MSN Home  |  My MSN  |  Hotmail
Sign in to Windows Live ID Web Search:   
go to MSNGroups 
Free Forum Hosting
 

Important Announcement Important Announcement
The MSN Groups service will close in February 2009. You can move your group to Multiply, MSN’s partner for online groups. Learn More
VenablesArchives[email protected] 
  
What's New
  
  TUTORIALS  
  Tuts and things.  
  Welcome  
  General  
  ♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦  
  Sue's Play...  
  Marina's C/S  
  Completed Backs  
  Mini Backs.  
  ♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦  
  Dawn's Backs...  
  Dawn's C/S's  
  Backs Dividers.  
  Eilleens Backs  
  Eilleens C/S  
  Hileena's BG'S  
  Hileena's Awards  
  Hileena's Play..  
  ♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦  
  Various Poems  
  AwardsReceived.  
  Solomon...  
  Pictures  
  Links  
  ♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦  
  Welcome to Classes  
  Class Folders  
  Lesson 1 Tutoria  
  Lessons 1 - 4  
  Interim Lesson  
  Advanced Classes  
  Background Tips  
  WAMBO Class Stuf  
  ADII Stuff..  
  WAMBO Stuff.  
  1stLessonTut&C/S  
  Photobucket  
  2A large Print  
  ♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦◊♦  
  Marina's Play  
  Diva's stuff  
    
  
  
  Tools  
 
General : first post
Choose another message board
 
     
Reply
 Message 1 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameCaringTHELMAMARIE  (Original Message)Sent: 5/11/2008 8:07 AM
From: <NOBR>NineMSN NicknameW_AngelStar1</NOBR>  (Original Message) Sent: 11/05/2008 9:45 AM
*False Churches, False Brethren, False Gospels*
MOST "CONTAGIOUS" DELIRIUM - Florida - WARNING!

-Andrew Strom.

Todd Bentley has declared that his Florida anointing is the most
"contagious" that he has ever imparted to people. (In other words,
the most easily transferable). And indeed this seems to be the
case. It is spreading rapidly throughout the world.

But what exactly is this anointing? One observer of the Florida
revival notes: "Todd Bentley constantly manifests his "anointing"
by shaking his head back and forth, and by his body physically
shaking. These manifestations also happen frequently in those
who he imparts to. He will even wave his arms over the audience,
shouting, "Fire! Fire! Fire!" and then people in the audience will
start manifesting. Some appear to be convulsing, and some even
as if they are being thrashed by a spirit."  Not of God.
In a CBN News interview, Todd stated: "Our focus here in Florida
every night is I lay hands on every single person who comes -
whether it's 5,000, 10,000 - And I'm praying every night, 'God, give
it away, give it away, give it away.' And that's the focus here:
Impartation."

And indeed there are more and more reports of this anointing being
transmitted from Florida to other states and nations across the globe.

As we have already seen, a report from England tells of a preacher
who brought Todd's anointing back from Florida and now it is
manifesting in his UK meetings: "Fire, a burning sensation, was
felt all over people's bodies... There were outbursts of joy, drunken-
ness and spontaneous healings throughout the meeting."

A man from Clearwater, Florida says that a number of people from
his fellowship have attended the revival and then brought the
'anointing' back with them. Here is what he personally saw:

WILD DEMONIC DELIRIUM

"These are the effects that I have witnessed on people who have
attended this movement and either have had hands laid on them or
claim to have been imparted with "the spirit":

-They come back with this kind of childlike drunken stupor.
-Descriptions of a burning sensation either in their veins, heads or
stomachs. Question this?
-Descriptions of being washed back and forth like the waves in the ocean;
-Dancing about like drunk...
-Inappropriate yelling and screaming like they're at a football game;
-Young men whistling over and over and holding their heads and
claiming that they "feel the Holy Spirit about to split them in two";  Never!
-One young man's back two teeth turned completely to some
metallic finish.
-People with their eyes rolled in the back of their heads and weaving
around like they're lost.
-Women just gyrating and pulsating like they're being ravaged from
behind from some unseen force. Sure!
-Drunken uncontrollable laughter in the middle of a solemn prayer time… Not of God!
-People being "slain in the spirit"... just falling down and being
unable to move (like something's holding them down)..."

Another eyewitness from the USA writes:

"A friend of mine invited me to a church where the ministry team
brought back a "Fire" from the Lakeland revival… The pastor's wife
was moderating, but she could not complete her sentences
because she was 'drunk in the Spirit.' She imitated the type of
sounds I read in your blog. I saw people breaking out into
uncontrollable laughter. I came with my Bible to receive a word…
There was no teaching or preaching. Just testimonies. They talked
about their experience in Lakeland... Where was the word? I did
not find any. I also heard a sound BAM and then I saw someone
being slain in the spirit."

A Spirit-filled pastor that I know from the UK who has been following
Todd Bentley's ministry closely for some years wrote to me about
what he himself has observed since the year 2000:

"My difficulty with Todd Bentley's ministry is not whether he has
recently covered himself with tattoos or pierced himself silly, but
the SOURCE of his power. He keeps changing his position on this.
Sometimes he says it's the Holy Spirit and a lot of the time it's his
angels… ?????

"Many have said that they believe that Florida is a 'mixture'.
Personally, I do not believe 'mixture' is involved. I believe these
deceiving spirits have hi-jacked Todd's ministry… Either the healings
are of God or they are not. Which is it?

"People can be healed in spiritualist churches. I have witnessed,
close-up, first hand, people being instantly healed by mediums
and faith healers. I have also seen people healed by the power of
the Holy Spirit. To begin with there is no discernible difference.
However the counterfeit healings soon begin to either go wrong or
something far worse comes upon the person.

"When God heals someone - He adds 'no sorrow.'

"I know Todd started off OK - I was there in his early meetings…
In September 2000 I stood in front of Todd and gave him the
warning that God gave me for him. "Beware, the leaven of the
Pharisees, lest an angelic leaven enters your ministry."

"One month later, according to Todd's own account, at a meeting
in Grants Pass Oregon, Cal Pierce walked in with Branham's
'Healing Revival' angel in tow, Todd saw and accepted this spirit
without reservation. His 'angels' have been with him ever since.

"I have written to Todd on numerous occasions and reminded him
of God's warning, alas to no avail.

"When Todd Bentley conducted a healing meeting in a large
charismatic church here in England in 2005, he laid hands on
many people who were apparently healed. I know of at least one
instance where a pastor's wife with cancer was prayed for by Todd.
Soon afterwards she heard voices in her head telling her to 'drown
herself just like her father did'. The poor woman ended up in a
mental hospital, I believe she still has the cancer.  Does this sound
like God to you?

"No-one is following up or keeping records of what happens to
people who have hands laid on them by Todd or others like him.

"I have kept records as far as I can, concerning this particular
church. Over a relatively short period, there has been a dramatic
increase in premature deaths, cancers, marriage break-ups,
sickness and disease amongst the congregation where the
leadership have allowed this type of ministry into their church.
Many people left the church in fear.

"These are the consequences of following this type of 'ministry'
which no-one is either aware of, or wants to address. I know, I have
visited the people in hospital and attended one of the funerals…"
[END QUOTE]

Meanwhile we find a number of prominent leaders beginning to
declare that this will be one of the greatest revival movements in
history. Some even see it as the beginning of a "new awakening".

Bob Jones declared that "This move will be a global move, traveling
with signs and wonders all over the world! The third wave is here!"

As this 'anointing' spreads worldwide, I believe there are some
serious questions that we need to ask ourselves:  I do also!

Isn't it possible, with all the dubious 'anointings' and angels and
manifestations associated with Bentley's ministry, that what we
are really seeing is a giant 'counterfeit' revival? Isn't it possible
that if it continues to grow at the present rate, that it may literally

become one of the great "delusions" of the Last Days - a great
deception that has the power to actually deceive, if possible, the
very elect?  (Is this not what I said?)

These are very serious questions - but I believe they must be
asked - because this 'anointing' is already beginning to circle the globe.

If you have been to a meeting where someone has brought the "fire"
back from Florida, please write and tell me what you saw. I am
collecting accounts from people about this.
 
People the Holy Spirit is a prefect gentleman,
He does not go against anyone wishes, like they
are claiming here and He doesn't make a fool out of anyone. That laughing spirit is of the devil. And the way the women are doing!


First  Previous  5-19 of 19  Next  Last 
Reply
 Message 5 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameCaringTHELMAMARIESent: 5/11/2008 8:12 AM
From: <NOBR>NineMSN NicknameCaringTHELMAMARIE</NOBR> Sent: 11/05/2008 11:38 AM
Marie you starting laughing during a prayer?sometimes i cried,not always laughing

Reply
 Message 6 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameCaringTHELMAMARIESent: 5/11/2008 8:14 AM
From: <NOBR>NineMSN NicknameCaringTHELMAMARIE</NOBR> Sent: 11/05/2008 2:52 PM
 
Some of it is,some are being delivered from evil spirits, ever thought of that?
Since when does God and Satan work together?  Does this even sound right to you Marie?I never said they work together sis,just when God shows up the devil in sheeps clothing is there amoungst it all doing his thing.
 
Impartation. From man to man or woman?  Hello?God through Man/woman
The only example in the Bible I can even think of
is in the Old Testament.
 
Young men whistling over and over and holding their heads and
claiming that they "feel the Holy Spirit about to split them in two";  Never!maybe
Why would you say maybe to this one? Give me examples in the Bible for this one.Ok, I will admit there is no maybe there
 
I know that people are filled with joy and rejoicing and dancing in the Holy Spirit, you are still just hunting and pecking on this one.How am I hunting and pecking sis? I do not understand, I have been filled with the joy of the Lord which is my strength. Marie I have the Holy Spirit, and I have had a lot of things happen when the Holy Spirit hits me in Church or at home just praising the Lord. But Sis we are not to go on our feelings or experiences, but on the Word of God.sometimes we need our experiances to remind us of just who and what the Holy Ghost is all about.I do not usually tell many people what HE has done for me sis
 
 But Sis you have to admit that the Lord and Satan does not work together like this.Like I said above,I never said they work "together" God's Word says in James 3:11& 12 Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter? Can the fig tree, my brethren, bear olive berries? either a vine, figs? so can no fountain both yield salt water and fresh. Maybe you should finish the rest of the chapter there.
 
being delivered from evil spirit or yes a bad spirit manifesting, I tend to believe a bad spirit manifesting with this one.
-Women just gyrating and pulsating like they're being ravaged from
behind from some unseen force. Sure!ever see women dance?????
Yes I have seen them dance under the Spirit before and it was nothing like this, sorry.  Maybe in a strip joint you would see that.sis I have watched these meetings and there has been NO gyrating and pulsating like what is described above, NONE
 
-People being "slain in the spirit"... just falling down and being
unable to move (like something's holding them down)..." Holy Ghost holding them down, this has happened to colin and myself as well as Pam and Ross and many others. So back on experiences again or you? Well, this has happened to me also, but wouldn't try and convince other people by my experiences at all. I only said that to show you and others that is does happen nothing more
 
If God's Word doesn't convince some one then evil fire may convince them that they are doing right. (The Bible also says that in the last days people will call right-wrong and wrong-right. does it not?)Yes it does
 
Paul gave his testimony but he also taught the Word of God, did he not? Testimony is one thing, but experiences continually without the Word will not win no one to the Lord God Almighty.Then how come many are saved at these meetings and sis these are HEALING meetings. 
"My difficulty with Todd Bentley's ministry is not whether he has
recently covered himself with tattoos or pierced himself silly, but
the SOURCE of his power. He keeps changing his position on this.
Sometimes he says it's the Holy Spirit and a lot of the time it's his
angels… ?????I do agree with this point, OK now we are getting some where aren't we?
 
Marie did you ever wonder why none of these people who claim healings bring back doctor's reports backing up what they say? They have caught certain people being paid off by so called ministers to act like they are cripple and come to a meeting in a wheel chair, so they would get credit of laying hands on them and the Lord healing them through them, this is a known fact.Prove that to me sis and I will then believe you
 
"People can be healed in spiritualist churches. I have witnessed,
close-up, first hand, people being instantly healed by mediums
and faith healers. I have also seen people healed by the power of
the Holy Spirit. To begin with there is no discernible difference.
However the counterfeit healings soon begin to either go wrong or
something far worse comes upon the person. agreed
Good glad you do! be stupid if I didn't
 
"When God heals someone - He adds 'no sorrow.' The crying is healing tears from many past hurts that have been festering away inside a person, Happened to me many times
Don't think he meant crying here, he was talking about the healings going wrong and people even dying from them..That kind of sorrow, Marie.
MATTHEW 13:39-43 Marie I think this is after the tribulation that this happens Sister, is it not?All I know is Colin got that scripture as I was answering your first post
 
Marie it is not a matter of letting God out of a box.  It is a matter of seeing if a ministry lines up with the Word or not, and if it doesn't and the devil is manifesting his angels as angels of light and you don't have enough of the Word to help you discern exactly what is going on then that is where people are falling for it all. Satan does according to the Bible have wolves in sheep's clothing who will try to deceive the very elect if possible.  And Sister because there has not been a great move of the Holy Spirit for a long time, Jesus said, This generation will seek for signs and wonders and that Satan will deliver exactly that to gain more on his side, read the Word it is in there, if you don't believe me.  I know this sis but this is where diserment comes in
 
Sure people are hungry for a touch of the Holy Spirit any more and that is why there will be a great falling away Sister, for people will be living on experiences and signs and wonders, but not by faith. Read the Word.
 
Well if the Word deceives me then I really don't think there is hope for anyone Marie, do you, for we all are suppose to be following the Word of God, or we not?  Not some man who is trying to make a name for himself, on his experiences alone.I do not think Todd Bently is trying to make a name for himself, I personally do not watch the meetings for him but to see what Jesus is doing with HIS flock
Well I would be careful about thanking Jesus for this just yet Marie.I will continue to thank Jesus for all healings sis
 
How can you agree and disagree with someone at the same time? When it comes to the very Word of God.
 
Hugs, Delores

Reply
 Message 7 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameCaringTHELMAMARIESent: 5/11/2008 8:15 AM
.. I've only been to a couple of healing revivals ..
.. At one, the "healer" would yell be healed . And then push them in the head and knock them down . And then say be gone you evil spirits . And another thing was happening at the same time . There were ushers passing plates for a donation . I got up and walked out ..
.. The other one I was at followed the Bible . They prayed over Olive oil and anointed each person before laying hands on them (James 5:14) . There was a very calm moving of the spirit there and many were healed, not all ..
.. I am very skeptical of healing ministries the don't follow the Bible in their healing . Pushing some one down is not being slain in the spirit . It is showmanship . I have very seldom seen a healing on TV where they anoint the person before they lay hands on them ..
.. An angel has nothing to do with the power of healing . Healing comes from the power of the Holy Spirit within you . Also wherever the power of the Holy Spirit is being manifested the devil is nowhere to be found . Darkness can't be in the Light ..


~~ Just My Two Cents ~~

Love & Hugs
In JESUS
.Rick.

Reply
 Message 8 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameMarina4christ1Sent: 5/11/2008 9:35 AM
Hiya hun ....as you know I dont like getting into heavy debates ..but this really has got my blood boiling ..
 
and my Opinion for what it is worth is .this...
 
Has this Lady read up on Revivals that have already been happening in the world .
 
1. The Great Welsh Revival ..(maybe a little before her time, ) but in  those days women used to wear their hair long ...and one of the manifestations of the revival was that the women used to be so in the Spirit they would swing their head around, and cause an whirring sound with their hair which had fallen down into their braids ...that was just one incidence ...
 
2. Asusa Street ....another great Revival ..where manifestations were recorded ..and healings and more importantly Revival meaning ...people being led to Christ Jesus through these things ....
 
3. The Toronto Blessing .....another great revival where hundreds of thousands of People came to the Lord ..with manifestations and healings ...this too travelled the world through people who travelled worldwide to these meetings ..and took the annointing home with them and imparted it ....Praise the Lord I say .
 
4. Pensacola Revival ....this two travelled the world via people who attended the meetings and took the annointing back to their various countries ..
Manifestations .....people coming and crying before the Lord ..(Holy Spirit working on their past,and cleansing them and healing them) ..
 
There have been literally hundreds of revivals all over the world ....even here in Australia ...I,my friend Marie, and Pam and Ross attended these ....and we witnessed ..people being stuck to the floor and walls ....because the Holy Spirit was doing a work in those people ....they were changed inside out ....if that wasnt God I would like to know what it was ..
 
I nearly forgot there was another great revival ...happened in Sunderland England and wow what a revival that was ....teenagers coming to the Lord in their droves .....gangs of youngsters saved ..and are now living for God .....Ken Gott ...came to Australia ...and imparted this outpouring to us ...
 
Have you ever been in one of these meetings personally .....
if not .......may I suggest you try to attend one .
it might change you life ....Hallelujah ..
Praise God who is worthy ....I say Pour out your Fire Lord and burn out all that shouldnot be in us ....and replace it with what should be .
 
Amen .
 
 
 
 

Reply
 Message 9 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameHileena0Sent: 5/11/2008 9:44 AM
Hi to both of you,
Like you Marina I try not to get involved in heavy debates either....dont like it.....Just to say I agree with you about the revivals etc.....I was reading through your post and thinking.....Oh wonderful....she's from the UK and has forgotten about Sunderland   but you hadn't  LOL......I've been to quite a lot of their meetings during what they called their "refreshing". Sarah {daughter} is a member of that church, in fact is in their "Fire School" Ken refers to them as his little team of intercessors  LOL. In fact they have been catering for a conference where the Arnotts have been {thats a bit of a blast from the past for me} havent heard much about them since the Toronto Blessing.
Sorry rambling again....Whats new? says Marine  LOL
Love
Hileena

Reply
 Message 10 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN Nicknamemotherearth02Sent: 5/11/2008 2:54 PM
WOW this is very deep for me, all I want to add is that I am Catholic, and not biased, I have friends from all religeons and been to a lot of different churches to see for myself, so I think I am pretty broadminded, my belief is that a long as you are Christian and follow Gods teachings then you will be saved, I do not go to church anymore, one reason is that Michael made that impossible, trying to keep a disabled child or young adult with a very deep voice quiet during a mass was virtually impossible, screaming  out for everybody to shutup, hmmmmmmmmmmmmm not nice.
And now looking after Geoff and his Mum, makes it hard also, but I pray everyday, and believe in the power of prayer, I know it works, I will not pray for God to save my Husband as I know it is his time, God sent him back 33 years ago, He died and went down the tunnel of light and God Spoke to him and told him to come back as he had more to do before it was his time.
I see God in everything on Earth, it is his creation and we are also created by God, who is to say what is the right or wrong way to Celebrate our Love of God, it is open to interpretation, my own interpretation, is from the Bible itself, blessed are the Meek, and being Meek does not mean weak, Jesus was Meek, but he stood boldly against the Religeous leaders of his day , Look at his meekness in the Garden of Gethsemane when he knew that he would die on the cross soon. SO I am content in my Love of God and being one of his children, I hope I have not offended anybody here with this post
Love Cheryl

Reply
 Message 11 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameCaringFlomar777Sent: 5/11/2008 8:39 PM
Cheryl my sweet sweet sister ....You Love God with all your heart .....what more could He want ..
 
You share His Love through yourself ...what more could He want .....
 
I am the owner of this little group ....and I cherish every member here ....
and here is where we can talk to each other without any qualms of being judged ....so hunny you just be you .
and say what you like ....for I know ...not one of us will judge you ......and you are the same as we are ..
we are all God's Children .....made in His image ..
so rest peacefully my sweet ..
I Love you ....and I am sure the rest of this little group do too ....
Hugs and more Marina.

Reply
 Message 12 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameCaringTHELMAMARIESent: 5/12/2008 1:52 AM
amen marina and thankd Hileena for your post..i left other group cause they were saying that i was deluded by satan about the laughter etc....marie

Reply
 Message 13 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN Nicknamemotherearth02Sent: 5/12/2008 1:38 PM
Thankyou for that I am glad you feel that way, we are all Gods children
Love Cheryl

Reply
 Message 14 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameCaringTHELMAMARIESent: 5/14/2008 8:43 AM
Yes Cheryl we are all Gods children and HE loves each and everyone of us.I feel same way as Marina sis,I used to catholic myself but slipped away then met my hubby who is a born again christian and i soon became one as well. Jesus is no respector of persons, HE loves us all. marie

Reply
 Message 15 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameHileena0Sent: 5/14/2008 5:34 PM
Hi Marie
Just read your post......I know....the other group have a few hotheads who  like nothing better than to be involved in an arguement and asking you to quote scripture to back things up etc.,....I know I'm assistant manager but very rarely say anything in the debates....but i do monitor them  LOL...sorry about the typing....fell yesterday and sprained my wrist and can only type with one hand.....what an excuse for typos  LOL
Love
Hileena

Reply
 Message 16 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameMarina4christ1Sent: 5/17/2008 6:45 AM
Hileena hun ....I am so sorry to hear about your fall
Please know that I am holding you in my prayers
 
I am late finding out .....because I have not been well myself and have spent the last few days either in bed or resting in my recliner .....today is the first time I have been active here ....
 
Love ya hun .....
Be healed in the name of Jesus .
huggies ......Marina.

Reply
 Message 17 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameHileena0Sent: 5/17/2008 7:43 AM
Hi Marina,
How do you feel now? As for me......my wrist is still sore but not nearly as sore as it was on Tues evening. I'm taking painkillers mixed with prayer 
 
Love
Hileena

Reply
 Message 18 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN Nicknamepenn17nzSent: 5/18/2008 6:04 PM
Hello everyone, I am new here but I have known Marina for about a year now. You know as with everything we have to go and check things out. I have also been in revival meetings. Some in the 1990's and again even this year. I have also been reading Todd Bentley's teachings for some years now and have found them to be quite scriptural. Here you are posting some message from a man called Andrew Strom. Who is this man? He hails from Auckland New Zealand. But now lives in the US. Someone said he is well known in New Zealand. Funny everyone I speak to has never heard of him. I live in New Zealand and move in Christian circles here.
I have done a google search and some are saying he runs a cult.
He is speaking out against most of what is happening in the church at this time. Not just the Lakeland revival. Now I don't agree with everything that is happening in the church today but if people are being saved and coming to Christ and being healed and set free, what is wrong with that? We need to look at the fruit. What is the fruit of the Lakeland Revival? Where is Andrew Strom's fruit?
And I have recently started to shake violently when I come into the Lord's presence myself. Not in a meeting, just at home in my own worship time. Not intentionally but when I yield to the Holy Spirit. I am the most reserved person. I didn't seek this only the presence of the Lord.
When God moves there will always be someone who tears it apart. We are spiritual beings living in a body and having a soul. Sometimes we can get a bit soulish. Nothing is ever perfect and entirely correct. I would end with saying this. Men criticized Jesus when He was on earth. God stuff doesn't always look good. Do you think Jesus casting out the demons from the man from Gadarene would have been done decently and in order? Imagine those thousands of demon possessed pigs racing into  the sea. Would that have looked very scriptural or spiritual to those watching?
 
Just adding my two cents worth here.
 
Blessings, Penny

Reply
 Message 19 of 19 in Discussion 
From: MSN Nicknamepenn17nzSent: 5/18/2008 6:17 PM
PS. I love the love that you have one for another in this group. I sense you are a special bunch of ladies. I certainly know Marina is special. The Lord has placed a love in my heart for her even though we haven't met. Maybe one day Marina.
And I also have roared with uncontrollable laughter in a meeting. But never during the prayertime. Always at the end during the ministry time.

First  Previous  5-19 of 19  Next  Last 
Return to General