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Church: Israel : Is Israel and the Church the same?
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 Message 1 of 5 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn22  (Original Message)Sent: 8/12/2006 2:44 PM
From: joie  (Original Message) Sent: 9/1/2005 10:31 PM
I have taught in other messages and proven that old law Israel is the very same group as this fake whorish church in our day. For proof read how Jesus told them in Mt 23:28 -Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity. 23:29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous, 23:30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets. 23:31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets. 23:32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers. 23:33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?

23:34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city: 23:35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar. 23:36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.

23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! 23:38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Now I know this is a lot of Scripture and makes these messages very long. But no message about the mystery Babylon could be complete of clear without this Scripture in Matthew 23.

Jesus was speaking to the religious Pharisees of His day, that law group of Israel. He called them serpents and vipers. He told them they are guilty of all the righteous blood shed upon this earth. He also told them, Your HOUSE is left unto you DESOLATE.

Now this clearly identifies that law nation of Israel as Babylon. proof? Sure.

Re 18:20 Rejoice over her, thou heaven, and ye holy apostles and prophets; for God hath avenged you on her. 18:21 And a mighty angel took up a stone like a great millstone, and cast it into the sea, saying, Thus with violence shall that great city Babylon be thrown down, and shall be found no more at all. 18:22 And the voice of harpers, and musicians, and of pipers, and trumpeters, shall be heard no more at all in thee; and no craftsman, of whatsoever craft he be, shall be found any more in thee; and the sound of a millstone shall be heard no more at all in thee; 18:23 And the light of a candle shall shine no more at all in thee; and the voice of the bridegroom and of the bride shall be heard no more at all in thee: for thy merchants were the great men of the earth; for by thy sorceries were all nations deceived. 18:24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

Now here the Word calls Babylon a city of merchants. This means they ‘bought and sold�?the things of God. This is the mark of the beast. Remember that Jude called them ‘beasts�? Sure, here it is. Beasts; serpents; vipers; it is spiritual terminology.

But here in Revelation 18, they are told the same thing as Jesus told Jerusalem of old. You are the ones who are guilty of all the righteous blood ever shed on this earth.

So if they are not one and the same, how could two different cities be guilty of killing all the righteous people?

Then how are they the same ones? Simple. When Jesus closed off that OT group of law Israelites and started His Church, then old Jerusalem stepped right up and started their own church. It is clearly taught about their evil in Joel one. Read how those four worms ate down Jesus�?vine and barked it clean bare. See they then started killing all the NT prophets and saints which Jesus told them in Matt. 23 that he would send THEM and THEY would kill them.

So then the killers of these Christians all down through the church age was that same old Jerusalem. It is the mystery Babylon.

By: Jo Smith



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 Message 2 of 5 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn22Sent: 8/12/2006 2:45 PM
From: <NOBR>MSN NicknameFreeborn22</NOBR> Sent: 6/5/2006 7:01 PM
There are so many who are blinded by the 'Israel' mentioned in Scripture.  They almost ALL believe it is speaking of the nation of Isarael, in the natural, on this natural earth.
 
Nothing could be further from the truth.
 
I fully believe one must learn this truth in order to even know the truth of a Christian.  Who are the Christians?  Are they the true people of God.........?.......or NOT?
 
Do you know?

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 Message 3 of 5 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn22Sent: 8/12/2006 2:45 PM
From: jazzer Sent: 6/18/2006 3:02 PM
one thing Jesus never required was that people understand "israel vs the church",  sabbath,  daniel and 70 weeks, or all that stuff in order to be saved.  seems we have gotten saved and got off of Christ.  now its about the Godhead  or 70 weeks or the "true" church or end time propohecy.  the list goes on and on   none of which brings neither aids salvation.  we should have enough to worry about trying to continue in the words of Jesus and be disciples INDEED
 
if  i NEVER understand  "israel and the church"  or the Godhead or the sabbath  as long as i embrace Christ for the forgiveness of sin and as saviour and Lord and soon coming King i will be saved.

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 Message 4 of 5 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn22Sent: 8/12/2006 2:46 PM
From: <NOBR>MSN NicknameFreeborn22</NOBR> Sent: 6/18/2006 10:35 PM
Jazzer, dont be too sure!  Don't feel too smug.  God did not write all of this for nothing!  Every word of God is important.  We live not by bread alone, but by EVERY WORD WHICH PROCEEDS OUT OF THE MOUTH OF GOD.
 
Now if you do not believe and live by the correct and chosen way of salvation,  chosen by God and revealed only in the Book of Acts,  nothing else you do, say or believe is going to give you salvation.
 
You cannot just deny all of God's chosen ways, and hope he will give you salvation,.
you cannot attempt to give back to God, the life under law , which God declares all through His Word, that he has always hated and never accepted, and expect God to over look this just because you feel 'accountable' to some church or man who teaches we must go back under law.  God is not going to accept law -living from folks today, any more than he ever accepted it from that sinful old Israel.
 
He told them in Isa one, that it is sickness, from the head to the soles.  It is still the same old sickness and rejection of grace in favor of law, or attempting to mix them, will only bring the wrath of God on all who refuse his chosen way of salvation.
 
What makes you think you are smart enough to decide that only a very small part of Scripture is important?  Then tell God he was crazy for giving all of that much to men to write and for us to study!

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 Message 5 of 5 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn22Sent: 8/12/2006 2:46 PM
From: jazzer Sent: 6/19/2006 1:07 PM
freeborn  your bi-polar antics are known in sites youve been banned from.
 
people have confirmed u have a mental chanllenge

Reply
Recommend Delete    Message 8 of 8 in Discussion 
From: <NOBR>MSN NicknameFreeborn22</NOBR> Sent: 6/20/2006 8:40 PM
Paul, thou art mad  (crazy)...MUCH LEARNING hath made thee mad.......(so judges those who have no spiritual understanding......thanks for the compliment!)
So, the carnal-minded think that learning truth makes one mad,,,for their own mind is reprobate, and cannot comprehend a single spiritual truth.  You would also hate the great Paul and Peter.....and of course, Jesus.  ( I mean after all, I teach exactly what they taught.

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