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MattU posted this on jsf; it is, I think, an eloquent and spot on description of the current IT job market from someone who is in the IT trenches.

Bravo, MattU!

An eloquent post from MattU
 
This Place Has Become a Freak Show - MattU - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
I have been posting here for well over 5 years, all as this current screen-name.

Recently, I've come to the conclusion that there are a few "regulars" here who believe themselves to be the everlasting-know-it-alls whose judgements and pronouncements and opinions are some form of Holy Scripture. You all know who these people are, and so do they.

One of the most heated running debates is about the state of unemployed people in this country. Despite the flood of people here who are under/unemployed, a few people insist that there is absolutely nothing wrong and everyone who is under/unemployed is simply mistaken and/or lazy. The Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS) is often cited, despite repeated statements that BLS data is gathered only every few years and the data are only projections (educated guesses) which do not take into account current events. Yeah, OK there is nothing wrong with the economy, and all the people out of work are just not applying themselves effectively.

Another (but related) conspiracy theory is that all I.T. professionals "got what they deserved" because we/they were all overpaid for so long (a little jealousy there?). Thus out of work I.T. people don't deserve more than $10/hr.

So whenever I come here and see all the long threads about the aforementioned "theories" being argued back & forth by the same people (using different screen-names) it makes me chuckle and feel sorry for these people because they ascribe to the same old information and refuse to admit that they MIGHT be mistaken either in part or in full. How informed can you be when you spend all your time arguing on the Monster.Com JobSeeker Forum and playing "King of the Forum" all day..?

I know I'll probably get flamed for this post, but I've got to go to work pretty soon, and I don't need the validation of any "forum groupies" nor care about the scorn of self-appointed forum "deities." So flame away if you like; I don't care. It just illustrates the emptiness of some peoples' lives...

Matt U.

 
Re: This Place Has Become a Freak Show - NeoRetro - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
Well, here's the first flame.

1.) BLS data is gathered DAILY. It is published weekly. It is the most accurate picture possible of the American labor market. Its purpose and mission is NOT to depict the human misery of unemployment and/or under-employment, its mission and purpose to tho tell the goverment and its leadership along wiht industry, who the unemployed and under employed are, where they are, which labor groups the blong as a measure of un or under-utilized human capital. Maybe you don't like that, but that is how it is. Argue with Roosevelt.

2.)The data collected and computed by the BLS is accurate. It needs to be accurate to be of any use at all. The VAST majority of the people working at the BLS are life-long employees, not politcal appoinments.

3.) Some IT people WERE overpaid during the shortage of trained/experienced IT people in certain categories. This entire economy runs on the supply and demand system. It you are in over-supply or under-demand your pay will drop. Get used to that fact of life. KNOWING that fact, it is up to all unemployed or soon to be unemployed people to find where in the marketplace they would be in demand again. In other words - where the shortages are. That can be physical location like moving from San Francisco to Montana or is could be switching from Net Admin to Net Security Admn.

 
Re: This Place Has Become a Freak Show - tiredsecy - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
*stands up clapping* BRAVO!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Re: This Place Has Become a Freak Show - tiredsecy - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
the clapping, was for Matt U
 
Re: This Place Has Become a Freak Show - NeoRetro - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
That is very typical, tiredcranyB. Cheer for the person who doesn't know what they are talking about.
 
Matt, - alltruistic - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
there are some of us who do care, and always will. Your post is definitely understood, and I agree, particularly in terms of the frustration. Just hang in there. We need you around.
 
Delos, Matt's point was not - CatOuttaHell - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
that IT people weren't overpaid, but rather that $10/hr is TOO LOW and is NOT the market worth for these people.
I think he's RIGHT that people who were/are jealous or angry about IT salaries before are now devaluing those jobs and gloating.
 
Delos, - alltruistic - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
don't you ever read between the lines? Do you have to take everything so literally? Sometimes there is more to a message than mere words. Don't be so doggone staunch about everything. Try being a little more human, unless you find it makes you too "vulnerable". Of anybody here, you should have developed some of the thickest skin. You've allowed the Forum to wear you down.
 
Re: This Place Has Become a Freak Show - tiredsecy - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
delos/neo/whatever, are you saying that what Matt presented wasn't viable or logical? He presented a very good point, and you disputing it doesn't make it less.

Matt complained about the flame wars disintegrating this place -- and what you're doing is a prime example of it. The name calling's gotten old, find a new trick, troll.

 
Re: MattU - TabooThought - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
Thank you very much. Very well said!
 
tired, - alltruistic - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
do you realize that you just accused him of the same thing you just did? You are becoming, if not already, self-perpetuating.
 
Here's the problem - NeoRetro - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
When you try to "read between the lines" of posters here, you ALWAYS run a considerable risk of getting the wrong message. People who read things into words written by others, insert their own thought and prejudices into those wors. It is human nature. I write literally and I desrie me words to be taken exactly as I wrote them. I do not imply and I do not use double entendres and I do not suggest. I same what I mean and I mean what I say.

Having been attacked daily and viciously by the most hateful people who have ever joined this board for over 3 years, I DO have the thickest skin of any user of this board.

 
MattU, I missed one point. - NeoRetro - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
The economy isn't GREAT, but it isn't terrible either. The average unemployment for the past 30 years has been 5.8% vs. 6.2% now. It reached over 11% when Reagan was fixing Jimmie Carter's terrible inflation problem.

 
Re: Here's the problem - CatOuttaHell - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
It's not a thick skin you've got, Delos.
It's prickly armour.
 
Re: This Place Has Become a Freak Show - tiredsecy - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
alt, if you've been frequenting the board, you would have noticed that there are two issues I'm presenting. One that there is something to take from Matt's post and that it has a point, and that Neo/Doc tends to come on boards and try to start knocking things out the window, which only further boosts Matt's very eloquent point. The second issue is the namecalling doc/neo/truth/ tends to do on a fairly regular basis -- and how is that conducive?
 
Delos, you know - CatOuttaHell - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
damn well that Reagan didn't fix anything. He was just a figurehead with Miss Clairol Orange hair.
He slept through most of his presidency. He was like the nation's dear ol' grandpa.
 
tired, while I sometimes find - CatOuttaHell - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
Delos annoying, I have also found him helpful and informative.
You, on the other hand, I just find TIRED.
 
Re: This Place Has Become a Freak Show - tiredsecy - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
Matt wrote a very thought provoking and well written post. It's made even more thought provoking by the fact that it's since disintegrated...
 
Re: This Place Has Become a Freak Show - tiredsecy - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
Hi Cat -- congratulations on getting your banned handle back. Now back to our regularly scheduled program.
 
Re: Delos, you know - NeoRetro - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
You need to read a book or two about Reagan's term in office that is NOT written by a leftist or anyone with an agenda. He was responsible for the recovery that we enjoyed for 18 years.
 
Re: Delos, you know - CatOuttaHell - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
His ADMINSTRATION was responsible for it.
HE doesn't have the intelligence to think his way out of a wet paper bag.
 
Re: This Place Has Become a Freak Show - tiredsecy - 10/23/2003 - 3:01:41 PM
Reagan left us with a a HUUUUUGE deficit and a bunch of IOU's that took several presidents including Clinton to recover. I'm not in love with Reagan. That does not make me a liberal, as you know, doc.