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DREAMS : 2 Dreams Jesus Interprets the Gospel of Judas
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 Message 1 of 3 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameCaringLeomoon  (Original Message)Sent: 3/6/2008 2:59 AM
In my thread called, The Gospel of Judas (thread 2) there is reference to 2 dreams in this extant scroll (written just around the time of the time of hte other gospels 2,000 years ago.
 
In the Gospel of Judas (found in the Egyptian area called Nag Hammadi, secreted away by the Gnostics at the time, along with many other scrolls of ancient texts.....in jars. Another big find, is the beautiful sayings of Jesus himself, called, "The Gospel of Thomas" a collection of Jesus Sayings......
 
You can see them here:
 
 
 
I'll post however on this thread, the 2 Dreams that our Lord Jesus, interpreted for Judas in the Gospel of Judas for study of the symbolism involved.
 
 


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 Message 2 of 3 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameCaringLeomoonSent: 3/6/2008 4:16 AM
From the newly released NYTimes Best Seller " Reading Judas" by Elaine Pagels and Karen L. King (who wrote the Gospel of Mary) or rather, she translated and interpreted it as ALL of these gospels are written in ancient Aramaic, then translated into Coptic (old egyptian text) and language of the ancient early Christians in Egypt.
 
Dream #1:    from the Gospel of Judas
 
page 136.
 
         The Gospel contains 2 Dreams, first by the Apostles (the 12) the 2nd by Judas. Both come to see Jesus to have their dreams interpreted.,and help them to understand the meaning of these dreams.
In both cases he uses the dreams to correct the false beliefs and practices of his disciples.
The dream of the "twelve" however, stands in contrast to the dream Judas will have for while the "Twelve" see only the violence and immorality of life in this world, Judas grasps a partial vision of the realm above.
 
In their dream, the twelve disciples see a "Great House" This is a temple the "house of God" before which sacrifices are offered, most likely understood to be in the Jewish temple in Jerusalem.
Twelve priests stand before the altar, receiving offerings from a crowd.
They also perceive a "name". The disciples are themselves in the dream among the crowd, devoted to the altar.
 
Jesus directs the disciples attention more closely to the priests (or the crowd) - a reading would fit well to say in the dialect, "the priests" but the meaning is not clear since it is the job of the priests to sacrifice.,although it is possible that the author of Judas, wants us to think the the crowd adopts the immoral behavior of it's leaders.
 
The disciples then tell him more about what they are doing. It is shocking.
They are sacrificing their own wives and children , engaging in illicit sex , slaughter and a "multidue of sins and injustices"
And yet the altars stay full!  Reader then learn the "name" that the apostles are invoking is the name of "Jesus".
 
Again, the disciples are upset and silent. Jesus condemns the priests, because they are using his name shamefully to plant "fruitless trees"
a charge closely resembling those that other Christians aimed at one another.
(see Peter, the Apocolypse of Peter (Gnostic) & Paul's letter to the Romans)
 
Now Jesus gives them the full interpretation of the dream.,equating the 12 with the priests at the altar and the offerings with people that they lead astray. All the immoral acts and evidence they witnessed in the dream result from worshipping the "lower" God who  uses Jesus's name to set himself up alsely as the true God.
It is this lower "God", who demands sacrifices but he is merely a "minister of error"
 
Jesus calls  upon his disciples to stop this behavior, to quit sacrificng themselves (as self-sacrifice was rampant during those days, with a promise of finding heaven)...note,
 
So he calls upon them to "Stop" sacrificing themselves & others to this false "god" who uses Jesus name to set himself up falsely to lead others astray, telling people that at the "ressurection" they will be "like the angels". - 
 
 
even as the Gospel of Luke said that Jesus taught that "those who are considered worthy of a place in that age and in the ressurection from the dead, cannot die anymore,because they are "like equal to angels".
 
Here, (in the Gospel of Judas) Jesus now teaches that if people do not stop this behavior at the end of days the true Lord of the  universe will put them all to shame.
The mention of the "end of days" is yet another insance wehre the author draws upon apocalyptic imagery and belief in God's final condemnation of the unrighteous.
 
This will happen "When the Stars complete everything" a reference to Jesus teaching about the "Heavenly Spheres" (which will become more clear later)
 
 
 
 
 
 
..................note: recall the LOKA, and recall the suggestions that
Edgar Cayce said it is true, that we spend, our "in between" lifetimes, in the "realms" of the planets, i.e. the wandering stars.......and that there are (according to Vedic teachings, ) Celestial beings, i.e. gods, on these realms.
 
you can read about the Loka, and the explanation of this on the Judas thread where I will attempt to explain what they all were saying, and correalating it to our known astrology.
 
 
 
 

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 Message 3 of 3 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameCaringLeomoonSent: 3/6/2008 11:43 PM
When Judas tells Jesus about his dream, the reader understand why he is so upset. He sees himself being stoned and persecuted by the twelve disciples. Like the Christians in the author's day (early days after Jesus death).; Judas is afraid. (of suffering & martyrdom)
 
But his vision doesn't end there. He sees imself ascending to the hevenly realm probably following "after Jesus".....There Judas sees a great house.
In contrast to the dream of "the twelve", he sees not an earthly building but the heavenly temple of hte true God above. No priests are offering sacrifices there; instead, it is described as a place of greenery surrounded by wise elders (in the Greek,it means large,great or old people)
This language is used as a title of respect for an elder.(note)
 
Here the elders appear to be distinguished members of the divine court standing before the heavenly temple of God.
This temple too, is filled with a crowd (presumably the great and holy race?) and Judas asks Jesus to let him join them.
 
...........................................................................................
Not only contrast but also the similarity between the two dreams (the two temples , the two  groups who lead, and the two crowds who worship at each) is deliberate  for this likeness points to the way in which everything in this world is but an inferior and misleading imitation of the true reality in the divine realm above....as Jesus will reveal to Judas beginning in Chapter 10. (continued in the Gospel of Judas part 2 thread).