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| Hi, I am trying to find the family of Jane CARR, born 20th April, 1825 in Donegal, Ireland. This is all the info I have on her before she came to Australia. This was some time between her birth and her marriage to a Thomas Smith(b.1819, Limerick, Ire.) on 31/10/1842, East Maitland, NSW, Australia. She died here according to family records, on the 9th Sept, 1891. Finding the right death certificate for a Jane Smith in Australia is difficult as it is a common name. The ones I have purchased so far have been incorrect as I thought they may have provided a little extra info on Jane's parents names. I really am hoping that someone out there may be able to help... I have written to a number of people through a website mentioned here, as they were also looking for Carr's of Donegal but only heard back from one who was unsure of details for his Carr's as well. Jane CARR is the lady who links those of us left in my family and I am hoping to be able to find something more to tell my mum's much older cousin. As an aside, I am not sure who has undertaken dna tests for geneaological research. I have done the mitochondrial one, that was mentioned in the book 'The seven daughters of Eve' by Bryan Sykes. It is through Jane CARR that I received my mitchondria apparently so this little lady is of particular interest for that as well. For those who know about this line of research, the result was the daughter 'Helena' with a refined result of 'H3'. It's all good and bless you all. Have a great day. Regards Adele Wheatley | |
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Rest assured Adele I've been searching the shipping lists too but as you say, it could have been they were travelling in steerage - I'd not actually thought about that one! Kay Manager |
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Hi Kay,
yes, I saw that possibility mentioned on a website I was looking at in regards to another persons missing relative. '
I actually heard from my cousins wife today and she made a trip to the local genealogy group and had a look through the shipping list for the 'Herald' and there was no listing at all even with the 'Kerr' and similar spellings. The lady volunteer at the FHC who was helping my cousins wife also checked records to see if Jane was on the Bounty immigrant and Deposit Journal lists (sponsored immigrants) but no luck there either.
I might just have to wait and see if those certificates I have ordered turn up anything, that will be at least another 4-5 weeks before they get here being the backlog at the family research part of the BDM's is 8-9 weeks.
There wasn't any search done to see if she was going under the name of 'Smith' and with that funny anomolous record of her name being 'Flynn' on one of her children's death certificates I am beginning to suspect something is rather amiss.
Kay, I don't want to be wasting your time with this one so if you think waiting for the certificates would be better then that is is a good way to go at present.
Regards,
Adele |
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Hi Adele Well, generally speaking, I do feel that if certificates are applied for then on the whole that's probably the best bet - purely because it's the only way of being 100% certain of anything. However, I also feel no research is wasted so I think even though there is another 4-5 weeks to wait for your certificates to come through, there's no harm in going through the shipping lists. Marian has provided me with some places to search and I'm gradually working through these - so far without success but you just never know! Perhaps I'll just continue with this for the time being and post anything I do find for you but then you could come back to me when you have the information for certain. Meanwhile, of course, if you come across anything yourself, do get back to me at any time. Worth checking back here regularly just in case but rest assured I'm still searching for you. Best wishes. Kay Manager |
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Hi Kay,
thanks for that, and I will definitely get back to you as soon as I find anything out.
Regards,
Adele |
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Ok Adele and like I say, should I find anything on the shipping lists I will certainly post here for you. Kay Manager |
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Hi again Adele Marian found some information on the Carr family from the correct area when we first started looking for your ancestors. We both thought it best to post this for you as hopefully once you have more information on Jane some of this will make more sense! Raphoe Wills 1684-1858 Index to Wills
Diocese of Raphoe
1684 - 1858 N.B. The Diocese of Raphoe includes almost all of County Donegal Vol 5 Index to Irish Wills -Thrift
First Name Last Name Description of the
Kerr person Date
Matthew Kerr Moyle
1845
John Kerr Portline
1716 Derry Wills 1684-1858
Vol5 Index to Irish Wills -Thrift First Name Last Name Description of the
Kerr person Date Daniel Kerr Castletoothery Killowea
1803
Grizell Kerr Widow Londonderry City
1717
James Kerr dunboe
1672
James Kerr/carr ardstraw
1766
James Kerr crigadick maghera
1803
John Kerr urbelreagh ardstraw
1753
John Kerr aughasesy
1785
John Kerr aughasesy
1811
John Kerr ballindrate
1844
Marion Kerr londonderry
1670
Owen Kerr drinowen lower
longfield 1813
Patrick Kerr stranameagh ardstraw
1779
Patrick Kerr milltown
1849
Robert Kerr stanameagh ardstraw
1753
Robert Kerr drimaony donagheady
1828
Thomas Kerr rabride
1726
Thomas Kerr carnkenny/ardstraw
1767
william Kerr tanlaghtfinlagan moyse
1833
william Kerr tanlaghtfinlagan moyse
1834 john Ker mariner londonderry city
1670
Ninian Ker dardries dunboe
1717 ******************************************************* DROMORE
CARR - Isabella, Mary ______________________
Surname, Firstname (title/status); location; date
Carr, Denis; Tullygay; 1773
Carr, Edward; Tunbane, p. Clondevadock; 1808
Carr, John (seaman); ; 1823
Carr, Matthew; Ardruman; 1804
Carr, Myles; Casel; 1809
The 1796 Spinning Wheel Premium Entitlements List
Carr, Matthew - Tully
Carr, Thomas - Killymard Tithe Applotment Book for the Parish of Culdaff, signed 15th July 1829 Carr, Mark, Aghatubbrid
Carr, Robert, Aghatubbrid
Carr, William, Aghatubbrid PARISH OF GARTAN, 1833
Carr Bryan 1 Stramore Upper
Carr Daniel 3 Stramore Upper
Carr Hugh 1/2 Glendowan Beg
Carr Hugh 1 Stramore Upper
Carr James 1/2 Glendowan Beg
Carr James 1 Stramore Upper
Carr Manus 1 1/2 Stramore Upper
Carr Owen 2 1/4 Ardachrin
Carr Widow 1 1/2 Stramore Upper
Carre James 3 3/4 Barracktown
Carre Manus 3 1/4 Losset Carre
Carre Owen 3 1/4 Losset Carre
Carre Widow 3 1/4 Losset Carre
Parishes of Killybegs Upper and Lower, Signed 1834
Carr, Michl., Largysallagh Parish of Tullaghobegly, 1830
CARR, Hugh, Goala Tithe Applotment Book
Laconnell East & West and Meentashesk
Diocese of Raphoe - Parish of Enniskeel (Inishkeel) 1833 Laconnell West
John Carr " 4 2 13 14 11 3 0 Kay Manager |
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Hi Kay,
thank you for that. I still haven't got the certificates yet and hopefully when I do at least one of them will be the right one.... it would have been good if the church where they got married had taken more details with the common surnames Thomas and Jane had! I have another couple from a different line who got married in the Hunter Valley area like them as well and their details were as sparse... thankfully at least it was a 2nd marriage and I already had a fair bit of information for that line and ended up tracking down more info through the LDS.
Thanks again for all your help.
Regards,
Adele
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Hi Adele You're very welcome and Marian has also found the following which may be of interest to you: Kay Manager |
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Hi Kay, I got the certificates finally and not one of them is connected with Jane or her husband Thomas. However, I was perusing the ydna surname projects on family tree dna and there was a Carr tested with earliest known ancestor from Donegal, Ireland about the right time, so I am thinking this would be a relative of Jane's and it gives me the genetic origins of these Carr's which was something I was wanting to know. I also noted a Jane Kerr entry into Oz about the right time but haven't had a chance to follow this up through the Oz national archives shipping lists yet. I have been having as much fun tracking down the Burns' from Ireland too, they all seem to disappear in Ireland for soem reason??? ... and would you believe I have another Thomas Smith from another line of my mums from the UK... and no, I am not going there lol! Thanks for all your help. Adele |
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You're very welcome Adele and thanks for letting us know. You know where we are if you need further help. Kay Manager |
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Hi Kay,
Well, my cousin in law got hold of the last possible certificate for Jane, I called it the Murphys law certificate because it was the last one I would have looked at.
See what put me off that certificate initially was the wrong surname for her dad... Kelly not Carr/Kerr. It said on the BDMs list that father was 'unknown Kelly' and no mother mentioned. ... and they expect you to buy it potluck... which i had already bought a few too many that ended up wrong.
Anyway, I have found a Jane Kelly came into Oz 1841 on the Duchess of Northumberland. There was also a Patrick, don't know if he was connected???
Anyway, I have had a look at the LDS records and they have a Jane Kelly baptised July 1825(Jane was born 20th April). The parents were listed as Daniel Kelly and Mary Hayes. They married in 1815 in Donaghmore, Donegal, where Jane was also born/xtianed. Pretty good chance this is her.
I saw this one a while back but it said Donaghmore was in Tyrone(next to Donegal actually) but I ran a search today and Donaghmore is actually in Donegal not Tyrone. Not to mention that when I first posted the news clipping you said how close they were anyway... so I now have a myself a handy Ireland counties map on the desk top for quick reference.
That news clipping from that wedding my cousin in law and I thought Jane had witnessed, it shows that the bride was born in Donaghmore, Donegal... I think that it's possible that Jane either got given the spelling that the recorder could give and hence forth it was written Carr from the first document or that she changed her name when she got here to start a new life as many did with new names to boot. Can't be positive but it does seem feasible.
"Patrick Doherty, son of Philip and Mary Doherty nee O'Dougharty, born 1st April 1815 in Ramelton, Co. Donegal, Ireland, arrived in Sydney, with his parents, aboard the "Herald" on the 15th July 1841 and died 20th December 1895, age 80yrs., at Raymond Terrace NSW. Patrick, of Nelsons Plains, married Ann 'Nancy' Gallen, daughter of William Gallen and Bridget Gallagher of Phoenix Park, on the 17th April 1842 in St. Joseph's Catholic Church, East Maitland NSW. The priest was Rev. Father E. Mahony and the witnesses were John Gallen and Jane Carr. Ann or Nancy, born 22nd June 1822 in Donoughmore, Co. Donegal, arrived in Sydney, with her parents, aboard the "Herald" on the 15th July 1841 and died 16th July 1890, age 70yrs., in Morpeth NSW. Patrick and Ann resided at Brandon, Seaham NSW. "
Anyway, I think the riddle may have been solved... right surnames always help!!! Every other certificate, marriage and the children's birth ones all said Carr(when she was givng the details), it was only the death for herself(father Kelly) and one of her children it said she was a Flynn. it's a bit of an odd one... but I think at this point no more hair is required to pulled out :-)
Thanks again for your help.
Adele |
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Hi Adele Thanks for letting us know about all this! As you say, at least the riddle has been solved - it just goes to show how you can't discount anything - spellings of names, etc etc. So pleased that you've got to the bottom of it all. Well done. Kay Manager |
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Hi Kay, just one more thing with this Jane, I am wondering if either you or any of the other managers knows of an online passenger record list for the ship the 'Herald' 1841. There's one I think for the 1850's but the one I need is 1841 for this Jane. There's record on the Oz Archives for 1841. Thanks in advance. Adele |
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Hi Jane I did have a good look a few weeks ago now to see if I could find her on any ship lists for the Herald but without success. I will have another look for you to see if anything does arise and if so, naturally I'll happily post it here for you. Kay Manager |
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Thanks Kay.
Maybe there was a Kelly or O'Kelly family came in. Just thought she may have come in on that ship as the friends did...
While I was having a look around for passenger lists, I had a read of what they had to go through and really probably lucky that any family got out here at all. There was one ship commended for it's cleanliness and how ALL the passengers were alive when they got here and there was another where more than 3/4 had died in transit(Whooping cough and something else) and the comment was that the ship was filthy. Some more of the passengers died whilst in quarantine as well. Can't remember the ship names.
Regards,
Adele |
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