|
|
 |
Reply
| |
| From: russ (Original Message) | Sent: 2007/02/18 08:26 PM | | Hi - Thanks for having me, hope you can help. I want to trace my great grandfather surname Watkins, Christian name unknown.He was a clock and watchmaker by trade. He was married to Mary Ann Evans who was born in Tretire Hereford in 1828. On the 1881 census Mary now aged 53 was a widow, she and her son Sidney James now living with her brother George at 5 Stanhope Street, Abergavenny.Sidney was born in Manchester in 1862 there could be other siblings.Sidney married Alice maiden name unknown she was from Weymouth.There were five births 1901 census: Alice Maude Archibald Lillian Cecil George Gladys. Much obliged Russ. | |
|
Reply
| |
Incidentally, Emily Bencett is listed as sister-in-law, married. So now we know Mary Ann had at least one sister. Kay Manager |
|
Reply
| |
Hi again Russ Marian, one of our managers, has just pointed out to me that in fact the census image itself states that William is recorded as "Watch maker and postmaster". My error - in haste I thought it was clock maker also. I still feel this is the correct individual though, based on the information we have about his wife, Mary Ann and her year and place of birth. My apologies for confusion but hope this helps. Kay Manager |
|
Reply
| | | From: russ | Sent: 2/9/2008 11:26 AM |
hi kay. thanks for your help.i knew he was a watchmaker but did not know he was a postmaster.with the information i had i applied for a marriage certificate,i attach gro reply.what do you make of it. regards russ. |
| | ancestor5.jpg |
Reply
| |
Hi Russ Not that it's any consolation, but this has happened to me before now also. What the reply from GRO means is that in this instance the William Watkins shown under the entry for Dec 1851 Monmouth 26 101 was not married to Mary Ann Evans on the same page - his marriage would have been to one of the other women listed, ie: Martha Chalcroft, Diana Richards or Elizabeth Willets. In other words, this is not the William Watkins you are looking for. What a shame - at first glance it would appear that you had found the correct one. You will be refunded the balance of your payment which is something. Meanwhile I will see if anything further is forthcoming on another entry we may have missed. Kay Manager |
|
Reply
| |
Of course I have made the assumption that Emley Bencett was William's sister-in-law via Mary Ann but of course she could have been the wife of a brother of William. I will see if I can find out! Kay Manager |
|
Reply
| |
Well I've looked for William on the 1861 census and found him living with his sister and brother-in-law (and their children) as follows. The slight discrepancy I have is that William is recorded as having an occupation of either Sawyer or Lawyer - this is not clear from the census image. Of course, people did change occupations then in much the same way they do now but my findings will make more sense as you follow through the next couple of messages I post. Do read on! 1871 Census: Charles Morgan b: 1814 St Weonards, Hereford (Head) - Sawyer/Lawyer Matilda Morgan b: 1826 St Weonards, Hereford (Wife) Caroline Morgan b: 1851 St Weonards, Hereford (Daughter) George Morgan b: 1853 St Weonards, Hereford (Son) Richard Morgan b: 1856 St Weonards, Hereford (Son) Charles Morgan b: 1859 St Weonards, Hereford (Son) William Watkins b: 1829 St Weonards, Hereford (Brother-in-law) - Sawyer/Lawyer Residence: (looks like) Mushiorn, St Weonards, Hereford. Now, from this I have worked out Matilda is William's brother and then found the following marriage record: | Surname | First name(s) | | District | Vol | Page | |
Marriages Jun 1850 (>99%) | Kay Manager |
|
Reply
| |
So from there I looked for William on the 1851 and found him as follows: Samuel Watkins b: 1799 St Weonards (Head) - Shoemaker Margaret Watkins b: 1796 Herefordshire (Wife) William Watkins b: 1828 St Weonards (Son) Emma Watkins b: 1839 St Weonards (Daughter) Samuel Watkins b: 1842 St Weonards (Son) Residence: Broad Oak, St Weonards. By this time, of course, Matilda the eldest daughter was already married to Charles Morgan. Kay Manager |
|
Reply
| |
Now the children's birth records are as follows - for some reason it only shows the christening dates but that's helpful anyway: Matilda Watkins - christened - 5.6.1824 St Weonards William Watkins - christened - 12.8.1827 St Weonards Emma Watkins - christened - 26.5.1838 St Weonards Samuel Watkins - christened - 16.10.1842 St Weonards. Kay Manager |
|
Reply
| |
This is the birth record I was able to find for Margaret - William's mother:  | | | |
Event(s): | | Birth: | | Christening: | | 06 AUG 1797 | Saint Weonards, Hereford, England | | | Death: | | Burial: | Alas I can't find any obvious record for Samuel's birth. By the same token I haven't managed to find a marriage record for Margaret's parents - as we can see her mother was Anne though. Kay Manager |
|
Reply
| |
I've found an entry for the 1841 census but it doesn't include William. It's difficult to locate William on this census as he's not with his family as, of course, he could be recorded as a visitor with anyone - but we don't know who! Still, this is what I've found for the rest of the family. By the way Samuel Watkins (as recorded marrying Margaret Snead in St Weonards) is listed with the spelling Samuell - this is also the case (though I didn't realise at the time) in the 1851 census. Either way I'm confident it is one and the same person. Samuell Watkins b: 1798 Herefordshire - Watchmaker Margaret Watkins b: 1798 Herefordshire Caroline Watkins b: 1830 Herefordshire Mary Watkins b: 1832 Herefordshire Stephen Watkins b: 1835 Herefordshire Emma Watkins b: 1838 Herefordshire With regards Mary and Stephen Watkins, I can't find a birth record for either of these when searching for the children of parents Samuel and Margaret. It's clearly possible these were William's siblings and they could have died or be registered elsewhere on the later censuses. Alternatively they could be other relations, perhaps niece and nephew of Samuell, though due to the fact the 1841 census doesn't give as many helpful details as later ones, we don't know for sure. Hope this is of help. Kay Manager |
|
Reply
| |
Thought I would check to see if there was a Stephen or Mary Watkins with the relevant birth dates/places on the 1851 census and sure enough I have found both - as being born in St Weonards and both (living at different addresses) listed as servants. I think we can assume these are siblings of William. I have also checked William's entry on the 1841 but alas I can't pinpoint him due to the fact there are quite a number of William Watkins born around 1829 in Hereford - it could be any of them even after discarding who are clearly with their parents. However, we do know now who his parents were and his later family. There was just one entry for marriage of a William Watkins that I thought MIGHT be a possible and I will list this below. Kay Manager |
|
Reply
| |
Actually the above is quite ridiculous suggestion now I come to think about it more carefully. William was listed on the 1851 census as single and living with his parents so I'm afraid this marriage record again wouldn't apply. I thought it best not to delete my last entry as you would probably want to follow through my findings but as you see clearly see, it really doesn't add up at all. My apologies. Kay Manager |
|
Reply
| |
Just one last attempt to find this elusive marriage brought forward the following: | Surname | First name(s) | | District | Vol | Page |
Marriages Mar 1866 | It is the only other marriage record showing for a William Watkins and Mary Evans (on the same page, though as before in the certificate you applied for, there were two other names on that page, so not 100% guarantee they married each other!). On the basis though that we have found William on the 1861 census as single with his sister and brother-in-law, but then married on the 1871 census, I do feel reasonable sure this could be the correct marriage. Kay Manager |
|
|
|
Free Forum Hosting
Important Announcement
First
Return to Surnames W to Z