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| | From:  Burner529 (Original Message) | Sent: 6/7/2004 12:23 AM |
why do we do the shit we do to ourselves, knowing its a bad idea? probably because we're addicts n cant help it. Hi, havent been on in awhile. figured id check in because... well im an idiot. lol. anyway i was on 90mg of meth and over the last couple months (not sure how many anymore) i lowered myself to 10mg. was feeling fine..a-ok. so my clinic suggested i switch to suboxone. i said what the hell, because my brother was on meth and dope and he went on suboxone thru a private doctor and the doctor gave him the medicine for 1 week (approx 10days). and then he was done.. no sickness, nothing. he was fine. (but because he really didnt wanna stop he started using again after he was done). so they put me on suboxone. and it was going good. BUT my clinic is trying to keep people on it like its a fucking matinence thing. i was on 4mg for like 2 weeks, then 2mg for 2 weeks. then they dropped me to 1mg... and like the idiot i am i slipped and used. and even though they say "it blocks it, you wont feel it." thats bullshit. i felt it fine. very fine. aaaaaaahhrrrggghhh. memories... so im at 1mg and i started to feel sick from it.. withdrawl sick couple days after. so i asked em to bring me back to 2mg. the "Ingenious" doctor goes "how bout we give u 2mg one day, none the next, then 2mg the day after and so on" i said "how is that gonna help? i was sick at 1mg" he goes "well your detoxing your gonna feel sick" and i replied "well my brother and his girlfriend went to the private doctor and they were on it a week or so and they had NO withdrawl symptoms at all so why should i feel them?" he didnt have an answer. see, what their doing is using the meth patients who wanna get off meth as guinea pigs, because they dont know what type of dosing actually works well. and because of this my ass started using again. now i Could just go to the private doctor my brother and his girl went to but he wants $650 for the treatment. and well, probably like most addicts, i dont have that $$. so im stuck. and still using. i HAVE to stop. i have a bag here. been using every day for like 2 weeks. only like 1-2 bags a day (iv). but i got dosed this morning (2mg) and i didnt use yet today. and i honestly dont want to, because i dont really feel so bad today. but what im doing (in my mind) is saying "keep the bag for tomorrow, because you might need it if u feel sick from not getting dosed" but honestly my willpower sucks. i know i should just go flush the fucker but come on... u know how we are/used to be. sigh... anyway, just felt like emptyin my head to someone/anyone who would listen. OH yeah they said "your gonna have to go back on meth because this suboxone isnt working" and i told them i Do NOT want to go back on meth, because in my eyes/mind it makes me feel as if i failed.. which i kinda did. the human brain is intrigueing (sp?). welp im off. thanks for listenin. Jasun |
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Jasun, you
didn't fail you had what we all have endured an old fashion slip if anything the
system has failed you with the incompetence of the so-called medical experts in
the clinic.
Going back to
methadone, if that's what is needed that is not a failure on the contrary that
show's me that you really want recovery and you are willing to use whatever
tools that will work for you. And methadone is a tool that allot of us find nec
to be on for a set period of time or some like myself need it for life and I
have no problem at all with that. At one time early on I did have a problem with
staying on meth more because of the stigma that society puts on you and dealing
with the clinic environment and this was in the late
70"s.
IMO, you should
get stabilized on a dose whether it be bup or meth which ever one works the best
for you. I don't know how your clinic charges for your bup but it is quite
expensive and it's in the clinics best financial interest to have people on the
lowest dose they can get away with,they would deny it but I'm not saying all the
clinics participate in this practice as there are good clinics out there trying
to do the right thing.
Claude
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, June 06, 2004 7:23 PM
Subject: Meth 2 Suboxone....
Meth 2
Suboxone....
Reply
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| From: Burner529 |
why do we do the shit we do to ourselves, knowing its a bad
idea? probably because we're addicts n cant help it. Hi,
havent been on in awhile. figured id check in because... well im
an idiot. lol. anyway i was on 90mg of meth and over the last
couple months (not sure how many anymore) i lowered myself to
10mg. was feeling fine..a-ok. so my clinic suggested i switch to
suboxone. i said what the hell, because my brother was on meth
and dope and he went on suboxone thru a private doctor and the
doctor gave him the medicine for 1 week (approx 10days). and
then he was done.. no sickness, nothing. he was fine. (but
because he really didnt wanna stop he started using again after
he was done). so they put me on suboxone. and it was going good.
BUT my clinic is trying to keep people on it like its a fucking
matinence thing. i was on 4mg for like 2 weeks, then 2mg for 2
weeks. then they dropped me to 1mg... and like the idiot i am i
slipped and used. and even though they say "it blocks it, you
wont feel it." thats bullshit. i felt it fine. very fine.
aaaaaaahhrrrggghhh. memories... so im at 1mg and i started to
feel sick from it.. withdrawl sick couple days after. so i asked
em to bring me back to 2mg. the "Ingenious" doctor goes "how
bout we give u 2mg one day, none the next, then 2mg the day
after and so on" i said "how is that gonna help? i was
sick at 1mg" he goes "well your detoxing your gonna feel sick"
and i replied "well my brother and his girlfriend went to
the private doctor and they were on it a week or so and they had
NO withdrawl symptoms at all so why should i feel them?" he
didnt have an answer. see, what their doing is using the meth
patients who wanna get off meth as guinea pigs, because they
dont know what type of dosing actually works well. and because
of this my ass started using again. now i Could just go to the
private doctor my brother and his girl went to but he wants $650
for the treatment. and well, probably like most addicts, i dont
have that $$. so im stuck. and still using. i HAVE to stop. i
have a bag here. been using every day for like 2 weeks. only
like 1-2 bags a day (iv). but i got dosed this morning (2mg) and
i didnt use yet today. and i honestly dont want to, because i
dont really feel so bad today. but what im doing (in my mind) is
saying "keep the bag for tomorrow, because you might need it if
u feel sick from not getting dosed" but honestly my
willpower sucks. i know i should just go flush the fucker but
come on... u know how we are/used to be. sigh...
anyway, just felt like emptyin my head to someone/anyone
who would listen.
OH yeah they said "your gonna have to go back on meth
because this suboxone isnt working" and i told them i Do NOT
want to go back on meth, because in my eyes/mind it makes me
feel as if i failed.. which i kinda did. the human brain is
intrigueing (sp?). welp im off. thanks for listenin.
Jasun | |
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| | | From: Marco | Sent: 6/7/2004 6:30 PM |
Jasun- Just to give you some background on me: I'm on bup (maintenance) and have been for over a year now. Took me a little while to get clean, but since then no problems at all. I've been on 32mg a day and cut back to 24mg a day about a month ago. I wanna address a few things you wrote. First, as far as it blocking opiates, bup definitely does, but you have to be at a MUCH higher dose than 2mg. Everyone is different, but my experience was anything less than 16mg, I could feel it if I shot up. The reason your doc suggested giving you 2mg every other day is cuz it has a VERY long half-life, it lasts way longer than methadone (although people seem to react very differently). If I skip a day of bup I don't feel anything at all. But by taking 2mg every other day the amount in your body is slowly being decreased; after doing that for a few days he would probably change it to 1 mg, etc. But if you're shooting up every day, 2mg every other day or even every day isn't enough to keep you from going into withdrawal. No way. As far as the reason you felt withdrawal and your brother didn't, my guess (and it's only a guess) is that it's cuz you used. If you use and take suboxone too soon after using it can put you into pretty severe withdrawal. Many people make the mistake of thinking that if you shoot up while on bup you will go into withdrawal, but actually the opposite is true. That's why when they start you on suboxone they wait until you're in withdrawal before letting you take it; it's also why you have to get to such a low dose of methadone; if you took bup when you were on a high dose of methadone you'd go into immediate withdrawal- not from the naloxone, but from the bup itself. And finally, and I know you're not gonna like this and I'm sorry to be harsh, but you can't blame the suboxone for your using. That was your choice. But you can still put that behind you. Quit using and finish the detox (or do maintenance with the bup) or go back on methadone. There's no use beating yourself up about it. The point is to act now to get yourself out of the situation you're in- where you're using to fight off withdrawal. That's gonna mean going up to a higher dose of bup and then doing either maintenance or tapering (slowly) or going back on meth. I agree totally with Claude. You should think about what's really important- staying clean or feeling like a failure cuz you're back on meth or on suboxone or whatever. Being on a maintenance program doesn't equate with failure- as you yourself have proved. Don't let what might just be junkie pride masquerading as a feeling of failure keep you away from whatever type of program works for you. My best wishes and hopes that you find what works for you- Marco |
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welp, i couldnt deal with it and told em to switch me back to methadone, im back on 10mg. and i feel ok. although i keep "slipping" every couple days. i mean i can go like a day r 2 days and feel ok, but i keep using to "Feel" it not because i feel sick and need it. i need to work thru this like i did the first time over 2yrs ago when i started meth. hopefully when i stop again this time, i can keep myself from "trying" some again. aaaah i dunno what else to say right now i got a massive headache cause my sinuses are killin me because of this horrible weather here in delaware.. hot n humid one minute, chilly/cool out the next. this is the only state where u can have all 4 seasons in one day i swear. anyway thanks alot for everyones advice. i appreciate it. ill check back in now n again n let ya know how everything is goin. Thanks Jay |
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New member hear, been on meth 27 years, am 51 year grandfather, been doing good since about mid 80's. was getting a month og f take homes from my clinic, been on 60 mils for about 10 of the last 27. One day went in a saw this old old man waiting on line to get his meth, I've seen him before but this time he looked old, talked to him said he was almost 63. Right then & there I said I have to get off this shit, basically detoxed myself in 3 months, was surprised I did not feel so bad, but I too was directed to suboxone, seemed to help with the leg cramps etc, but could not sleep & my heart was racing all the time, doctor said that is not from suboxone, but later found it definatley was. I was told this would be very easy to get off, well it is not. I am going on a month this week,right now I am trying not to take my dose but can not see me getting thru the day. I too do not want to go back on meth, I guess suboxone is good fro herion addiction or other type drugs but not long term methadone. Was told he never had a patient that been on meth as long as me & not much research on it so I guess I am a guinne pig. any one have any opinions on this |
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Hi Spacetunes,
I don't know much about coming off subuxone or methadone, but I think you are right about the guinea pig thing. I'm on a psych nursing practiccum for school, and everyday I see people treated with drugs that are so new that no long term studies have been done. These drugs usually bring some relief, which is good, but sometimes the bad side effects don't show up until later. The medical community tends to sort of cover it up, and tell patients "This drug doesn't cause that side effect because it's not in the CPS book." Unfortunately, it takes people experiencing adverse effects, and then controlled studies to change the CPS, so doctors really don't know, and patients have to figure it out without support.
I'm talking about psych meds, but I think it's a similar situation. I don't know what the solution is. Hopefully methadone and subuxone have both been more helpful than harmful for you. I hope you can fine the information you need, and keep posting so the rest of us can learn.
-Curiosity |
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