadfastness in the Holy Truth of God's Word. Now , if you think you are right, and I am the swine.....show me one verse of Scripture. quote it..saying I need to go to church on sunday.....which is a weekly festival. Jesus DID NOT RISE ON SUNDAY. HE ROSE ON SATURDAY. I can prove that with the Word of God. Now where are you? |
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| From: joie (Original Message) | Sent: 12/5/2001 1:04 PM |  The book of Revelation is a prophetical book; therefore it had to have been written by a Prophet. Luke 16:16--The LAW and the PROPHETS were UNTIL JOHN: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it. Luke 7:28---For I say unto you, Among those that are born of women there is not a greater prophet than John the Baptist; but he that is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he. See, this is showing that prophets did not come into the era of the kingdom of God; the very least of us, are greater than the greatest prophet. There were no prophets, receiving the Word of God, since John the Baptist. Paul, and the other N.T. writters only wrote epistles; not prophet books. Revelation is the only prophet book in the N.T. Scriptures; therefore, it had to have been written by a prophet; of which John the Baptist was the last one. John 1:6---There was a man sent from God, whose name was John. v7--The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the LIGHT, that all men through him might believe. v8---He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light. Rev.1:1--The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to show unto his servants (prophets)--things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his SERVANT JOHN: v2--Who bare RECORD of the word of God, and of the testimony of Jesus Christ, and of all things that he saw. Now, bearing witness and bearing record means the same thing. So, John the Baptist is the one whom God sent to bare record, witness of Jesus, the Light. Another thing, after the resurrection, Jesus opened the understanding of all his disciples, including John, the disciple. Jesus taught these men himself. But, notice, that the John who wrote Revelation was taught by an angel. The angel of the Lord brought this Revelation to John the Baptist; for this is the way the prophets received the Word: God gave the Word to angels (whom He called gods)---then the angels delivered the Word to prophets. N.T. people do not receive the Word this way. We are taught by the Holy Ghost. He will lead you and guide you into all truth. John the disciple was taught by Jesus; not an angel. John the Baptist was the one who was sent to prepare the way for Jesus; he is the one who bare record of Jesus. He was the last O.T. prophet. Jo | | |
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