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| | From:  Sobeit33 (Original Message) | Sent: 2/25/2004 1:14 AM |
Can you give a Scripture?
I have challenged Trinitarians over and over ---- WHY DO NONE OF YOU BRING FORTH EVEN ONE WORD OF SCRIPTURE PROVING THIS LYING DOCTRINE?
I would be afraid to keep believing a doctrine for which there is not one single word of Scripture. I am asking again, bring forth one verse stating this doctrine.
It just cannot be done -- yet I would venture to say 85% of the 'church' world believes this lie. The rest believe the Jesus only lie. why is this? No true revelation from the Holy Ghost.
1. They say Jesus is the 'second person' in the god-head. ......now I ask someone, any trinity believer to please give me one verse which says this. If you cannot, then maybe you better check up on what you rest your soul on.
2. They say the Father is the 'first person' in that god-head. Again please give me one verse saying this.
3. They say the HG is the 'third person' in the god-head. Scripture, Please?
4. They say these are all three co-equal beings, made up of the same substance. Verse, please?
They say these are all three men, for if they are the same substance and co-equal, then they must all be men or they must all three be spirit which? Give Scripture.
5. They say Jesus was just as much God as the other two >>> then how did he die? Can God die? Please give verse for this.
6. They say, God the Son. Please find the verse which uses this term.
Jesus had the HG inside himself. If the HG is a man just as Jesus is, and they are of equal substance, then HOW DID JESUS HAVE THE HG INSIDE HIMSELF?
Please explain with Scripture.
Jesus also said the Father was inside himself. Again if the Father is a man, same as Jesus, how was the Father inside Jesus? How are they inside us? ... If they are men. Also it says we have Jesus, the Father and the HG inside us..... now I ask you,, is this three co-equal beings inside me? Is it three men? Is it three Spirits? Which. If you say spirits, then this is denying that Jesus came in flesh. If you say men, then you must believe that three men are inside us. If you say one is a man, Jesus, and the other two are spirits, then they are not all three of the same substance. And also then Jesus a man has to be inside us. How is this possible? Think? Are you on solid ground?
Is this trouble making? NO-- I am trying to get you to truth. It is necessary for salvation to know and BELIEVE THE TRUTH.
The word said if you believe a lie you will be damned. Is trying to keep you from being damned trouble making and hate> No.
By saying Jesus is God, please explain how Mary gave birth to God.
So which is it --where they all three men? or are they all three spirit? if spirit, then how did man nail a spirit to the cross and kill him?
The HG was inside John before he was born. So if the HG is a man as was Jesus, how was he inside an unborn baby?
If he was not a man, how are he and Jesus of the same substance? How were they equal?
Is there any solid truth or Scripture supporting this teaching? Can any of you answer even one of the questions with Word?
If not, how long will you cling to a doctrine which you can not find one word of God to back it up? Have you no fear of believing something which is not written in God's word? Is this why so many of you are trying feverously to discredit the entire Word of God?
If any of you here are serious about having eternal life, you need to get into this study and find answers.
If you cannot prove any of this teaching with the Written word. There are some who say the spirit without the written word teaches them, then you tell us how it teaches you this is] -
but if you cannot prove this lie, and you belong to a church which teaches this, then I would say it is TIME FOR YOU TO CHECK UP ON YOUR CHURCH.....ARE YOU BEING LED ASTRAY BY A FALSE CHURCH? Sure sounds like it to me. If your church teaches this, then get some of them [pastor] or teacher, to give you the proof out of the Word then give it to me. If they cannot, better run for your eternal lives.
See, that word 'incarnation'? That is a devil word. It was used in connection with idol deities long before Jesus was born. That word is NOT EVER, NO NOT ONE TIME MENTIONED IN THE WORD OF GOD. SO IT IS A LIE.
God never at any time 'robbed' himself in human flesh. God never came to this earth as man. God never was inside a woman. God never at any time died on a cross. God never at anytime was seen by man. God never at anytime was born from a woman. God has never been human flesh.
His Word was not the Son, Jesus. Jesus was not the word. The Word was inside him. That is the flesh we eat, the message he brought us. His words were spirit and life.
His words were the Father's words. He said the Word I speak are NOT MINE, BUT THE FATHER'S WHO SENT ME.
Christ is the HEAD, OR AUTHORITY OVER MAN; BUT GOD IS THE HEAD OR AUTHORITY OVER Christ.
Jesus did not exist before Mary gave birth to him. This is not taught anywhere in the Book. The error of saying Jesus was the Word is what causes people to get this false notion. It is not taught in the Word.
The Word is God's thoughts expressed. That is God.
There is a difference in these two words; look at them:
LORD,,......and Lord.
See the difference? LORD refers to the Father. Lord refers to Jesus.
That is one reason so many people are confused. They know not this. So when they read about LORD,,,,,,, then Lord they think it is of the same being. But it is not.
Jesus Christ was set up on the throne of God by God himself and made to be our God. But only after his resurrection and ascension to Heaven. God is a many-membered Kingdom. Their 'oneness' refers to their unity, perfect love, and harmony. This is what they are trying to bring us to: perfect oneness with each other; perfect love; unity, agreement.
Paul said you are ALL ONE. Now get this.
As Christ is one body, yet many members, so is God. for Christ is the IMAGE OF THE INVISIBLE GOD.
So no one can explain God. He is a kingdom. Jesus is a human being. If you say God is a mortal man or ever has been a mortal man, go read Romans one. It comes from a reprobate mind.
all of you, listen to this truth.
the word 'incarnation' is NOT in the Word of God. Therefore it is a false teaching. It is throwing the entire truth off in your minds.
Jesus Christ was not eternal in the heavens. the Word 'beginning' in John 1:1 does not mean ETERNITY. gET THIS it does not mean the beginning of time known as eternity.
the Word plainly teaches that JESUS IS THE BEGINNING AND THE ENDING.
nOW DO YOU not know that Eternity had no beginning and it will never have an ending? Study the word. Get away from all these so-called scholars. They also were deceived and not in truth. If you believe their words, you are denying God's word.
I am telling you what the word says. It says Jesus is the beginning. It did not Jesus was IN THE BEGINNING. IT SAID JESUS IS THE BEGINNING.
Jesus ENDED THE OT. HE TOOK IT OUT OF THE WAY. THEN HE BEGAN THE NT. He is the Beginning of the NT. That is all this means.
It said the Word was inside Jesus. The Word is God. God was INSIDE CHRIST. He is inside me. but not because I am God. Because he placed his spirit into me when he gave me the Baptism of the Holy Ghost. Unless you have receive that baptism, you do NOT HAVE THE SPIRIT OF GOD INSIDE YOU.
Now Jesus was the first BEGOTTEN FROM THE DEAD. This means that at his RESURRECTION FROM THE DEAD, HE BECAME THE FIRST SON OF GOD BEGOTTEN IN THE IMAGE {glorified] son of God.
This is when the word was made flesh; not when he was born.
He was not an eternal Son . This is no where taught in the Word. If you think it is , find me that verse.
God is not just [1] person or personality. but neither is he [3] persons or personalities. This is such false junk.
God is an innumerable host of HOLY BEINGS ALL UNITED IN ONE PERFECT HARMONOUS KINGDOM.
Now everything in the Word shows this. Everything in nature shows this. He said the invisible things of God are CLEARLY SEEN BEING UNDERSTOOD BY THE THINGS WHICH DO APPEAR.
That means everything you can see around you, shows the true nature of God. Everything you see around you is in plurality = innumerable. Is God any less? No!
Count the stars if you can ----- they show the true nature of God.
Count the grains of sand on the seashore if you can-----they show the true nature of God.
Count the kinds of insects if you can ----they show the true nature of God.
Count the invisible germs if you can...........etc.......see the picture?
Nothing in nature or the word shows God to be just [1] or [3] beings. This is junk of Satan.
Jo
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| | | From: Isaiah | Sent: 10/13/2006 3:59 PM |
Was God made lower than the angels? Did God come as sinful man? |
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I read the above message. Now that is good and the information I was looking for. if the Holy Ghost was and is a man, then how did this man get inside an unborn baby? How is this man inside us? and I saw that trinity is not in Scripture, so I do not believe there is a trinity. also incarnate is not in Scripture, so I do not believe anyone was incarnate. three manifestations of God? I did not find that one either. some say it was three offices of God. I cannot find that either. this just does not fit the Scriptures. |
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You know, I have asked people for years to prove this false teaching with written Scripture. they without fail, go to some past person, they call a scholar, and give me their words. they never can give Scripture. when some do try, the Word is not saying what they think it is. trinity is NOT TAUGHT ANYWHERE IN GOD'S WORD. I truly wonder how so many people can continue believing a doctrine, such as this, where not one single verse of Scripture says it. |
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I am not trying to be argumetative or anything of an ugly nature. But I wish only to help you grow in Christ and truth. While it is true that God does use US to help others, we must always prove them by Scripture. God has also given me most of the gifts of the Spirit and has actually spoken to me on many occasions and teaches me himself, as He did Paul. I do not give much personal testimony, (but I think I should, since this does sway many people)-- but I have always tried only to point people to the truth of Scripture. Now when you can find a verse stating that Christ, or Jesus was diety, then show me that verse. Just because a man claims many gifts does not mean he had truth. Just because they write many words, does not mean they preach truth. If they and you cannot read it in a verse of Scripture, then it is lies. If Jesus were God, if Jesus were diety, if Jesus were the second person in a three-person Godhead, then the Word of God would SAY SO. Where does it say so? If God were a trinity, He would SAY SO SOMEWHERE. Where does it say so? (I say this for your sake. I already have studied this and proven the truth to myself.) I cannot find trinity in Scripture, so I discarded it as the lies of the Catholic church, which it is. I do not know Dakes. But I have been told that he spent time in jail, for his abuse of a teen-age girl. might pay you to do some double checking of this man. God did not raise up any man to put his own words directly into Scripture, to trip up others. Any human who thinks so much of himself, as to insert his own thoughts into the Holy Book is wrong to start with. I KNOW that God has given me truth, yet I would not dare insert my words into a Bible. When they teach anything which they cannot give you one verse to read, which says this thing, know that he is not into truth. Show me one verse using the term, God the Son. It is not there. give me one saying God is three persons, It is not there. think! If Holy Ghost is a man, as the trinty lie says, then how did this 'man' get into an unborn baby. (JOHN)? How are three 'men' inside us? God is a SPIRIT, and not man. so says the word. | God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent: hath he said, and shall he not do it? or hath he spoken, and shall he not make it good? |
Now, when you can give me a quoted verse, stating that God is a man, or three men, or son of man, or human, or robed in flesh, incarnate, first person, second person, third person, or any of the other 'terms' used to teach this lie, then I will believe you. But if you cannot, then you need to take stock of this doctrine. You owe it to yourself to search the KJV for these words and terms. Know that all who teach this lie are also themselves deceived, and can do you no good. If you cannot read these 'trinity' terms in Scripture, it proves to be a lie. |
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HI, I read this article on another group,. of course, I do not agree with this, in that they think the word 'one' means a number, when it comes to revealing God. That is the entire mix-up with this whole mess about who God is. Paul clearly states that we are ALL ONE. So this cannot mean a number. In John 17, Jesus prayed that we would ALL BE ONE AS (same way) he and his Father are ONE. So here is the link, if you care to read this. It does include some true history of how this false teaching was formulated. |
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i miss him too. wonder whut he is doing? |
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He, Eric. Sorry to be away so long. seems hard to get around to everything. anyways, yes. I have been studying and found it true that the trinity is not in scripture. the peole here helped, but i study the \bible and foudn it is not in there. so will keep studying to see more. |
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Amen to that , Eric. HOpe rollingstone 444 is still studying and learning. Have a good day. |
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Yes, I am still trying to learn. not as much as it takes tho. guess i get like others, caght up in too many other things. but one thing i think about was in this thread. i see that trinity said there are three of same substance. i don't see how that could be. unless i am taking something wrong. seems to me, Jesus was a man, and God is a spiritl that is not same substande now is it. for Jesus said the spirit did not have flesh and bones. so they are not the same substance. i think also that holy ghost is a spirit. dont knwo if it is the same spirit as god. for if they are three different one, then that makes two spirits. now that part is confusing. but i have enjoyed this study. i really think trinity is not the right answer. |
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the word itself, trinity, is NOT ONCE FOUND IN SCRIPTURE. This alone ought to tell everyone it is not a teaching from God. OK I am going to post an opposing view to this statement. the word itself, Oneness, is NOT ONCE FOUND IN SCRIPTURE. This alone ought to tell everyone it is not a teaching from God. \ However I will say that this ought to bring about the question, "Is it barely possible that Oneness is in error?" Thought so! ! |
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Hello, CKR4TRUTH, I am very glad to see you join us here at Build on the True Foundation, and glad to see you joining in. You are right, that the so-called 'oneness' doctrine, as taught by the so-called Jesus only folks, is in grave error. But so is the trinity doctrine. Both doctrines are man-made lies and are braches on the same old dead tree. So then what is right? Just as paul described it in 1Cor. 12 and Romans 12... God is a kingdom , on body, made up of many members. God is not a 'person' as both false doctrines teach. God is not 1 person, and god is not 3 persons. Jesus said God is a SPIRIT. That Spirit Kingdom is one body, made up of many members, just as the son kingdom of humanity is one body, a kingdom, made up of many members, just as Christ is a body of believers, made up of many members, just as our human body is one, made up of many members. Now that IS written in Scripture and is the truth. Christ is the IMAGE of the invisible God. So God has to be just as Christ is described. But ONENESS is truth, as taught by Paul and the other Apostles, one body, made up of many members. Just as Jesus described it in John 17. Just as Paul said YOU ARE ALL ONE. The true meaning of the word 'oneness' shows that a ONENESS is not even possible except between at least two or more entities. You cannot have a true ONENESS with only 1 being, as the false doctrine claims. they have no clue as to what ONE means. Jo |
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