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General : QOTD Thursday 9-18-08
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 Message 1 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameElGato196  (Original Message)Sent: 9/18/2008 12:41 PM
When purchasing ammunition, do you buy in bulk or as you need it (case vs a box)?


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Reply
 Message 2 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameElGato196Sent: 9/18/2008 12:42 PM
I buy as I need them, but guess I should buy a case of each for emergencies.

Reply
 Message 3 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameColin6686Sent: 9/18/2008 2:21 PM
It depends on how much I owe on the credit card at the time of purchase.  But, I usually get at least 200 rounds of each type when making a purchase.

Reply
 Message 4 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameCat-TNSent: 9/18/2008 2:23 PM
As I need it usually, but also would depend on how much I had to spend, and what kind of sales I might run across.

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 Message 5 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MSN Nicknamesarmack1Sent: 9/18/2008 5:19 PM
Ditto to what Cat-TN said.

Reply
 Message 6 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameriverChief6572Sent: 9/19/2008 2:27 AM
different type of ammo
 
i buy a box first until i find out
 
how good it is
 
and then a case for each weapon

Reply
 Message 7 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameLittlecherokee1970Sent: 9/19/2008 2:29 AM
as I need it.

Reply
 Message 8 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MasterGunnerSent: 9/19/2008 6:08 PM
It is best to only buy a box or two of ammo if you are changing brands or are adding a new caliber type.  There are three different kinds of cases that may or may not work in your pet firearm: (1) brass (including nickel-plated brass); (2) steel (including copper washed or enamel/lacquer/polymer coated steel); and (3) aluminum.
 
Most American and foreign manufacturers use brass cases.  Some American manufacturers use nickel-plated brass.  These cases work 99.999 percent of the time without a bobble.
 
Chinese 7.62x39 (AK, SKS), 7.62x54R (rifle, carbine), 7.62x25 (Tokarev), 9.2x18 (Makarov) ammunition is steel cased and copper washed.  Some commercial firearms do not like to function well with this kind of ammunition.  You should run several boxes of the copper washed steel cases through your pet firearm before investing a lot of money in case lots.
 
Ditto for Russian and Ukranian manufacture ammunition (Wolf, Brown Bear, Silver Bear) that use steel case with either a polymer or enamel/laquer coatings.  Some commercial firearms do not like the steel cases and/or the coatings.  One manufacturer, Wolf, recently changed the formulation of its coating to a very tough polymer that works quite well.  It supersedes another coating (not enamel or lacquer) that caused some fouling and extraction problems for about 18 months.
 
CCI/Blazer ammunition uses aluminum cases (one-shot, thow-aways) as a cost saving measure.  Some fiearms do not like the alumium cases.  In the instance that I witnessed, CCI/Blazer cases consistently stuck in the cylinder of a Ruger .44 Magnum revolver.  Considerable effort was required to remove these rounds.  Nickel-plated brass cases were used in this same pistol without an extraction problems whatsoever.  Again, you should try several boxes of this kind of ammunition in you pet firearm before you spring for a case lot of the stuff.
 
One other thing about military surplus foreign ammunition: watch out for corrosive primers.  As late as the early 1990s, some foreign mil-surp ammunition was still loaded with corrosive primers.  While most of this stuff has probably been shot-up by now, there were tons of it on the market and it is possible that you may have gotten some of it for you pet firearm.  The rule of thumb for shooting any foeign ammunition that you do not know whether it is corrosive or not: (1) clean the barrel and parts exposed to the primer residue with hot, soapy water; (2) dry the parts completely; (3) give the parts a light oiling; (4) repeat the cleaning process for three additional days after the day you shoot the firearm.  This is important because the primer residue contains salt that leaches moisture out of the air and causes rust on the steel parts.  Following this four day cleaning procedure will also reveal whether the primers are corrosive or non-corrosive.  The corrosive primers will show additional residue at each day's cleaning; the non-corrosive ones will be increasingly clean.  So why hot, soapy water?  Because it's the only thing that cuts the primer's salty residue.  Modern bore cleaners are reformulated for non-corrosive primers only.  They do not work on corrosive primers.  If you attempt to use them on corrosive primer residue, you will not remove it, and it will remain behind to do its evil rust and corrosion duty on your pet firearm.  Take it from one who knows (me).

Reply
 Message 9 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameElGato196Sent: 9/19/2008 7:30 PM
Master Guns, I know you are knowlegable in all things firearms. You've probably forgotten more about the subject than I will ever know. I respect and heed everything you say on a given topic on firearms and ammunition.
So why is it when you give a warning on a product (example: Wolf brand ammo), I not only want to avoid it, you instill the fear of God into me against even wanting to think about it? LOL

Reply
 Message 10 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameriverChief6572Sent: 9/19/2008 8:00 PM
i always consider
 
when i am buying ammo
 
will this round work if my life is in danger
 
handguns=corbon
 
5.56 & 6.8=remington or winchester

Reply
 Message 11 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MasterGunnerSent: 9/20/2008 12:29 PM
I'm not trying to frighten anyone, but I do feel that I should pass on some of the bits and pieces of experience for all concerned. 
 
The only times you should worry about safety with ammunition is when the rounds show signs of poor storage or abuse.  The first tipoff is what the shipping container looks like: a container that is not orgininal or looks like it was stowed on the bottom of somebody's bass boat or looks like it went through a couple of small wars, is not a good sign.  Likewise, check the condition of the ammo as it comes out of the box and check the manufacture dates on the military stuff.  The older it is, especially the foreign stuff, the more likely you are to have problems. 
 
Really old stuff -- WW2 vintage -- is still around.  I have several steel .30 caliber ammo boxes loaded with 1943 and 1944 .30-06 ammo that's just as good as the day it was made and it has corrosive primers!  I have friend who picked up some really old 7.92x57 JS (8mm Mauser rifle) ammo made for the German Army in 1937.  This stuff is corrosive primed and has some corrosion as well as neck splits.  If you find ammo that has corrosion or neck splits, you may want to consider disposal or breaking it down for components if you reload.  You should be able to salvage the powder and projectile.  The brass and primer should be scrapped.
 
Brass and nickel-plated brass are probably what 98 percent of us use in our guns.  However, the aluminum and steel cased stuff is about.  You should know the limitations that the use of these rounds may place on the reliability of your firearm. 
 
The domestic CCI/Blazer aluminum cased ammo is very inexpensive next to brass or nickel-plated brass.  However, it does cause extraction and ejection problems in some guns.  The Chicom copper washed steel cased ammo hasn't been imported since Bill Clinton cutoff import sales back in the early 1990's, there's still plenty of it at gun shows.  The former Soviet Union, its Republics, and former Warsaw Pact countries have stepped into that void left by the cutoff of the Chinese ammunition.  Some of these countries use brass cased ammo (Czech Republic is one), while others use steel cases coated in enamel, laquer, or polymer.  Why coated with copper or these others?  So the steel cases don't rust.
 
Why do the steel case (and aluminum cases) give problems?  Because all firearm chambers in the same caliber (example: 7.62x39mm) are not the same.  Some are tightly toleranced and some are losely toleranced.  This can affect extraction and ejection because steel cases (and aluminum cases) do not expand and contract from firing at the same rate as brass or nickel-plated brass cases.  The problem of dissimilar expansion and contraction can also be aggravated by the rust-preventative coatings.  As I said, some of the Wolf ammo produced within the last several years went from an enamel/lacquer coating to a polymer for reliability reasons. 
 
None of the manufacturers of ammunition purposely set out to cause problems and they do make safe ammunition in large quantities.  By and large, the flood of ammunition from both foreign and domestic production is very save and reliable.  However, there are many kinds of guns that can use this ammunition and they are not all that uniform for many various reasons. 
 
Be safe.  Know your firearm.  Know the kind of ammunition it prefers.  Test new brands of ammunition for function before you by case lots of it.  Ammo that causes problems in the reliability department is no bargain at any price.  Your money would be better spent on the tried and proven manufacturer's ammo.

Reply
 Message 12 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameriverChief6572Sent: 9/20/2008 8:32 PM
also in 5.56
 
American Eagle Tactical XM193

Reply
 Message 13 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MSN Nicknamesarmack1Sent: 9/20/2008 9:03 PM
My 2 cents. I like Wolf ammo. Yes it is does use steel cases but someone has yet to prove to me that it puts any extreme wear and tear on my weapons. I shoot it in 9mm, 45 ACP, 223 and 7.62x39. Once in every 500 plus rounds or so I get a FTE in one my AR-15s. Its good practice ammo and sometimes in todays market its the only thing you might be able to get.

Reply
 Message 14 of 14 in Discussion 
From: MSN Nickname♫CoolPapaCatDJ♫Sent: 9/20/2008 9:08 PM
If Wolf brand works for you, then right on! Noone is gonna knock you if it is a good ammo and doesn't foul your weapons. Others have had different experiences and all are welcome to comment!

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