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Transcripts : TR Anderson Cooper Sept 7 2009
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From: MSN Nicknametin-lizzy  (Original Message)Sent: 1/24/2009 6:05 AM
sept 7
 
Our other big story tonight is the international mystery of what happened to a young girl, Madeleine McCann. She's now 4 years old, but was 3 when she disappeared on a family vacation in Portugal back in May. Her parents say she was kidnapped.

Tonight, a major break: Police are focusing their attention on two suspects. Madeleine's mom and dad.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KAYE (voice-over): Whistles and boos greeted Kate McCann as she entered a Portuguese police station for a second straight day of questioning. Her husband, Gerry, followed a short time later for his latest official interview.

Tonight, we can confirm both are no longer witnesses in the disappearance of their daughter, Madeleine. They are suspects. It is a stunning turn of events in a mystery that has made headlines around the world.

According to a family spokeswoman, police found traces of Madeleine's blood on a car the family rented more than three weeks after the toddler was reported missing. There's more.

Gerry's sister delivered a bombshell of her own, claiming Kate was offered a plea deal.

PHILOMENA MCCANN, AUNT OF MADELEINE MCCANN: Part of it is that they're trying to get Kate to admit to having accidentally killed Madeleine and disposed of her body, hidden and disposed of her body, which is complete nonsense, has no factual basis whatsoever.

KAYE: In exchange for pleading guilty, McCann's family says Kate would serve two years or less in prison. Kate and Gerry have not been charged with any crime and maintain their innocence.

The allegations have shocked Kate's mother, who says her daughter is being framed.

SUSAN HEALY, MOTHER OF KATE MCCANN: She knows perfectly well that, if this evidence exists, then it is proof that there is somebody inside out of the police department or who's had access to their apartment and their belongings and who's -- who's planted this evidence.

KAYE: Kate and her husband, Gerry, have never wavered from their assertion that Madeleine was kidnapped.

The British couple, who are both doctors, took Madeleine and her two-year-old twin sister and brother on a vacation to a resort in Portugal.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Gerry, we're on holiday.

KAYE: On the night of May 3, they said they left the children sleeping in one bed to have dinner at a poolside tapis restaurant about 300 feet away. When they returned, Kate checked on the children to find Madeleine gone, with the window open.

KATE MCCANN, MOTHER OF MADELEINE MCCANN: Please, please, please do not hurt her. Please don't scare her. Please tell us where to find her.

KAYE: Police searched the resort and surrounding area. They followed numerous leads. One British national who was staying near the hotel was named a suspect. But no charges have been filed against him.

The McCanns' pleas for help have led to press conferences across Europe. They have also traveled to the U.S., and had a private meeting with the pope. The case has also attracted a celebrity following.

DAVID BECKHAM, PROFESSIONAL SOCCER PLAYER: If you have seen this little girl, please, could you go to your local authorities or police and give any information that you have?

KAYE: All along, the McCanns have never been under a cloud of suspicion, until now.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAYE: And now, for more on the investigation and why the police believe Kate and Gerry McCann are suspects, let's go to CNN's Paula Hancocks, live in Portugal. Paula, where -- where do things stand right now? We heard some of the -- the booing of -- of this family as they approached the police station earlier today. Has public sentiment turned against this couple?

PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it certainly seemed that way, yes, Randi.

As we watched both of them walk in, there was whistling; there was jeering. But there were also some British holiday-makers who were down here. And they were shouting out, "We're with you; we believe you, Kate," things like that.

So, there was a real mixed opinion out on the streets. But, certainly, it is absolutely astonishing how much can change in this case in just one day.

Twenty-four hours ago, Kate and Gerry being McCann were two parents who millions of people felt sorry for, as they do with other people, other parents in similar situations. The police had consistently said they were witnesses, not suspects.

And, then, so quickly, they walked into this police station behind me in Portimao, this very small little town inside Portugal, this morning as witnesses, and walked out as formal suspects.

KAYE: It's come out in your reporting that this little girl's blood was found in a car that the McCanns rented, that her parents rented 25 days after reporting their daughter was missing. Does that in any way seem to suggest that she was actually alive 25 days later?

HANCOCKS: Well, this is really intriguing. And this is where we really don't know at this point.

The Portuguese police are not obliged to give out their evidence. They wouldn't even have given most of their evidence to Kate and Gerry McCann, even though they are officially suspects at this point.

So, the crux of it is, how good is that evidence? How strong is it? How significant is it? Certainly, the Portuguese police seem to think that it is strong enough to be able to say the mother and the father of this missing girl are under suspicion. So, certainly, that is something that the Portuguese police will be talking to both of them over the next few days.

KAYE: Also being reported is that the police have offered Kate McCann a deal, maybe a few years in jail, if she actually admits to accidentally killing her daughter. Is there a feeling there that they won't get a conviction without a confession?

HANCOCKS: Well, that was really interesting, when that came out. That was Gerry McCann's sister that actually said that, that she could get maybe two years, possibly even one year, if she did say it was an accidental killing.

Now, certainly, I think in many countries, if you do try and broker a deal, then you can get a reduced sentence. But the fact is, the McCanns were furious about this. They are protesting their innocence. They are insulted by this. And they're also saying that -- that Kate McCann was saying earlier that it is utterly ludicrous.

KAYE: All right.

Paula Hancocks, for us live tonight in Portugal, thank you.

And we do hope to talk to this little girl's aunt -- coming up right after the break.

Up next, hear what John Walsh of "America's Most Wanted" has to say about the case and the parents.

Also tonight, these stories:

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KAYE (voice-over): See what Rudy's saying about the latest bin Laden tape.

Hear that cold-cash congressman's latest answer to his money- found-in-the-freezer problem.

And is another Republican getting ready to run for president?

That and more -- tonight in "Raw Politics."

Later, she was born into a life of inferiority and abuse.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was like marching to the guillotine.

KAYE: Inferiority, abuse and the polygamist prophet, Warren Jeffs.

WARREN JEFFS, POLYGAMIST LEADER: Dear wives, realizing happiness is only in being a part and a strength to your husband.

KAYE: See how she escaped, but also how it haunts her to this day -- 360 tonight.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KAYE: A moment ago you heard Madeleine's aunt, Philomena McCann, who says Kate was offered a plea deal if she confessed to killing her daughter.

Philomena had much more to tell me earlier in a phone interview from Scotland. We spoke just before Gerry McCann was named a suspect.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KAYE: Philomena, you have spoken to the family. And you have said that Portuguese police are trying to cut a deal with Madeleine's mom, Kate, asking her to actually confess that Madeleine died accidentally.

Can you tell us a little bit more about this?

P. MCCANN: Well, that's basically it in a nutshell. They're desperate to close up the case.

Gerry and Kate have presented a huge problem for them. And they're trying their best to really undermine their credibility in the eyes of the world. Kate and Gerry have been under intense scrutiny for months. There is no possibility that Kate could have had anything to do with this. And, yet, they're insisting that she had accidentally murdered her own daughter, and then went out with friends, had a congenial evening, sitting, having her dinner, and then come back to find her, and,during all that time, she knew she had murdered her?

It is just absurd to...

(CROSSTALK)

P. MCCANN: ... something that.

KAYE: Have the police said how or why they believe that she would have done this?

P. MCCANN: There's some inference about DNA samples on Kate's clothes and the use of a sniffer dog detecting Madeleine on Kate. Well, what could be more normal for a mother to have traces of her daughter on her clothing?

KAYE: And what has the family's reaction been to this? Has Kate given any indication as to whether or not she would actually consider this plea deal to put an end to this?

P. MCCANN: Under no circumstances will Kate ever consider a plea bargain for her daughter, knowing she's completely innocent.

And, as soon as she would do something as silly as that, her daughter would no longer be searched for. At the end of the day, Kate and Gerry's one goal is to find Madeleine.

KAYE: How is the family doing? Kate has been questioned for some 16 hours over the last couple of days. Gerry was questioned today. What has this been like for them, just briefly?

P. MCCANN: It's been incredibly exhausting for them. And it -- it has sapped their morale in the most horrendous way, but mostly because they have taken that hope that they are out there looking for Madeleine away.

But, you know, by putting Kate up as a scapegoat, we have lost faith in them.

KAYE: How do you believe, though, the Portuguese police are doing, in terms of how they're handling this case?

P. MCCANN: I think they're handling it extremely badly.

They have inept from the day one. From when Gerry phoned them and asked them to come, his daughter was missing, someone had taken her, they didn't believe them. For two days, they were saying that their daughter had wandered off. They never closed the borders for 13 hours. It has just been one incompetence after another.

KAYE: Do you expect that Kate will be charged in this case? Right now, she's reportedly a suspect, but what about charges?

P. MCCANN: No, I don't -- I don't believe they will charge her. I believe that the -- the police have fluffed up the evidence to make it seem more important than what it actually is, and they're just trying to get any closure on this, because Kate and Gerry have made the Portuguese police work so hard over this. And they want them out of Portugal and this resolved, so that their tourism industry picks up.

KAYE: All right, Philomena McCann, we're going to have to leave it there, Madeleine McCann's aunt.

Thank you so much for your time. And we wish your family, of course, the best of luck in this situation.

P. MCCANN: Thank you very much.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAYE: You heard some of it right there. Supporters of the couple are stunned at the allegations.

But what does John Walsh think about it?

CNN's Tom Foreman spoke earlier with the host of "America's Most Wanted."

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: John, what do you make of these latest developments in this case?

JOHN WALSH, HOST, "AMERICA'S MOST WANTED": Well, I hope the media doesn't rush to judgment here. This is a normal consequence, to look at the family, to look at them closely.

And the Portuguese police have never dealt with a case of a missing child. They just don't have the experience. They have made a ton of mistakes, and there's been worldwide scrutiny on them. I'm not saying there's not a possibility of the family being involved.

But this family has been all over the world. They met with the pope. They have celebrities in England. The father came to the America -- came to America to go to the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children. That's not the normal behavior.

If you remember Susan Smith, who killed her two boys and said that it was a -- an African-American carjacker, she and several other cases I have worked on, they don't come to the media after two or three days. They don't keep this relentless search going.

So, there needs to be a parallel investigation ongoing. Look at the family. Re-interview the family, yes, but don't eliminate the possibility it could have been a predator that took this little girl.

FOREMAN: Isn't it a natural thing, though, John, right away to look at parents? Because, statistically, parents kill children more than other people.

WALSH: Oh, absolutely. The parents have to be eliminated.

But this police agency never had any experience. It's a small police agency in Portugal in a little resort town. They should have called in Scotland Yard. They should have brought in other consultants to help them with this case, but huge mistakes were made.

And I still say this -- this is what happened in the JonBenet Ramsey case, where the police just totally focused in on the Ramseys, and never, ever pursued a parallel investigation.

I have done many, many cases on "America's Most Wanted" where the parents were suspects, and, years later, it was proven they had nothing to do with the abduction of their child. I say, don't rush to judgment.

And Portuguese law says that this police agency, or any police agency in Portugal, can't talk to the -- to the media without going to jail. They have got huge scrutiny on them. This is -- this is not unusual, for a small agency to say, "Well, we're going to go back and look at the parents; they're the focus of our investigation," when they have made huge mistakes in the beginning.

I -- I say we shouldn't rush to judgment here.

FOREMAN: Even if we're not rushing to judgment, though, John, how much do we have to take seriously the notion that -- that there's now this notion of blood evidence in this car that would possibly link them?

WALSH: Well, let the police or somebody clarify that. This speculation, innuendo is almost like a tabloid feeding frenzy.

Let them tell us. Is it human blood? Is it blood that has DNA related to the mother and father? Or is it a guy that got a nose bleed in a rental car? I mean, I don't get...

FOREMAN: Well, I know one of the issues, John, always seems to be that, with parents, we're always around our children when they do have nosebleeds and they have scrapes and cuts. And I know, in many cases like this, that's one of the issues, isn't it? A family's DNA is very much mixed up.

(CROSSTALK)

WALSH: Absolutely.

Let's -- let's say that the McCann family had nothing to do with this, and it was a sexual predator that took this little girl and killed her and buried her in the roadside. And the whole focus of this investigation, for the police to cover their butt or for the -- to get the media off their back, they refocus in on the family.

And the law in Portugal is, now that the McCanns, the mother, is named a suspect, she can get a lawyer and look deeper into what the police are doing. We -- the jury is not out yet.

FOREMAN: John, it seems like, in this case, like so many others like it, even though they are rare, gosh, right now, it looks like this could very well turn into one of those enduring mysteries, where we never get an answer. Is that your suspicion?

WALSH: Oh, I -- I hope not. I really pray, because some things come to light years and years later.

We did a case on "America's Most Wanted" where a family in Rochester, New York, were the total focus of the investigation, and, nine years later, after they were divorced, after they were both in psychiatric counseling, a pedophile admitted that he had taken their daughter off the front yard, and had put her in an air-conditioning coolant tank.

That family was destroyed by the innuendo. So, I still say they need to be doing a parallel investigation here.

FOREMAN: Thanks so much, John Walsh. Always good to get your perspective.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

KAYE: Now that both parents have been declared suspects in Madeleine's disappearance, what are their rights under international law? We will find out in a moment.
COMMERCIAL BREAK)

<TYPE: SHOW><HEAD: Polygamy of World Secret the Inside Glimpse Shares Woman Suspects; as Named Parents Girl?s Missing><SECT: International News;><TIME: 22:30>

KAYE: Since the day Madeleine McCann disappeared, her parents have cooperated with the investigation, have asked the public for help in finding their daughter.

Tonight, we know Madeleine's mother and father have been named as suspects in the case. Legally, what are their rights, and will they be charged with killing Madeleine?

Let's ask CNN senior legal analyst Jeffrey Toobin and Rahul Manchanda, an attorney and expert in international law.

Rahul, let's start with you. The father today also being named as a suspect, so now both parents. Does any of this surprise you? RAHUL MANCHANDA, ATTORNEY: Well, not really. I think that if they were just going to accuse the mother or the father, you know, either one could invoke the spousal privilege. But by accusing both of them, I think they're putting them both in the hot spot at this point.

What they don't want is for one person to be accused of a crime and one person to get lawyered up and sort of -- for them to sort of, you know, talk together and conspire together.

I think they want them both to be in the hot seat, to compare their stories, analyze their stories word for word, timings, dates, places, everything, to see if they can vet the information and find out if there's any truth to the allegation that one or more of them are guilty of this crime.

KAYE: And Jeff, now police are saying that they found Madeleine's blood in this car that her parents rented more than three weeks after they say that she had disappeared. Is that enough for a conviction, and how hard will that be to prove?

JEFFREY TOOBIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: I don't think it is enough for even an arrest, much less a conviction. It's certainly an intriguing piece of evidence, but it doesn't explain itself.

How did the blood get there three weeks later? What happened to Madeleine in the intervening -- in the intervening three weeks? How did she die, if she died? I mean, she -- of course, there's no -- no body's been found.

So yes, we'd want to know -- you know, it's part of a story, but how did the blood get there? That -- it doesn't explain itself. And the family, the mother and father, could say that the blood was planted.

So I think it doesn't -- it's not nearly enough for an arrest, much less a conviction.

KAYE: Another surprising bit of information that came out today was this plea deal, apparently, that the police are offering to -- to Kate McCann, suggesting that maybe you'll get two or three years, a light sentence, if you admit to accidentally killing your daughter.

Does that sound like too light of a sentence to you, Rahul, if this occurred?

MANCHANDA: That tells me something. I've been doing this a while. That tells me that they have no case. The reality is, when you offer somebody three years for a potential murder, a sensational murder crime, an international acclaimed murder issue, you're not going to offer two years.

The reality is, it's been six months -- or five, six months since this has happened, and they're offering them a sentence of, you know, two years. The reality is that that tells me that they have nothing and that this blood evidence is sensationalism, and they probably want a conviction out of this, to scare them, to elicit some kind of a confession.

TOOBIN: Sentencing is lower in Europe than it is in the United States as a rule, but it's not that low. A heinous crime like this would not get two years, even if it's some sort of accidental murder. Just merely the act of covering it up for all those years -- for all these months would get you more than two months -- years.

KAYE: What about -- what about some of these actions by the police? They apparently rented out the room where this abduction had occurred. Some of these mistakes along the way. How will that play a role here in this investigation?

TOOBIN: Well, we see the role that it's playing. There's been no arrest. This case has not been solved. And, you know, as everyone knows, the longer from the time of a crime, the less likely it is that anyone is ever charged.

And I would say, based on what we know, at least publicly, the most likely results of this case is no one is ever charged.

And so the absence of physical evidence from the night of the crime that is really pointing at one person means that, you know, there's just much less chance of the crime being solved.

KAYE: At this point, Rahul, if you were defending Mr. and Mrs. McCann, what would you advise them at this point?

MANCHANDA: Say nothing. Say very little. You know, the reality is the prosecution is grabbing at straws right now. They've been renting out the crime scene room. They are now grabbing at straws. They're flailing at this point. They're just lashing out at this point.

If you were truly serious about solving this mystery, this murder, you wouldn't be renting out this room. You know.

TOOBIN: Well...

MANCHANDA: It really is the last dying gasps of a case trying to elicit a confession when there is none.

TOOBIN: They have spoken to them for 16 hours. So -- just in the past few days.

KAYE: Right.

TOOBIN: So we don't know what was said there. Perhaps there were admissions that are useful as investigative leads, but we're talking about a crime, a disappearance that took place in May. Here it is September. It's very hard to reconstruct evidence at that point.

KAYE: All right. Thank you both, Jeffrey Toobin, Rahul Manchanda. Thanks so much.


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