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General : Lessons from the attack on Mumbai?
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 Message 1 of 10 in Discussion 
From: Noserose  (Original Message)Sent: 11/28/2008 9:00 PM

(CNN) -- Authorities were still fighting at least one gunmen at Mumbai's Taj Mahal Hotel, but other standoffs around the city, including ones at the Oberoi Hotel and a Jewish center, appeared at or near an end Friday.

Officials said at least 160 people have been killed in the violence and more than 300 injured.

But even with most of the fighting quelled after two days of gun battles, many questions remain. The following is what is known about the attacks:

Gunmen arrived by boats at the Mumbai waterfront near the Gateway of India monument on Wednesday night, police said. The gunmen hijacked cars, including a police van, and split into at least three groups to carry out the attacks, according to police.

One group headed toward the Cafe Leopold, a popular hangout for Western tourists, firing indiscriminately at passers-by on the street. The group then opened fire and lobbed grenades at the Chhatrapati Shivaji Terminus railway station, authorities said.

As police rushed to the scene of the attacks, gunmen attacked the Cama Hospital for women and infants. Several people were killed at the hospital, and a standoff there lasted until Thursday morning.
Two other groups attacked the Oberoi and Taj Mahal hotels, taking hostages there, police said. Police were reporting Friday that the standoff at the Oberoi was over and that the siege at the Chabad House was near an end.

 Gunmen took hostages at the Chabad House, where several Jewish families live, police said.

Police said gunmen fired indiscriminately from the Chabad House. Stray bullets killed a couple in their home and a 16-year-old boy who stepped outside, police said.

he Chabad-Lubavitch International group said Rabbi Gavriel Noach Holtzberg, 29, made a phone call to the Israeli Consulate to report gunmen in the house. "In the middle of the conversation the line went dead," the organization said. His wife, Rivka, 28, was also killed.

At the hotels, hostages or people who were trapped exited at various times Thursday and Friday. Commandos entered both hotels, trying to flush out militants and rescue others.
Early Friday, an Indian general told reporters that two or three gunmen, one of whom was wounded, remained inside the Taj hotel.

An undetermined number of nonmilitants remained inside the Taj on Friday morning, National Security Guards Director-General J.K. Dutt said. "There are some of them inside the rooms, and they are not prepared to open the doors," he said.

Fire brigades battled blazes at both hotels. By early Friday, it appeared what had been a major fire at the Oberoi had been extinguished.

By Friday night, 160 had been killed in the attacks, including at least 15 foreigner nationals, authorities said. These included three Germans, an Italian, an Australian and one Chinese among the at least 15 foreigners killed -- with a further 327 injured. . More than 300 people were wounded, including seven Britons, three Americans and two Australians.

The killed Americans have been identified as Alan Scherr, 58, and his daughter Naomi, 13, from Virginia died at the Oberoi. They were visiting India with a meditation group

Also among the dead were 16 police officers, two commandos and the chief of the Mumbai police anti-terror squad.
CNN-IBN, quoted police sources as saying there were about 26 gunmen.

http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/asiapcf/11/28/mumbai.investigation/index.html

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

{ There can be little doubt that the terrorists have succeeded in their plans and objectives. They have killed at least 160 people and terrified millions in the old colonial city of Bombay, India and informed the world of a new terrorist tactic....the invasion of a city. For those of us in the western world we are are left with the uneasy question. "When will it be our turn?"

Coming in at night by inflatable raft from a ship at sea the well trained and well equipped terrorists spread out and attacked the city from at least ten places. Murdering everybody in their path and terrifying the city for at least 48 hours.

How does one protect oneself from such an attack? Apparently the police responded quickly and with considerable bravery but were not as well armed or trained as the terrorists and were slaughtered wherever they met. At one time several of the attackers were driving around in a police vehicle shooting people on the streets as they drove by.

By the time the Indian military and specially trained anti-terrorist forces arrived on the scene over a hundred people were already dead and over two hundred injured. Over the next few day as the attacked area's are searched many more bodies are likely to be found.

If there is any lesson here for us it is that experts are always planning for the last war rather than future wars. The attacks of 9/11 were a one time shot and the changes made around the world make another such attack unlikely. The terrorists always seem a step ahead and find weaknesses in the protective shell we place around ourselves. We will now plan around this attack to see it can't happen here and while we are doing that they will be plotting new ways of attack that we haven't even thought about. We will be hearing from them again......but not in the way we think.

At the moment these savages that we think of as living in the middle ages or living in caves are out-thinking us. We have to beat them in the brain war before we can on the battlefield.

What do you think?}



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 Message 2 of 10 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameblueeyedpupilSent: 11/28/2008 11:10 PM
I have been following this since Wednesday. Its so hard to comprehend how it can still be going on. The idea of a terrorist attack being a seige is not at all the expected form of attack.
One cannot even hope to understand the horror in Mumbai.
 
For at least two days there have been reports of it ending in each location, and then explosions and gunfire erupt again.
 
I dont think i can yet absorb it all.

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 Message 3 of 10 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameblueeyedpupilSent: 11/29/2008 2:10 AM
more shooting and explosions in mumbai. They keep thinking its over and then it begins anew. shooting and explosions at the Taj, and new large fires have begun.

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 Message 4 of 10 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameblueeyedpupilSent: 11/29/2008 2:17 AM
large amounts of smoke and flames coming from many windows on many floors.

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 Message 5 of 10 in Discussion 
From: Jan53Sent: 11/29/2008 4:18 AM
an elderly Canadian couple were hostages at the hotel. They were rescued by commandos and are on their way home.
 
 

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 Message 6 of 10 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameOrientalgirl7777Sent: 11/29/2008 9:38 AM
Without hard evidence, Indian government is already pointing a finger at Pakistan but they should face the fact, it could be a homegrown muslim group.

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 Message 7 of 10 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameblueeyedpupilSent: 11/29/2008 12:56 PM
The seige is finally over.
 
Reports are now saying there were only 10 gunmen. Amazing.
 
Hotels are still being searched for victims, lets hope no more are found.

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 Message 8 of 10 in Discussion 
From: Old CootSent: 11/29/2008 6:47 PM
Rose, 20/20 hindsight is most always pretty good. No doubt poor intel will be blamed. I doubt that there is any way for any group/country to know everything all the time.

"what do you think?"

oc....

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 Message 9 of 10 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameOrientalgirl7777Sent: 12/1/2008 7:57 AM
 
 
 
India is in something of a state of shock after learning from official sources that its first Hindu terror cell may have carried out a series of deadly bombings that were initially blamed on militant Muslims. The revelation is forcing the country to consider some difficult questions.


At least 10 people have been arrested in connection with several bomb blasts in the Muslim-dominated town of Malegaon in the western state of Maharashtra in September, which left six people dead. But reports suggest that police believe the cell may also have carried out a number of previous attacks, including last year's notorious bombing of a cross-border train en route to Pakistan, which killed 68 people. Among the alleged members of the cell are a serving army officer and a Hindu monk.


Bomb attacks are not uncommon in India �?there has been a flurry in recent months �?but police usually blame them on Muslim extremists, often said to have links to militant groups based in either Pakistan or Bangladesh. As a result, the recent cracking of the alleged Hindu cell has forced India to face some difficult issues. A country that prides itself on purported religious and cultural toleration �?an ambition that in reality often falls short �?has been made to ask itself how this cell could operate for so long. India's military, which prides itself on its professionalism, has been forced to order an embarrassing inquiry.
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/world-news/india-uncovers-hindu-terror-group-that-carried-out-bombings-blamed-on-islamists-14076306.ht

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 Message 10 of 10 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameLodi-_Sent: 12/1/2008 3:27 PM
I know that it was going on for a few days before it completely stopped.  I couldn't believe it was always on CNN, why was that?
I didn't pay much attention to it.  I had so many other things to do, but I kept thinking bush is probably going to get in there and do something even if he said he wouldn't.  I also heard that it was Pakistan because the people of India had darker skin than anyone from Pakistan, that's when I started thinking who the hell cares what color someone's skin is.  I thought it was only some people in America that seemed to be so prejudice.  Looks like I'm wrong on that one, but I wonder if they were telling me the truth.
I would also like to thank all you people that gave me more information and knowledge on this situation.  I appreciate that.

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