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 | | From:  JimVanNest (Original Message) | Sent: 6/26/2004 4:39 AM |
2004 is certainly shaping up to be a crazy year at the box office. We've already seen The Passion break about 30 records, and Shrek 2 is climbing the all time charts. And now, we may see a record box office take for a documentary in its first weekend of release. Like him or hate him, Michael Moore has scored. Bowling for Columbine is currently the all time record holder for box office for a documentary with $21mil total gross. Farenheit could make that this weekend, in less than 900 theaters. The per screen average for this thing is crazy high. I just wonder what the success of this film means for the Bush reelction campaign. Does this mean that Bish could be in trouble in November? Or does it mean very little in the grand scheme of things? And just an aside...I don't particularly care what your political affiliation is or what you think of Moore or Bush. I just wonder if the mainstream appeal of this film is any indication of the leanings of the country. Jim |
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 | | From:  Çutter® | Sent: 7/2/2004 2:36 PM |
How did the Republican Party try to stop the release of this film ? I heard Disney refused to distribute the film. I also heard it will be the first American "documentary" to be purchased for release in China. I also heard that it’s full of misrepresentations, inaccuracies and innuendos.
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Nelle, I heard Moore talking about this very example you gave in an interview. He was blasting President Bush for just sitting there continuing to read to these children and not getting away from them as fast as he could so not to endanger them. Oh P--leeze! is exactly right. So what kind of criticism would Bush had gotten if he had reacted immediately, then it would have been "oh he knew it was coming, that is why he reacted so quickly" or "he just flat out jumped the gun and didn't even take time to think about such a serious situation." |
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 | | From:  Nellé | Sent: 7/2/2004 4:42 PM |
George W. has a very capable cabinet, which no doubt is quite capable of working behind the scenes as he continued to read to the children. Tanya I agree, no matter what, someone was going to find fault with his actions. That's politics for ya!  Sorry Jim, Although you did say ."I don't particularly care what your political affiliation is or what you think of Moore or Bush. I just wonder if the mainstream appeal of this film is any indication of the leanings of the country", you did set this up for political debate. |
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Whatever. I'm glad so many people are in tune with what I'm thinking when I post. But in response to some questions....several conservative organizations put pressure on theater owners to not show the film...they petitioned the Federal Election Commission to examine the film for potentially violating campaign finance law. And I misspoke when I said the Republican Party...it was various right wing organizations. And I find it funny that everyone is so quick to say that Moore is lying throughout the film....and that people that blindly believe him aren't smart. What's so different about blindly believing this administration? I don't 100% believe either side...which is why I think an investigation ought to be done to check it out. And Nelle....the line you quoted from my original post was my attempt to thwart the to Bush or not to Bush bickering before it started. Jim |
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 | | From:  Nellé | Sent: 7/2/2004 6:48 PM |
Excuse me Jim, I certainly never thought quoting Moore's comment would be interpreted as saying Moore is lying throughout the film. Quite contrary, Moore admits it is not journalism. I don't know anyone who believes 100% of either side, do you? There are truth and lies to be found in both parties. I guess the bottom line is for us all to decide for ourselves which is the better of the two evils. Peace |
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 | | From:  Nellé | Sent: 7/2/2004 6:57 PM |
Hey becca, I didnt see your post either! lol Hello to you, my cyber friend.  |
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 | | From:  ßecca¥ | Sent: 7/2/2004 8:03 PM |
I'm finally going to see it...in about an hour! nyeh eh ehhhhh!  I know what Moore does, etc, etc, but I can appreciate some of it. There's no way I can opine about this movie without having seen it yet...so, maybe I'll share my opinion of it later. warning! warning! lol |
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Boy is this a great thread!! I think right here we are showing how polarized all of america is on so many issues, even a mere movie. Just think if there were a thread about abortion or is bush really a christian as he says or is kerry the same old skull and bones garbage... quite polarized is america now... for every michael moore there is a ken lay... That aside, this IS a movie topic (originally) and we are simply polarized about this movie. Amazing. |
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 | | From:  Nellé | Sent: 7/3/2004 1:03 AM |
WARNING! WARNING! We should be hearing from  soon! I can't wait!!!!!  Tell us what you thought!  Don't worry, we all promise not to criticize your opinion! |
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 | | From:  ßecca¥ | Sent: 7/3/2004 6:14 AM |
Yea, right Nelle! lol  Below, is just one example of what I enjoyed reading so far this evening. I purposely stayed away from reading many reviews and articles about this movie before I saw it, so now I'm catching up. Okay, okay, I give this movie 4.5 outta 5 stars. '9/11' documents a mother's grief By Gary Strauss, USA TODAY Fahrenheit 9/11 might be polarizing much of the nation, but there's one thing about the controversial Bush-bashing documentary most viewers probably will agree on: Key scenes featuring Lila Lipscomb are gut-wrenching and haunting. That's for sure! This woman's amazing journey and her honesty moved me tremendously. I wept for quite a while after leaving the theater. Moore's film, among other things, is a tribute to this woman, imo. Full article here |
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Yeah... this mom's grief was very touching... boy was that sad. |
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Good morning Jim.... I really didn't mean to direct my political venom at you. I believe that we should respect all viewpoints, conservative or liberal, on this board. I will not belittle anyone regardless of political persuasion. On the other hand, I will respond when I believe my views are challenged. Buckeye Bill |
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This isn't a political opinion, but an analysis of the movie itself: there were way too many leaps in logic to call it a documentary. The connections Moore pointed out were certainly interesting, but he pushed them way too far and made too many speculative implications about Bush's connections to the Bin Laden family, connections which could be explained with a statement as simple as this: businessmen need to make and use as many connections as they can. They also make deals over golf. To point out that Bush enjoys golf seemed an immature attack in response to Bush's suggestion that Moore "get a real job." I for one am happy that Bush plays golf-- any psychologist will tell you that relaxation is necessary every now and then to maintain mental health, especially in a job as stressful as president of the United States. Basically, taking away all the speculation, dramatization, irrelevant information, maudlin pathos, and gimicky attempts at humor (looping the president mispronnouncing "nuclear" over and over again is irrelevent and completely devoid of context), all that's left are two main points, that war is horrible, and that Michael Moore hates Bush, both of which we knew anyway. |
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Heres an interesting article pinpointing all the inacuracies, and deceits in "F9/11". The writer is not some right-winged ultra conservative, but an Independant who voted for Nader in 2000. Some of the inacuracies are small, some are downright libelous. Its a very interesting article, however its long. I thought some here might be interested . Fifty-nine Deceits in Fahrenheit 911 By Dave Kopel |
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That was an interesting article. Thanks. It shows that filmmakers often do take liberties that may not be fair. Actually, I was hoping the movie would spend a little more time on Dick Cheney... talk about deceits. Bush often appears affable as he is buying ribs, golfing, doing his classic misstatements and the like. I do not think the movie was too unkind to him. Conversely, Cheney and his Halliburton sting remind me of that old James Bond villain, Blofeld and his plans to rule the world. He's got a terrible temper (see his well-publicized cursing) and really seems shady. Oh well... |
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