ALL MY TUDORS...history chat

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After the Romans left, the city of London fell into a decline. That's a polite way of saying that the population diminished drastically and large areas of the city were left in ruins. London's location on the Thames was too good for this decline to continue, and the 7th century saw trade once more expand and the city grow once more. Early in that century, perhaps in 604 AD, the first St. Paul's Cathedral was founded, on the site now occupied by the present St. Paul's. By the 9th century, London was a very prosperous trading centre, and its wealth attracted the attention of Danish Vikings. The Danes periodically sailed up the Thames and attacked London. In 851 some 350 longboats full of Danes attacked and burned London to the ground.

The Danes did not have it all their own way. In 1014 they were occupying the city when a large force of Anglo-Saxons and Norwegian Vikings sailed up the Thames to attack London. The Danes lined London Bridge and showered the attackers with spears. Undaunted, the attackers pulled the roofs off nearby houses and held them over their heads in the boats. Thus protected, they were able to get close enough to the bridge to attach ropes to the piers and pull the bridge down. There is some speculation that the nursery rhyme "London Bridge is Falling Down" stems from this incident.

I had the misfortune to go to London recently - nasty smelly place full of litter, horrendous traffic and people who don't look at each other on the tube (which was crowded). I wonder if the Danes could be persuaded to invade again and start afresh?

I had always heard it was from the terrible disrepair condition it was in during Elizabeth I's reign. As most nursery ryhmes stem from that era, it seems more plausable that that is what it is refering to. ???

I always thought the song originated from well before Elizabeth 1's reign as the second verse mentions sticks and stones, which sounds more mediaeval to me!

While reading this thread it brought back childhood memories of a playground game we used to play in school while singing this song. (I know im getting on, but im not that old, before you ask!). Anyway, two girls would hold their arms up in an arch, while the others sang the song as they skipped underneath. At the end of the first verse, the words, "here comes a candle to light you to bed, here comes a chopper to chop off your head!" were sang, at the same time they would catch someone in their arms. Then that person would go behind one of the girls to hold up the bridge! Now I always though that referred to the Tudor period, and Henry in particular, as a chopper is an axe. So im really in a quandary as to the origin!!

Btw, sorry Eddy but I love London! Love the sights , sounds and magic of the great city!

Dee, we played that in the US, too, but our line was "Take the keys and lock her up, My fair lady!" Now I am wondering if that referred to some unfortunate English queen of the medieval or Tudor period. Or, if the Elizabethan spin is correct, perhaps it was a reference to Mary Queen of Scots, hmm?

Greensleeves, I suppose my interpretation could refer to Mary Queen of Scots also, or as you say, any unfortunate English Queen!

It is amazing how these children's rhymes have continued down the years, as with another, "ring a ring of roses", isn't that supposed to refer to the plague?

If you go back to the previous page of posts, I know there is a discussion between ForeverAmber and Lady Grace on just this subject, but the name of the discussion escapes me (sorry!).

Haven't found that discussion yet, but while searching found a hilarious thread on what to do, and not to do, in the event of plague occuring! Thanks Greensleeves!

I believe the post was originally about the Pied Piper and then Lady Grace and ForeverAmber went off on a tangent, if that helps any.

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