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On This Day.... : Erwin Rommel
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Reply
 Message 1 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN Nickname-TinCan  (Original Message)Sent: 11/15/2008 10:04 PM
November 15, 1891, Field Marshal Erwin Rommel born.


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Reply
 Message 33 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknamejamestrdSent: 11/28/2008 1:49 AM
good question Flash, and to that ,I say, I dont know..
Not well versed on the Conflict there.
 
I dont believe this was learned there, but may have evolved as a result of it.

Reply
 Message 34 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFlashman191Sent: 11/28/2008 11:58 PM
They did use their earlier BT tanks there.
Image:AT rifle Type 97 1.JPG
 
Jap type 97 20 mm A/Tk gun. Hundreds were captured by the Soviets.
 
Just a diversion, not really realted to the thread.

Reply
 Message 35 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFlashman191Sent: 11/29/2008 12:14 AM

James I've pruned this  Google bit just to give you an idea of what happened and I'll leave a link at the the end.

 

I think my speculation #32 might be right.

 

Zhukov decided it was time to break the stalemate. He deployed approximately 50,000 Soviet and Mongolian troops of the 57th Special Corps to defend the east bank of the Khalkhyn Gol, then crossed the river on 20 August to attack the elite Japanese forces with three infantry divisions, massed artillery, a tank brigade, and the best planes of the Soviet Air Force. Once the Japanese were pinned down by the advance of the Soviet center units, the armoured units swept around the flanks and attacked the Japanese in the rear, cutting lines of communication, overcoming desperate Japanese counterattacks (one Japanese officer drew his sword and led an attack on foot against Soviet tanks),[15] and achieving a classic double envelopment. When the two wings of Zhukov's attack linked up at Nomonhan village on the 25th, the Japanese 23rd division was trapped.[16][5][17] On 26 August, a Japanese attack to relieve the 23rd division failed. On 27 August, the 23rd attempted to break out of the encirclement, but failed. When the surrounded forces refused to surrender, Zhukov wiped them out with artillery and air attacks. The battle ended 31 August with the complete destruction of the Japanese forces. Remaining Japanese units retreated to east of Nomonhan.

It was the first victory for the soon-to-be-famous Soviet general Georgy Zhukov, earning him the first of his four Hero of the Soviet Union awards. Zhukov himself was promoted and transferred west to the Kiev district. The battle experience gained by Zhukov was put to good use in December 1941 at the Battle of Moscow. Zhukov was able to use this experience to launch the first successful Soviet counteroffensive against the German invasion of 1941. Many units of the Siberian and other trans-Ural armies were part of this attack, and the decision to move the divisions from Siberia was aided by the Soviet masterspy Richard Sorge in Tokyo, who was able to alert the Soviet government that the Japanese were looking south and were unlikely to launch another attack against Siberia in the immediate future. A year after flinging the Germans back from the capital, Zhukov planned and executed the Red Army's offensive at the Battle of Stalingrad, using a technique very similar to Khalkin Gol, in which the Soviet forces held the enemy fixed in the center, built up a mass of force in the area undetected, and launched a pincer attack on the wings to trap the enemy army.

 

Battle of Khalkhin Gol - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia  

Clashes between Japanese and Soviet forces frequently occurred on the border of Manchuria. In 1939, Manchuria was a puppet state of Japan, ...

 

 


Reply
 Message 36 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknamemajorshrapnelSent: 11/29/2008 9:39 AM
James.... I can only refer you to Guderian's introduction to his autobiography and ask you to research JFC Fuller and Basil Liddle Hart.

Reply
 Message 37 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknamejamestrdSent: 11/29/2008 1:53 PM
Hi Major,
 
I have brushed up on it and  an aware of Fullers thoughts on tank warfare.
 
But my point was blitzkrieg was more than  usage of tank manuevers.and the role in can play in the defeat of an enemy..
 
it was a collaborative effort of troop, airstrike and tank manuevers.and more importantly, the germans introduced the radio to their tank columns so that they can work in unison..

Reply
 Message 38 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknamejamestrdSent: 11/29/2008 2:32 PM
Major,
 
Here is a  great Link on Guderian...note the last paragraph of it..
 
 
I can not copy anything from the link, so it will require you read through.
 
its fast and easy and  really sums it all up.
 
 

Reply
 Message 39 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknamejamestrdSent: 11/29/2008 2:49 PM
Interesting Flash.
 
I read the link, and yes, there may be some truth to your speculation, but still seems the tactic may have evolved as a result, but not truly the defense Zhukov came up with against the blitz..
 
as in anything, any defensive or offensive strategy usually results of battles past,and the results of it..
 
His defenseive plan, although simplistic by nature, really ended up being brilliant.
 
It was actually more successful due the the extended suply lines of the Germans and became an advantage.

Reply
 Message 40 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFlashman191Sent: 11/29/2008 6:58 PM
Well I was probably snatching at intellectual straws. I believe Zhukov ended his career in a constant state of fear as Stalin hated success. Not a fear shared by my Maths master.

Reply
 Message 41 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameMOREREPETESSent: 11/29/2008 10:19 PM
IT WAS FIRST USED IN THE FIRST WAR BY THE CANADIANS. CLOSE SUPPORT BY ARTILLERY AND PLANES. (STORM OR SHOCK TROOPS)

Reply
 Message 42 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknamejamestrdSent: 11/30/2008 5:43 AM
Nice try PBA,,
 
Shock troop  tactics were first used and implemented by the Germans... the Stosstrupen and was later conceived by the Brits, French etc..
 
 
this from Wiki... for more go here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shock_troops
 
[

Shock troops

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Jump to: navigation, search
World War I German Stormtroopers trench raiding.

Shock troops or assault troops are infantry formations and their supporting units, intended to lead an attack. Shock troop is a loose translation[1] of the German word Stoßtrupp. The units which contain assault troops are typically organized for mobility, with the intention that they will penetrate through enemy defenses and attack into the enemy's vulnerable rear areas.

Although the term shock troop became popular in the 20th century, the concept is not a new one, see for example the use by Napoleonic era armies of the Forlorn hope. Presently, the term is rarely used explicitly, as the strategic concepts behind it have become standard contemporary military thinking (see section After World War II).

Contents

[hide]
type=text/javascript> //<![CDATA[ if (window.showTocToggle) { var tocShowText = "show"; var tocHideText = "hide"; showTocToggle(); } //]]> </SCRIPT>

[edit] Before World War I

Grenadiers (French for "Grenademan") were originally specialized assault soldiers for siege operations, first established as a distinct role in the mid to late 17th century. Grenadiers were soldiers who would throw grenades and storm breaches, leading the forefront of such a breakthrough. Even when the original blackpowder grenade was abandoned the grenadier companies and regiments were retained as specialist assault troops.

During the American Civil War, 1861-65, the elite Iron Brigade and Irish Brigade of the Union's Army of the Potomac, and the Texas Brigade, Stonewall Brigade and the Louisiana Tigers of the Confederacy's Army of Northern Virginia were considered to be shock troops.[citation needed]

[edit] World War I

Main article: Stormtrooper

During World War I, in response to the deadlock of trench warfare faced by all combatants, the German army developed a new set of infantry tactics known as von Hutier tactics. The von Hutier tactics (infiltration tactics) called for special infantry assault units to be detached from the main lines and sent to infiltrate enemy lines, supported by shorter and sharper (than usual for WWI) artillery fire missions targeting both the enemy front and rear, bypassing and avoiding what enemy strongpoints they could, and engaging to their best advantage when and where they were forced to, leaving decisive engagement against bypassed units to following heavier infantry. The primary goal of these detached units was to infiltrate the enemy's lines and break his cohesiveness as much as possible. These formations became known as Stosstruppen, or shock troops, and the tactics which they pioneered would lay the basis of post-WWI infantry tactics, such as the development of fire teams.

Notwithstanding the postwar status of the Storm Troopers in German service, the same sort of tactical doctrine was widely espoused in British and French service in late 1917 and 1918, with variable results. The British Army standard training manual for platoon tactics, SS 143, was used from February 1917 onwards and contained much of what was standard for German shock troops. According to Ward, the Australian and Canadian divisions deployed amongst British forces in France quickly came to be regarded as the best shock troops in the Allied ranks due to their ferocity in battle, and were employed accordingly

However, the first successful use of this tactics in the battle take a place on Eastern front, in July 1917, applied by Czechoslovak legionaries in the Battle of Zborov. The success in battle resulted from special skills of legionaries, previously used mostly in reconnaissance actions.

 

Reply
 Message 43 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknamejamestrdSent: 11/30/2008 5:47 AM
This only  proves further my remarks and shiows that all the particiopants in WW1 recognized the necessity for mobil troops and warfare..
 
Although Fuller projected uses of the tank and  envisioned tank tactics and usage, it was Guderian who implemented and organized it.. He wrote the book on it.
 
But Blitzkrieg was created form the stale trenchwarfare of WW1 and all great minds and strategists of the time were instrumental in its development.

Reply
 Message 44 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknamejamestrdSent: 11/30/2008 6:28 AM
repete,,
 
although the Canucks were not the first to initiate shock troops or Blitzkrieg tactics, and hell, not much at all, I enclosed for you, a comprehensive list of Candian Firsts.
 
 
Enjoy:
 

Canadian Firsts

Things Canada did before anyone else...

Some people are blatently ignorant of Canadian firsts, so some of us here at CKA have taken it upon ourselves to spread the word about our "firsts". Let's start of with Canadian global firsts. Did you know that:

  • The first Thanksgiving was celebrated in Canada. In 1576 Martin Frobrisher and his English sailors gethered on a small island in what would later be the Canadian Arctic. They offered prayers and gave thanks for a hectic but safe voyage across the Atlantic. This was followed by a meal of salt beef, buscuits and peas. The very first Thanksgiving!

  • The world's first wireless message was received by G. Marconi in 1910 in St. John's (NF).

  • Canada is the first country in the world to propose an international treaty to ban the use of land mines, a cause later taken up by Princes Diana.

  • With the launching of ANIK A1 in 1972, Canada became the first country in the world to have a commercial geostationary communications satellite network.

  • The world's first park north of the Arctic Circle is Auyuittuq (NT). It is also Canada's newest park.

  • The world's first steam-driven Westminster clock is located in 'Gastown", a downtown Vancouver (BC) tourist shopping area.

  • Canada has the world's first fully-simulated Mars base. Located in northern Canada, the station was built to study equipment and strategies that would be used during a mission to the Red Planet. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flashline_Mars_Arctic_Research_Station

  • A Canadian was the first man in the world to create an artificial heart.

  • A Canadian was the first in the world to discover light-activated drugs.

  • Canada trained the worlds first female jet-fighter pilots.

  • Canada was the first to celebrate Labour Day.

 

 

And now for some Firsts in Canada...

  • Canada's first Train Robbery happened on September 10, 1904. One of the robbers was Bill Miner, a well known U.S. stage-coach amd train robber. He was later captured and jailed.

  • On February 23, 1909 J.A.D. McCurdy flew the "Silver Dart" off the ice of Baddeck Bay in Cape Breton, NS to become the pilot of the first controlled-power flight in Canada (only 5 years after the Wright brothers first flight).

  • In 1916 the first trans-Canada telephone call was placed between Vancouver, BC and Montreal, QC on a circuit running 6,763Km through Buffalo, Chicago, Omaha, Salt Lake City and Portland.

  • In 1921 Agnes Campbell Macphail was the first woman elected to the House of commons.

  • In 1922 Winifred Blair of St.John, NB became the first 'Miss Canada'.

  • Manzo Nagano became the first official Japanese immigrant (1877) to Canada.

  • Prospector, trader and HBC employee Michael Phillips was the first person to traverse the Crowsnest Pass in 1873.

  • In September 1910, in Victoria, BC, William Wallace Gibson became the first person in Canada to design, build and fly his own aircraft.

  • Canada's first Christmas tree was erected December 25, 1781 in Sorel, Quebec by German Baroness Riedesel. It was a German tradition to have a tree at Yuletide events, and it soon became a Canadian one as well.
  • Canada's first Christmas Carol was written in 1643 by Father Saint Jean de Brebeuf (1593-1649). Fr. Brebeuf is the Patron Saint of Canada. It is called "The Huron Carol" and was translated from the Huron Language.

  • On December 9, 1775 the first Post Office in Canada opened in Halifax, NS

  • The Endeavour Hydrothermal Vents site is Canada's first marine protected area. The Endeavour vents occur where the Juan de Fuca and Pacific tectonic plates meet 270 Km west of the southern tip of Vancouver Island. They are about 2,250 metres below the surface of the Pacific Ocean.

  • Quebec City (QC) is the first city in North America to be placed on UNESCO's World Heritage List - meaning it is designated as belonging to all humanity and to be preserved as such. It is also the only existing walled city in North America.

  • John (Jack) Gillis became the first man to walk across Canada when he arrived in Vancouver, BC in 1906.



Reply
 Message 45 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameMOREREPETESSent: 11/30/2008 6:42 AM

The task would fall to the Canadian Corps, commanded by Britain's Lieutenant-General Julian Byng. To prepare for the attack, the Corps trained in new tactics emphasized careful preparations and artillery support-meticulous rehearsal on carefully laid out mock-ups of the objectives, creeping artillery barrages with the assaulting troops following immediately behind the falling shells, and machines guns used in an indirect fire role (as with artillery employed in this fashion, the gunners did not see the targets but aimed by adjusting the elevation and line of fire of the gun calculated using ammunition firing tables). The creeping barrage had originally been introduced by the Canadians at Courcelette in September 1916. The organization and tactics of "storm troops" and trench raiding parties were developed by Victor Odlum in the 1st Canadian division in 1915. The Canadian Corps later instructed officers of the French army in these new tactics.


Reply
 Message 46 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameMOREREPETESSent: 11/30/2008 6:46 AM

I recently read an article about the upcoming movie, Passchendaele, which discusses Canadian involvement in World War I. In this article Canadian troops were referred to as Storm Troopers. I thought this was pretty cool, but I had never heard of our soldiers being referred to in this way previously. Time for some research.

From Captain J.B. Paulin in a speech given at the Empire Club of Canada, Toronto, Ontario, on May 23, 1918.

“The officer to whom I previously referred said, “There seems to be a fear back here in Canada that the Germans are going to make a frontal attack upon the Canadians, but the Canadians at the Front are afraid they won’t (laughter) and,�?he continued, “they will get the biggest reception they ever got and pay the biggest price�? and it is interesting to us to know that the only part of the line that the Canadians fought for so strenuously arid won which is still in the hands of the Allies, is that which is being held by the Canadians themselves. (Applause.) They are called “The storm troops of the British Empire�?by the Kaiser, and his own “storm troops�?are the biggest men of his various divisions; and when he speaks of the Canadians as being the “storm troops,�?it means that in his estimation, they are the best troops of the British Empire. I think the Kaiser has come more nearly to the truth there than he has ever done in anything else.�?/STRONG>


Reply
 Message 47 of 47 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameMOREREPETESSent: 11/30/2008 6:56 AM
There have been many key medical breakthroughs in Canada in the twentieth century which have been celebrated internationally as important contributions to the prevention and treatment of illnesses. Without a doubt, the most well-known Canadian medical discovery is the discovery of insulin in 1921-22 by Frederick Banting and Charles Best. Insulin saved lives and, although not a cure, remains the only effective treatment for diabetes even today. Other notable Canadian medical advances include Pablum and pediatric nutrition research from the Hospital for Sick Children in Toronto; the world's first mobile blood transfusion unit implemented by Canadian Norman Bethune in the battlefields of Spain and China; and neurosurgeon Wilder Penfield's "Montreal Procedure," a surgical treatment for epilepsy. These medical innovations, among others, altered the practice of medicine and offered improved treatment for the sick.

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