MSN Home  |  My MSN  |  Hotmail
Sign in to Windows Live ID Web Search:   
go to MSNGroups 
Free Forum Hosting
 
Important Announcement Important Announcement
The MSN Groups service will close in February 2009. You can move your group to Multiply, MSN’s partner for online groups. Learn More
Madeleine McCannContains "mature" content, but not necessarily adult.[email protected] 
  
What's New
  
  WELCOME  
  LATEST NEWS  
  PJ FINAL REPORT  
  Member Messages  
  ►►SITE MENU◄◄  
  ►► MESSAGES ?/A>  
  All Messages  
  General  
  Messages For Maddie  
  Madeleine  
  Off Topic  
  Breaking News  
  Pet Memorials  
  MEMBER WELCOME  
  MEET THE MANAGER  
  ►►SUMMARIES◄◄  
  ►►?MEDIA ◄◄?/A>  
  NEWSPAPERS  
  Telegraph  
  Newspaper Thread  
  MAY Reports  
  JUNE Reports  
  SUN BOARD  
  TIMES BOARD  
  Daily Mail  
  MIRROR BOARD  
  GUARDIAN BOARD  
  Deleted EXPRESS  
  News Archives  
  News Articles  
  TV Program Links  
  Transcripts  
  TV News  
  Video Links  
  JOURNALISM  
  News Sniffer  
  ►INVESTIGATION?/A>  
  Interviews  
  Suspicious  
  Re-enactment  
  Subliminal & Propaganda  
  Contrived Abduction  
  Facts  
  'Evidence'  
  Libel Threats  
  Lies  
  Quotes  
  Theories  
  Forged Photos?  
  McCann Travels  
  Timelines  
  FUND INFO  
  Fund  
  FUND INCOME / EXPENSES  
  Fund Compilation  
  FUNDRAISING  
  Fund 'Sources'  
  ►►►PEOPLE◄◄?/A>  
  Kate McCann  
  Key People  
  Clarence Mitchel  
  Government  
  Brian Kennedy  
  Jon Corner  
  Metodo 3  
  Photofit  
  People MISC  
  Witnesses  
  Family  
  Unknown People  
  Esther McVey  
  Pol. Judiciaria  
  Tapas 7  
  Backers  
  ►►►► INFO◄◄?/A>  
  Weather  
  The Law  
  Beachy  
  thentherewere4  
  Beachy Posts  
  AMBER ALERT  
  Information  
  M & E Children  
  Statistics  
  HUMAN BEHAVIOUR  
  Body Language  
  ►► CHAT ROOM?/A>  
  Chat User Guide  
  ►► OPINIONS◄◄  
  Coldwater  
  HiDeHo  
  Jon Gaunt  
  Comments to Note  
  Gerry's Blog  
  Personal Attack  
  Misc Blogs  
  bb2002  
  Tabs poem  
  ►►WEBSITES◄◄  
  mccannfiles.com  
  Website Links  
  ►►PICTURES◄◄  
  Pictures  
  Manager Graphics  
  Pics fo Posting  
  Photo Curiosity  
  Backgrounds  
  ►►FORUMS◄◄  
  Digital Spy  
  Websleuths  
  THE 3 ARGUIDOS  
  3A Thread Lists  
  3A at Brussels Conference  
  3A Smiles  
  3A Ref. Threads  
  3A Distributions  
  3A Leaflets  
  MIRROR FORUM  
  M F Threads  
  Memorable Posts  
  Great Posts  
  Lost Pages  
  ►E-MAIL ADDYS?/A>  
  ►►COMPUTER ◄◄  
  COMPUTER HELP  
  Computer Tips  
  HOW TO TIPS FOR 3A  
  3A How To Post  
  Avatars  
  ►►?GAMES◄◄?/A>  
  Brain Teasers  
  Time Wasters  
  Interesting Fact  
  Funnies  
  Points To Ponder  
  Nostalgia  
  Amateur Sleuth  
  For Skeptics  
  Estelle's Posts  
  Search  
  Priest  
  Remember Madeleine  
  Songs & Lyrics  
  'Source' Info  
  British Police  
  Sheree Dodds  
  PR & Spin  
  Trial  
  Your Web Page  
  3A Here To Stay  
  Documentaries  
  Diary  
  TEAM McCANN  
  Mgzne Interviews  
  TV INTERVIEWS  
  Robert Murat  
  Oprah  
  AMARAL'S BOOK  
  Fridge  
  McCanns History  
  McCann 'Defence'  
  Martin Brunt  
  Statements  
  Apologies  
  Investigate Fund  
  Statement Tables  
  MISC Web Pages  
  Millenium /Tapas  
  
  
  Tools  
 
M F Threads : The PJ knew all along (juxtapose)
Choose another message board
 
     
Reply
 Message 1 of 1 in Discussion 
From: MSN Nicknametin-lizzy  (Original Message)Sent: 2/23/2008 12:17 PM
The PJ knew all along
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next
   
  
Author Message
juxtapose
 
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 90
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:03 am    Post subject: The PJ knew all along   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
When they refused to answer questions it confirmed their belief.
The ridicule from the British media re-inforced their determination.
The political pressure only sufficed to disprove coruption in the PJ.
But most important of all they have one piece of gold, evidence that cannot be reputed.
This visit is to clarify secondary evidence.
Kate was the original loose canon, alas someone else took the mantle, and the beauty is its all on footage
 
Back to top      
 
 
roisin
 
Joined: 12 Sep 2007
Posts: 314
Location: seattle usa
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:05 am    Post subject: Re: The PJ knew all along   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
[quote="juxtapose"]
Kate was the original loose canon, alas someone else took the mantle, and the beauty is its all on footage[/quote]
What do you mean by that? Would you mind clarifying the last comment?
_________________
*** For you, Maddy ***
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRTyBDdNmvk
*** I never forgot about you ***
 
Back to top      
 
 
Estelle
 
Joined: 03 Oct 2007
Posts: 941
Location: Australia
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:08 am    Post subject: Re: The PJ knew all along   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
[quote="roisin"][quote="juxtapose"]
Kate was the original loose canon, alas someone else took the mantle, and the beauty is its all on footage[/quote]
What do you mean by that? Would you mind clarifying the last comment?[/quote]
xxxx
Who took the mantle?
_________________
I'm not pro-McCann or anti-McCann...
I'm pro Madeleine & want justice for her!!!
The McCanns have fooled us...perhaps they have made an accidental murder into a multi-million dollar business!!!
Don't bother to troll me. I'll report to Mods.
 
Back to top      
 
 
juxtapose
 
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 90
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:09 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
someone recently made video footage, however it does not match actual evidential footage
 
Back to top      
 
 
roisin
 
Joined: 12 Sep 2007
Posts: 314
Location: seattle usa
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:10 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
[quote="juxtapose"]someone recently made video footage, however it does not match actual evidential footage[/quote]
I'm willing to appear thick as a brick...
Video footage of what?
_________________
*** For you, Maddy ***
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRTyBDdNmvk
*** I never forgot about you ***
 
Back to top      
 
 
juxtapose
 
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 90
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:11 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
i cannot say anymore, please please try to work it out
 
Back to top      
 
 
scrafen
 
Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Posts: 1283
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:14 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
(1) someone else took the mantle, because kate was too weak...
(2) recently shot video footage from PDL is different than the PJs footage from May

 
Back to top      
 
 
matti
 
Joined: 16 Sep 2007
Posts: 474
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:14 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Do you mean the friend's footage that cropped up in Panorama ?
 
Back to top      
 
 
reperioverum
 
Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 2650
Location: In Villa DeFarge for the Trial
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:14 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Jon Corner??
_________________
Criminologist Moita Flores' opinion is that "the couple lied" and thus displayed "an indifference and omission concerning their children's destiny".
 
Back to top      
 
 
oldcrone
 
Joined: 10 Jun 2007
Posts: 2282
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:15 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
That's what I was thinking ... the Huelva trip footage?
_________________
Only cowards and the guilty run away.
GORDON BROWN - you just lost my vote in the next election.
BOYCOTT VIRGIN - don't let Branson give your money to child killer suspects.
 
Back to top      
 
 
juxtapose
 
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 90
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:18 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
no one close
Panaroma is one, the other is what not many know exists
 
Back to top      
 
 
scrafen
 
Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Posts: 1283
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:19 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
if there was anything (suspicious) in PANORAMA, what would help to solve the case, the Police/PJ could make this "evidential" - by confiscating Jon Corners video tapings 
 
Back to top      
 
 
oldcrone
 
Joined: 10 Jun 2007
Posts: 2282
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:19 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
CCTV footage at Ocean Club?
_________________
Only cowards and the guilty run away.
GORDON BROWN - you just lost my vote in the next election.
BOYCOTT VIRGIN - don't let Branson give your money to child killer suspects.
 
Back to top      
 
 
JillyComeLately
 
Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Posts: 284
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:19 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
.
Jane Tanner's interview? That's not Golden enough though, surely?
.
 
Back to top      
 
 
reperioverum
 
Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 2650
Location: In Villa DeFarge for the Trial
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:22 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Is the CCTV footage from OC that taken on 3rd May??
_________________
Criminologist Moita Flores' opinion is that "the couple lied" and thus displayed "an indifference and omission concerning their children's destiny".
 
Back to top      
 
 
Display posts from previous: All Posts1 Day7 Days2 Weeks1 Month3 Months6 Months1 Year Oldest FirstNewest First  
 
Goto page 1, 2, 3  Next 
Page 1 of 3

The PJ knew all along
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
   
       
Author Message
JillyComeLately
 
Joined: 15 Nov 2007
Posts: 284
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:26 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
.
Please don't tease. I'm going to wait until I hear there jhave been arrests.
.
 
Back to top      
 
 
juxtapose
 
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 89
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:28 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
let's see what the next few weeks brings, but a couple of you are going for gold
 
Back to top      
 
 
roisin
 
Joined: 12 Sep 2007
Posts: 314
Location: seattle usa
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:28 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
[quote="juxtapose"]i cannot say anymore, please please try to work it out[/quote]
CCTV footage of someone moving Maddy's body...
but can't work out who is "taking the mantle"...
Nobody is admitting anything.
The ONLY other thing I can think of is something about the Payne check on Kate in the afternoon, when Gerry asked him to leave the courts and check on her. Is Payne taking the mantle?
Duh.
_________________
*** For you, Maddy ***
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRTyBDdNmvk
*** I never forgot about you ***
 
Back to top      
 
 
juxtapose
 
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 89
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:33 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
last footage of madeleine is the bar on the beach, unless the cctv in the service station is her, though thought to be highly unlikely.
The footage none of us knows about is with the PJ, and does NOT show madeleine
 
Back to top      
 
 
roisin
 
Joined: 12 Sep 2007
Posts: 314
Location: seattle usa
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:36 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
[quote="juxtapose"]last footage of madeleine is the bar on the beach, unless the cctv in the service station is her, though thought to be highly unlikely.
The footage none of us knows about is with the PJ, and does NOT show madeleine[/quote]
OK. I hope that people who are much brighter than I am come to this thread and post some theories.
I think you may have inside knowledge and if so you have to be very, very careful!
For the life of me I can't work this one out.
_________________
*** For you, Maddy ***
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRTyBDdNmvk
*** I never forgot about you ***
 
Back to top      
 
 
PaminBigD
 
Joined: 23 Oct 2007
Posts: 41
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:36 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
I think they are allowing them to hang themselves, basically.
Jux, we have a case here that a retired cop has a missing wife, he keeps on going on camera even though he has legal counsel.
I think as long as the suspect is willing to talk, the police must just let them go at it. If the lawyers could get them to shut up, then the police would wrap up with what they have. Cops just getting more fuel for the fire (cheaper on tax payers I think).
 
Back to top      
 
 
reperioverum
 
Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 2650
Location: In Villa DeFarge for the Trial
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:37 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
[quote="juxtapose"]last footage of madeleine is the bar on the beach, unless the cctv in the service station is her, though thought to be highly unlikely.
The footage none of us knows about is with the PJ, and does NOT show madeleine[/quote]
===========================
Does this mean that Madeleine was not actually around when her parents claimed she was??
_________________
Criminologist Moita Flores' opinion is that "the couple lied" and thus displayed "an indifference and omission concerning their children's destiny".
 
Back to top      
 
 
matti
 
Joined: 16 Sep 2007
Posts: 474
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:37 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Would the kiddies' club have had a security camera ? Or a parent had a video camera ? Was Madeleine not there in the afternoon as claimed ?
 
Back to top      
 
 
juxtapose
 
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 89
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:37 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Roisin
your right
i dont want to say no more
i've left enough clues
 
Back to top      
 
 
juxtapose
 
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 89
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:40 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Matti
wrong track
 
Back to top      
 
 
reperioverum
 
Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 2650
Location: In Villa DeFarge for the Trial
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:42 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Would it be anything to do with a certain photograph??
_________________
Criminologist Moita Flores' opinion is that "the couple lied" and thus displayed "an indifference and omission concerning their children's destiny".
 
Back to top      
 
 
juxtapose
 
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 89
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:43 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Repor
your first answer too vague
last photo does not interset PJ
 
Back to top      
 
 
roisin
 
Joined: 12 Sep 2007
Posts: 314
Location: seattle usa
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:43 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
OK. I looked through a few earlier posts.
The PJ have cctv footage from the OC.
It disproves EVERY one of the timelines given by the Tapas 9.
I find this very heartening, without knowing anything more.
Justice for Madeleine McCann / support and respect for the PJ!
_________________
*** For you, Maddy ***
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRTyBDdNmvk
*** I never forgot about you ***
 
Back to top      
 
 
scrafen
 
Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Posts: 1283
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:43 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
then maybe this footage is the one PJ took when they did the crime reconstruction ?
...then they found something special - what should have been seen, comparing the witness statements with it ?
 
Back to top      
 
 
gangapants
 
Joined: 08 Sep 2007
Posts: 69
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:44 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
if david payne went to see if kate and the kids were ok in the AFTERNOON then ergo the kids werent at the creche in the afternoon and the CCTV from the creche might show the children who were there coming and going but NO SIGN of the mccann kids or madeleine coming or going
in addition or as an alternative cctv footage from around the resort may show the mccanns in a car (a hire car or a friends car or indeed ANY car or even on foot with the buggy with the LARGE all encompassing hood/cover leaving their apartment and/or returning at a time when the mccannas claimed gerry was playing tennis and kate was home alone wth the kids in possible body disposal operations
or again cctv footage may show a friend coming or going to the mccanns apartment for body disposal etc in the afternoon/early evening
 
Back to top      
 
 
Display posts from previous: All Posts1 Day7 Days2 Weeks1 Month3 Months6 Months1 Year Oldest FirstNewest First 
 
       Forum Index -> The hunt for Maddy All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next 
Page 2 of 3
 
The PJ knew all along
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3
  
       Forum Index -> The hunt for Maddy
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
juxtapose
 
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 89
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:45 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
People in seattle USA are shrewd
good night
 
Back to top      
 
 
reperioverum
 
Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 2649
Location: In Villa DeFarge for the Trial
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:45 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
If the footage does NOT show Madeleine then either it shows that she was not somewhere where her parents said she was, or it is showing somebody else doing something that they should not have been doing.
_________________
Criminologist Moita Flores' opinion is that "the couple lied" and thus displayed "an indifference and omission concerning their children's destiny".
 
Back to top      
 
 
gangapants
 
Joined: 08 Sep 2007
Posts: 69
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:49 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
also another thought from the thread title if the PJ knew all along (maybe the stand alone evidence not necessarily forensic) it may well be something simple such as showing someone on CCTV doing something they shouldnt or destroying their alibi etc for a certain time
 
Back to top      
 
 
matti
 
Joined: 16 Sep 2007
Posts: 474
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:52 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Fait beaux rêves juxtapose et merci
 
Back to top      
 
 
scrafen
 
Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Posts: 1282
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:52 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
so...
-- some of tapas 9 could have claimed "we went on may 3rd to this and that place" - and then must have passed cctv ---> what can be proved now, they are not shown
(maybe because - the pj's reconstruction of all tapas 9 statements showed there must have been footage of someone...)
OR
-- there indeed WAS footage of a tapas 9 when s/he claimed not having been there on may 3rd...
 
Back to top      
 
 
PaminBigD
 
Joined: 23 Oct 2007
Posts: 41
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:55 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
goodnight to you Jux.
thank you,
 
Back to top      
 
 
scrafen
 
Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Posts: 1282
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:55 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
AND.... the other OPs point RE someone "took the mantle for kate"...
WHO - of the tapas 7 actually took a "mantle" ?
-- payne
-- jane tanner
then most likely jane tanner was chosen to take this "mantle", what is the abductor statement, because she seemed to be more "reliable" as a witness ?
 
Back to top      
 
 
reperioverum
 
Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 2649
Location: In Villa DeFarge for the Trial
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:57 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
[quote="scrafen"]AND.... the other OPs point RE someone "took the mantle for kate"...
WHO - of the tapas 7 actually took a "mantle" ?
-- payne
-- jane tanner
then most likely jane tanner was chosen to take this "mantle", what is the abductor statement, because she seemed to be more "reliable" as a witness ?[/quote]
===========================================================
Was Kate supposed to have "seen" bundleman??
_________________
Criminologist Moita Flores' opinion is that "the couple lied" and thus displayed "an indifference and omission concerning their children's destiny".
 
Back to top      
 
 
juxtapose
 
Joined: 15 Oct 2007
Posts: 89
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:58 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
ganga.. on the right track
This is not gold evidence, just an aside
Look at the pics/video of Kate on the morning of 4th May, been up all night looking for her daughter, an abductor has allegedly taken her, and moved cuddle cat. Her earlier statements say the abductor had clearly moved cuddle cat. So what was she doing holding cuddle cat in that very first press release? Footage there for all to see. Secondly, why would a mother who has just had a child allegedly abducted, take time to change her ear rings the next day?
This has nothing to do with the gem that the PJ have
 
Back to top      
 
 
scrafen
 
Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Posts: 1282
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 3:59 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
@repioverum
cant imagine that kate was supposed to see bundleman...
but maybe they had to change their initial plan, how to "present" the abduction, due to kate... 
 
Back to top      
 
 
scrafen
 
Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Posts: 1282
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 4:02 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
...to continue with my previous post...
...maybe kate was by the evening simply too drunk and so must have been ripped off the "abduction" plan staging on short notice

 
Back to top      
 
 
Display posts from previous: All Posts1 Day7 Days2 Weeks1 Month3 Months6 Months1 Year Oldest FirstNewest First 
 
       Forum Index -> The hunt for Maddy All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 
Page 3 of 3
 
 
Joined: 15 Jun 2007
Posts: 2650
Location: In Villa DeFarge for the Trial
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 4:03 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
[quote="scrafen"]@repioverum
cant imagine that kate was supposed to see bundleman...
but maybe they had to change their initial plan, how to "present" the abduction, due to kate... [/quote]
=================================
I think that Jeremy Wilkins appearing when he did threw a real spanner in the works...
_________________
Criminologist Moita Flores' opinion is that "the couple lied" and thus displayed "an indifference and omission concerning their children's destiny".
 
Back to top      
 
 
scrafen
 
Joined: 01 Oct 2007
Posts: 1283
 Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 4:07 am    Post subject:    
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
@reperioverum
yep, jeremy wilkins disturbed the plan very badly...
...this would explain jane tanners (late) statement, because it was needed to support an abduction, which was quickly discarded as no "evidence" (of jemmying shutters...)
but - what did the OP mean by "taking the mantle" for kate, because being the "loose canon" ?
 


First  Previous  No Replies  Next  Last