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Gifts of Spirit : Truth of Unique Sign of Holy ghost
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 Message 1 of 12 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551  (Original Message)Sent: 2/13/2008 12:14 AM
p.s.  This message is one I copied from another site.  It is so good on this subject, that I wanted to show it here.  It is not my message, but I certainly agree with it and like it very much.)
 

Speaking in Tongues Is the Unique Initial Evidence
of the Baptism with the Holy Spirit
by Pastor Jim Feeney, Ph.D.
Speaking in tongues �?is it the unique initial evidence that someone has been baptized with the Holy Spirit? Or should we look for another evidence?
Pentecostal Christianity worldwide is believed by some researchers to number half a billion members. The vast majority of them strongly hold the doctrinal position that a person baptized with the Holy Spirit will speak in tongues as the initial evidence of that experience. That is the position that will be put forth in this bible study. Let's examine three primary Scripture portions that lead to this conclusion. Acts 1:4-5; 2:1-4 On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this
command: "Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about. [5] For John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit." ... [2:1] When the day of Pentecost came, they were all together in one place. [2] Suddenly a sound like the blowing of a violent wind came from heaven and filled the whole house where they were sitting. [3] They saw what seemed to be tongues of fire that separated and came to rest on each of them. [4] All of them were
filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit enabled them. What is unique here? �?the speaking in other tongues.
What is not unique here? �?the manifestations of wind and fire. 1 Kings 19:11 The LORD said [to Elijah], "Go out and stand on the mountain in the
presence of the LORD, for the LORD is about to pass by." Then a great and powerful wind tore the mountains apart and shattered the rocks before the LORD, but the LORD was not in the wind. 1 Kings 19:12a After the earthquake came a fire, but the LORD was not in the fire. 1 Kings 19:12b And after the fire came a gentle whisper [KJV: a still small voice]. It was in t he voice, the speaking, that Elijah discerned the Lord. So he went out to the mouth of
the cave to meet with the Lord who spoke to him. Elijah met with God at Mount Horeb. God granted him dramatic manifestations of wind and fire, also an earthquake. But the bible specifically states that "the Lord was not in the wind ... not in the fire." Elijah sensed the Lord in the "still small voice."
At Pentecost in Acts 2:1-4, the disciples likewise experienced dramatic, God-sent manifestations of wind and fire �?similar to Elijah at Mt. Horeb. But the only unique manifestation on that day of Pentecost was the speaking in tongues, not the wind and fire. Acts 10:44-46 While Peter was still speaking these words, the Holy Spirit came on all who
heard the message. [45] The circumcised believers who had come with Peter were astonished that the gift of the Holy Spirit had been poured out even on the Gentiles. [46] For they heard them speaking in tongues and praising God.
 Ag ain, what was unique here? �?the speaking in tongues.What was not unique here? �?the praising of God, which is common throughout the
Old and New Testaments. Acts 19:6 When Paul placed his hands on them, the Holy Spirit came on them, and they spoke in tongues and prophesied.
 Once more, what was unique here? �?the speaking in tongues.  What was not unique here? �?the prophesying, which is commonly seen in both
Testaments. The Scriptural conclusion? The baptism with the Holy Spirit (as we have seen in Acts 2, 10, and 19) is a unique New Testament experience. And it has a unique initial evidence �?
speaking in tongues! The sound of a rushing, mighty wind (Acts 2:2) is not an evidence, nor is it "the evidence".  It occurred on only one of the New Testament instances of the baptism in the Holy Spirit.
And it had occurred in the Old Testament (e.g., 1 Kings 19:11), where it was clearly not  the evidence of the baptism with the Spirit. Fire, or tongue s of fire (Acts 2:3), is not an evidence, nor is it "the evidence" of the Holy
Ghost baptism. It also occurred in only one of the New Testament cases. And fire was a fairly common occurrence in the Old Testament when God revealed Himself, and again clearly not in the context of the Holy Spirit baptism. Praising God (Acts 10:46) is universal throughout Scripture. So it cannot be singled out as
an evidence that one is Spirit-filled. Many non-Spirit-filled people praised God in the Old Testament. Prophecy (Acts 19:6) is likewise common in the Old Testament among those not baptized in the Holy Spirit in the abiding, Acts 2, Pentecostal way. So it too cannot be put forth as a unique evidence that one has received the baptism in the Spirit. What conclusions can be drawn from the Scriptures we have examined?Neither wind nor fire are necessary evidences of the baptism with the Holy Spirit. And if they do occur, as they already had in the Old Testament, they do not therefore uniquely certify that the person has received the Holy Spirit baptism.
 Neither praise nor prophecy is a necessary evidence. They may indeed occur, but many Old Testament persons did one or both, but were not baptized in the Spirit. Other things �?like love, or renewed zeal �?may indeed flow from the baptism with the Holy Spirit. But they also characterize many Old Testament saints without this Pentecostal, spiritual filling. Only SPEAKING IN TONGUES (as in Acts 2, Acts 10, and Acts 19) is the UNIQUE EVIDENCE of the UNIQUE NEW TESTAMENT experience called the BAPTISM with the HOLY SPIRIT. A more extensive treatment of this topic may be found at our bible study entitled "Why Speak in Tongues?" A related sermon is entitled Evidences of the Spirit-Filled Life.

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Reply
 Message 2 of 12 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 8/18/2008 10:36 PM
From: <NOBR>MSN NicknameETHEREALphoenix7</NOBR>  (Original Message) Sent: 11/17/2007 6:22 PM




4 And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
Acts 2:4 (KJV)



If you are filled with the Holy Spirit you may speak in tongues at will because you have been given the ability to speak!


17 And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
Mark 16:17 (KJV)

11 For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.
Isaiah 28:11 (KJV)


You have a prayer language that speaks the will of the Spirit directly to God for your own edification, so use it!


20 But ye, beloved, building up yourselves on your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Ghost,
Jude 1:20 (KJV)

26 Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.
27 And he that searcheth the hearts knoweth what is the mind of the Spirit, because he maketh intercession for the saints according to the will of God.
Romans 8:26-27 (KJV)

2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.
1 Cor 14:2 (KJV)



Dave






<NOBR>First </NOBR> <NOBR>Previous </NOBR> <NOBR>2-6 of 6 </NOBR> <NOBR>Next </NOBR> <NOBR>Last </NOBR> <NOBR>Delete Replies </NOBR>
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Recommend Delete    Message 2 of 6 in Discussion 
From: <NOBR>MSN NicknameFreeborn551</NOBR> Sent: 11/19/2007 9:06 PM
Very good message, Dave.  It is a pity that so many church folks and sabbath folks are being denied this true and great blessing.
 
It is true.  I can raise my hands and begin to praise and worship my God, Jesus, and begin to speak in tongues if I enter into the Spirit.  I can enter into the Spirit by this worship.
 
I truly love being able to enter into this spirit and worship this way.  Tongues is the sign gift.  It is the sign which is spoken against.
 
I hope you will read my message,  The Gift of Tongues.  This is a revelation, about the 'sign gift' which God revealed to me as I wrote this message.  It is truly great.
Thank you for this true and needful message.
 
God bless you and continue to use your powerful ministry.
 
JO

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 Message 3 of 12 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 8/18/2008 10:36 PM
From: <NOBR>MSN Nicknameepe1129</NOBR> Sent: 11/28/2007 2:02 PM
Yes you may speak in tongues at will, but only to edifiy. Even Paul, who spake in tongues said "I thank my God, I speak in tongues more  than Ye all: Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue. " 1 Co 14:18,19      " If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?"  1Co.14:23       "If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret.  But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God. " 1Co 14:27,28
 epe  

Reply
Recommend Delete    Message 4 of 6 in Discussion 
From: <NOBR>MSN NicknameFreeborn551</NOBR> Sent: 11/28/2007 4:54 PM
Yes, epe, that is right.  In the church it is best to teach others than to edify oneself.  I was speaking of my own private worship here alone in my home.
 

When I used to go to Church, I spoke in tongues occasionally there and interpreted it.  I also interpreted some which others spoke.  It is truly a great gift which more people would do well to allow God to move through them this way.
 
It is wonderful and very faith building to know that the eternal God's spirit is moving on you that way.  I know when I do it that it is god and not myself.
 
I do not fake it.  what good is that?

Reply
 Message 4 of 12 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 8/18/2008 10:36 PM
From: <NOBR>MSN Nicknameeelyahomaika</NOBR> Sent: 11/29/2007 2:08 PM
Freeborn,
 
been thinking: how can people "fake" tongues?
When a person speaks in tongues, the Spirit gives him (her) utterance how to speak.
If people fake tongues they must learn by heart some words in a foreign language and speak these words in church I presume? Otherwise I don't see how people can fake tongues.
Does anyone has some experience with fake tongues?I never heard it.
 
eelya

Reply
 Message 5 of 12 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 8/18/2008 10:37 PM
From: <NOBR>MSN NicknameFreeborn551</NOBR> Sent: 11/29/2007 6:59 PM
eelya,  the tongues spoken of in the Word of God is not an earthly language, which one can learn.  it is a heavenly language which NO MAN understands.
 
It is not for the purpose of speaking to people of another language, as is commonly believed.  It was never used that way.
And yes, people can fake it.  They can pretend to be doing it but it not be in the spirit.  I had a 'spirit' come to me, soon after I received the Holy Ghost, and tried to get me to 'fake' it.  But I refused it and told it to leave me alone.
 
God let me know that if I yielded to that, I would never have the true tongues again.  I have never wished to fake it.  It was a spirit trying to get me to do it.
And also a devil spirit can cause people to talk in tongues and those who cannot discern, will think it is God.
 
I have seen people, who were supposed to be receiving the Holy Ghost, and they were talking in some kind of tongues, and some of the folks there thought the person was receiving the Holy Ghost.  I told some of them,  that is the devil speaking through that person.
As we were leaving the church that night, that same person, who was speaking in tongues, gave me a look of pure hatred as we passed each other.  He could not have possibly have heard me, but that spirit knew.
That person never came back to church or lived for God.  It proved I had discerned it right.  He began to dance around and broke out a window.  I do not believe the true Spirit of God does such.
 
Jo

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The number of members that recommended this message. 0 recommendations  Message 6 of 12 in Discussion 
Sent: 8/19/2008 12:25 AM
This message has been deleted due to termination of membership.

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 Message 7 of 12 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 8/19/2008 1:18 AM
Certainly, Skyangel.  It is JESUS who baptizes us with the Holy Ghost.  but no person in all of Scripture has ever spoken to other people in tongues, WITHOUT INTERPRETING IT.
 
No man understands the unknown tongue, so if one gives out a message this way, it must be interpreted for others to get edification from it. 
 
It has NEVER been used for the purpose of teachings someone of another language other than your own.  It is not an earthly tongues.
 
Why would you not accept members to your group?  I do not understand such a thing?
 
If you 'tongues' message fits Scripture, I already know it.  For God has taught me the truth of this matter and it matches EXACTLY what is recorded in the KJV.
 
If it does not fit this KJV,  I say it is wrong.
 
Sincerely,
Jo

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The number of members that recommended this message. 0 recommendations  Message 8 of 12 in Discussion 
Sent: 8/19/2008 11:23 AM
This message has been deleted due to termination of membership.

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The number of members that recommended this message. 0 recommendations  Message 9 of 12 in Discussion 
Sent: 8/19/2008 11:28 AM
This message has been deleted due to termination of membership.

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 Message 10 of 12 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameFreeborn551Sent: 8/19/2008 2:54 PM
wHEN anyone must call the Word of God a lie to back up their own illusions, which they call the truth, it proves they are not of God, but satan's missionaries.   This is you , Skyangel.  You are a minister of satan, and I will not allow your lies to remain in this site.
 
Now any idiot could realize, that the scripture in Isa 28,  is not Jesus mocking anyone.   why in this world would God call this the REFRESHING AND THE REST OF GOD TO THE WEARY?
 
you probably never even read this scripture.  If you did,  it was BABYLING IN YOUR OWN MIND.
 
yOU ARE LIStening to ministers of satan, who hate God's truth,  claiming to 'know' what is some other language, originial arrabic or greek, and thus calling the pure Word of God a lie.
 
thousands before you came in here trying this same evil scheme to darken people's minds toward the precious KJV.  but they did not make it and neither will you.
 
you may as well run back to your 'sole' board.

Reply
 Message 11 of 12 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameTweety134Sent: 8/20/2008 1:59 AM
Freeborn,
I had read SkyAngels message this moring. I said to myself: "SkyAngel will not be here when I get back from work".
 
Did I lie?
 
Tweety

Reply
 Message 12 of 12 in Discussion 
From: joie2Sent: 8/20/2008 4:11 PM
You are so right, Tweety.  I am sick of her kind coming in here and slandering this site, trying to tear down the truth of God and calling us evil, and trying to judge my visions, when they know nothing at all.
 
Skyangel said that my vision of Jesus on the cross was of the devil and false and gave Scripture which refers to Jesus, after his ascention to Heaven, as having white hair.
 
But the Word shows that Jesus while on earth, had black hair, just as he did in my vision.
 
I tried to show her some truth, to see if she could accept any truth.  she proved she cannot and is not interested in truth.  She just wants to toot her 'own horn' and lift herself up as some kind of special teacher.  she has no truth to teach.
 
So I am not going to put with her kind in here long anymore....taking up my time and energy trying to lead Satan's crowd to God.  They want no part of truth.
 
We do not need her kind in here to disrupt all our teachings and peace.  so out she went.
 
she claims others cannot stay in her site because of the heat.  It is bull.  It is because of their HATEFULNESS.
 
one of our members here, joined her debate site a while back.  She attacked him with his very first and friendly post.  she continued to attack him everything he said.  All for no reason.  He had not said one wrong word there.  He showed me some of the mess they hurled at him.  it was simply outrageous.
 
she is the same kind of hateful mongral that bishop is.  attack for no reason and pretend it is her 'heat' they can't take.  I had some dealing with us, a good while back, through the mail.  she did not want to join here, but wanted to attack me through the email.  I tried to help her,  but she is beyond help.
 
I finally told her to stop emailing me.  I was sick of her hatefullness and adversion to all truth.
 
bye for now.  do not like this computer and have some work I need to get done here for Rhonda.  See you later.

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