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�?Message Board : Values
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Reply
 Message 1 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameEvonneTheStoryteller  (Original Message)Sent: 7/31/2002 4:41 PM

from The Screed

 

When I was a college student there were rumblings about the return of the draft. Madman Reagan was in power, and we feared he would conscript the fruit of American youth to fight the goodly Sandinistas - why, we were certain Al Haig labored every night airbrushing pictures of the Nicaraguan hunta to remove the halos, just to convince that addled tool Bonzo Ronnie to gather up young men and send them in Verdun-like waves against the “enemy.�?BR>
I wondered if I could avoid this fate. I wondered how I’d beat a draft. I had a conversation with a coffeehouse habitue, a veteran of the 60s - which is to say, not a veteran at all. Unless you regard protesting the war as the equivalent of war itself, as if chanting and marching was the moral, physical, spiritual, intellectual, and emotional equivalent of squatting in a rice paddy with your britches full of half-metabolized C-rations, hearing the screams of your buddies. Maybe it's the same. One guy spent an afternoon spend stuffing envelopes to mail to politcians; the other spent a minute stuffing his intestines back into his gut after a shell hit his position. A matter of semantics. I wasn’t there and cannot say. I only know that when confronted with the simple possibility of the draft, I wanted out. I did not want to go, and I turned to my elders for advice.

The coffeehouse vets were pleased to hear that their Padewan was eager to learn. They laid out the options: conscientious objector. No, I had no religious objections. I’m not about to dress like the guy on the Quaker Oats box and pretend I’m under orders from God, because that would be a lie. Well, then there’s Canada. Really. Hmm. Uh . . . no, I’m not leaving home; I’m not leaving America. Isn’t there some deferrment for people who are too . . .artistic? I was a poetry major at the time, after all. What sort of nation sends POETS to war?

I could not escape the unflattering truth: I didn’t want to be drafted because it would have screwed up my social life. No more coffee houses and long afternoon arguments and cheap wine and flirting with waitresses. I realized, with a sick sinking feeling, that if I was drafted, I would go.

On the other hand, I could lord it over my peers for years to come, so there was a theoretical upside.

When I read a poll that said 37% of college students would try to beat the draft, I understood. It’s a stark contrast to my father’s generation - my dad enlisted at age 15 - but the civilian / military disconnect is great these days. The rest of the poll, however, contained some effervescent idiocies unique to our times, our campuses. Shall we tour the ivy-swaddled parapets and sample their honeyed delusions? We shall.
The story is here, if you want the full horror. (As well as some odd reassurances.) Let’s begin:

American students intensely and overwhelmingly disagree with the statement that Western culture is superior to Arab culture. Only 16% believe Western culture is superior to Arab culture but 79% do not.


A. Essay question. Two choices: life as an gay atheist in Fargo North Dakota, or life as a Christian gay in Riyadh. Write 1,000 words describing how each faces equal hardship. If your essay contains less than 1000 words, you will either be docked one grade or have your left hand removed with an ornately engraved scimitar, depending on which morally-equal culture the teaching assitant wishes to consult.

B. Western Culture is equal or inferior to Arab culture because: (check any you believe apply)

1. Our so-called democracies are fronts for corporate interests. Nader doesn’t win here; Nader doesn’t win in Syria. What’s the difference?

2. Our so-called freedom of scientific inquiry unshackled from religious strictures is a sham - Galileo was oppressed by the Catholic Church, wasn’t he? Didn’t every American moon shot end in failure because we believed the sun revolved around the earth and we failed to account for the gravitational pull? Stupid Pope!

3. We spend more on flavored massage oil than we do on foreign aid, which is so, like, typical. Saudi Arabia spends more on mosques here in the United States than their citizens spend on Hustler, which should tell you something

4. They may stone adulterers, but we are equally puritanical about sex, as evidenced by the recent refusal of the Toledo City Council to grant medical benefits to the pets of cohabiting transgendered city employees

5. I saw this documentary on the Crusades, and did you know that the Europeans catapulted plague-ridden bodies into enemy cities? Are we demanding WMD inspections against the Franks? I didn’t think so, because they’re WHITE.

6. No culture is better than any other, except the Tibetans, who are probably better than Thuggee death-cults, but that’s just coming from a post-Orientalist perspective inherent in the Western mindset which pollutes my every thought no matter how much Yoga I do. I mean, I grew up in a house where my dad kept his Veterans of Foreign Wars magazine in the bathroom downstairs. YOU try to overcome bad karma like that.

7. Did you know that “hashish�?comes from the Arab word for “Assassin?�?Seriously. I read that in this book. They used to smoke it before they went out and waxed a dude. They’d get like totally baked and see paradise and then go take care of biz-niz. It makes you wonder if the Arabs an�?all call liquor “Johnny Walker�?‘cause that’s what the Mafia dudes drink before they do a hit. Or maybe they call it “hitman.�?Like, “dude, we got so fucked up on hitman last night there was this car on fire outside and I was like, whatever.�?BR>
Yeah, I’ve been thinking of doing stand-up! You guys’d come and laugh, right?

8. There’s absolutely no chance of me getting a hook-up on this campus if I said Western values rule. Nada. Half the women you meet are all like, y’know, the Catholic church won’t let women be priests just like the Taliban, and if the West was so great we wouldn’t need Title Whatever to have gender equity in sports, and a buncha other stuff you just learn to nod and say uh-huh to, ‘cause they’re all pissed that dad is on their case for a tattoo or something. It’s way too much. And they’re all into Buffy like some kind of role model, and I’m like girl? Buffy rocks, okay, but I saw that Al-Jarreau station or whatever it’s called and there ain’t no Buffys over there. There ain’t going to be no Buffys. It’s like a total No-Buff zone, awright? They got like police who can arrest you for toe rings, but if you point that out you’re like this major Bush guy which is so uncool with your top-line hotties.

Yeah, I voted for Bush. Almost wish I hadn’t, ‘cause now I have to lie.


C. The world’s largest skyscrapers are now the twin Petronas Towers in Malaysia, so:

1. Describe the likelihood of Prussian Fundamentalist Christians flying planes into the two towers.

2. If this occurred, write an imaginary description of the celebration in a Milwaukee neighborhood, as they celebrate the great victory of the faithful over the Great Malaysian Satan

3. As for the towers themselves, they are derived from local culture: The pointy floor shape is based on the suggestion of a government official, who felt the eight points were more representative of Islamic design.

Describe your feelings if a member of the Bush administration had suggested that the rebuilt World Trade Centers be shaped like crosses. Extra credit if you conclude by warning of internment camps for atheists.


37% of all college students said they would be "likely to try to evade the draft," while another 21% would be willing to serve "but only if stationed in the United States." Only 35% of college students today would be "willing to serve and fight anywhere in the world."

To those 37%:

1. Have any government loans for college? Just curious.

2. Do you have a romantic notion of joining an underground railway that spirits you from safe house to safe house, where gray-ponytailed comrades from the sixties hide you out under piles of old Ramparts magazines while The Man bangs on the door upstairs, after which you’ll take a gaily-painted VW bus to the border, cross over to the arms of fiery compassionate Canadian pastors who will take you to safety while you look out the back window at the receding sight of America, feeling as though you should hum “Mrs. Robinson�?by Simon and Garfunkel under your breath?

3. Really, is that what you think? And your dad is paying how much for your education?


"
More students (55%) can name the leader of the Palestinian Authority than the US Sec’y of Defense (32%) or National Security Advisor. (19%)"

A. Since the leader of the PA is a heterosexual male, and the National Security Advisor is a single Black female, your inability to know the latter is due to:

1. The systemic racism of a system that refuses to - hold on, what was the question?

2. The People! United! Will Never Be Defited!

3. Single Black women cannot be Republicans, therefore she does not exist. She has been digitally inserted into news footage by George Lucas.

B. You realize that we are pressing sexual harassment charges against you because you used the phrase “digitally inserted�?when talking about a woman of gender.

1. oh - my - Gaia

2. Go ahead. I’ll tell the board I saw you in the campus bookstore trying to put a copy of Ann Coulter’s “Scandal�?on the shelves

3. Hey hey ho ho! Your intra-procedural hijacking of the grievance modality structure with its systemic appeal to patriarchal notions of male-defined Logic has got to go! Along with your phallocentric concept of of “meter!�?BR>

"
While President Bush receives very high marks for his handling of the presidency (70% approval), a majority of college students (57%) believe the policies of the United States are "at least somewhat responsible" for the September 11th terrorist attacks.

“A clear majority of college students (60%) believe "developing a better understanding of the values and history of other cultures and nations that dislike us" is a better approach to preventing terrorism than investing in strong military and defense capabilities at home and abroad" (33%).�?BR>

Given that Osama et al wish to reestablish the Caliphate and establish their faith as the planet’s sole religion, would you:

1. Understand the values of those who would rewrite the First Amendment to make Islam mandatory

2. Support a national effort to rewrite spellcheckers so they replace “Jew�?with “pig�?BR>
3. Support sending the religious police to break up Victoria’s Secret photo shoots and whip everyone with sticks until their brazen ankles are made decent again by a covering of blood

4. Understand why the cause requires the death of this child:



This is, or rather was, five-year old Gal Aizenman. She was ripped to shreds by poison-soaked nails at a Jerusalem bus stop this week. Your task: find the Western value that says she deserved to die. Find the Western value that says God wants this child to be blown up in front of her mother. Find the Western value that insists God not only smiled upon her death, but welcomed her killer to a whorehouse heaven. Find a big-league Bishop who commended her killer to paradise, and a murderer's mother who exhulted in this child's extermination.

Last question: you remember that famous, horrible photo of the young girl fleeing naked from a napalm attack in Vietnam. You may know that she was treated in Saigon by American-staffed hospital. She survived, was held up as a heroine by the Communists, sent to Cuba to be educated - and she defected to the West for freedom the first chance she had.

Describe, in as many words as necessary, the likelihood of a neighbor of Israel giving intensive medical care to Gal, granting her citizenship, appointing her to an international human rights board, and writing stories - for domestic newspapers - drenched in shame for the trauma she suffered.

Assume, for the sake of argument, Gal is alive.



First  Previous  84-98 of 98  Next  Last 
Reply
 Message 84 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameIridryll_wandering_bardSent: 8/15/2004 8:24 AM
Krow,
 
I am sorry about the poor economy in the area in which you live and the large amout of youth currently doing narcotics.
 
But as I expess my sorrow as such things, I have to think of yet another price of freedom. That being of allowing others the same freedom to choose and follow thier own way, even when it is a self-destuctive path that they walk.

Reply
 Message 85 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN Nicknamekrow0884Sent: 8/16/2004 5:52 PM
thou shall not make notice of the spilinter  in thy neighbors eye, when thou has a tember in his own.
 
sure i guess you can say were "defending freedom" but if you remember thats not what this war against iraq was orignally for. it was the hunt for weapons of mass distruction so right wing dinks which couldnt find theyre ass with two hands and a flash light, are saying its the war of iraqi freedom. no one can say anything this major is worth the price. but this is something that is a opinion and no one can say its a fact. my freinds mother lost all 7 of her sons. first on died in desert storm ten years later my best freind is missing and his brother is in acoma the rest are dead. they didnt join the army cause of the pride of theyre family they joined the army because they couldnt get a job. they got into the first year of college and they joined the military before and after 911. is this war worth it to theyre mother? is this war worth it to you? is this war worth it to bush and cheney?

Reply
 Message 86 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameIridryll_wandering_bardSent: 8/16/2004 10:36 PM
but it was they're choice to make. The people who joined the milatary of thier free will knew the risks and made a choice and that choice should be respected.
 
And like it or not, even I have to admit (I really hate war and the reason for this one.), that the freedom now granted to the people of iraq is a good thing not matter the original reasons for invading.

Reply
 Message 87 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN Nicknamekrow0884Sent: 8/17/2004 3:52 AM
20% of iraqisdid not agree and detested sadam
 
should we shut down if there was a group of anarchist
 
yeah didnt know how good freedom was but most of them were happy with theyre life and theyre position in soceity. thats why theyre killing americans.

Reply
 Message 88 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameIridryll_wandering_bardSent: 8/20/2004 6:25 AM
*shrugs* whatever.
 
 

Reply
(2 recommendations so far) Message 89 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameKellog_bluffSent: 8/20/2004 8:23 AM
I've been asked to share these thoughts for you:
  1. never let the Old men send the Young men and women to their death in battle.  If it's important enuf to die for, let the Old men making the decision to fight - be the first ones to die.  Maybe that will motivate them to consider alternatives?
  2. adjoining villages or nations should send their children to neighboring lands for several years in a collective effort to learn the humanity of others - and to give pause before turning the wrath of war on a land where the future generation lives.
  3. Always ask the children for advice before going to war.  If the reason to war is important enough to kill their parents over, you should get their input on the value of the act.
  4. Freedom is never free.  Freedom can never be "given" to a group of people without their tendering a cost for it.  If freedom is worth killing and dying for --- make sure those receiving the benefit can shoulder the maintenance thereof.
  5. reconsider the wisdom of a god or a religion holding the value of your life above the value of any other person not having the benefit of praying at your mosque or church.  If YOU can see that all people have value, why can't he?
  6. always pause to question stupidity in action - especially yours.
  7. never lose hope.  Regardless how bad it seems to get --- make yourself a beacon of performance for the others, and you can be a guide back out of the wilderness. (you may be sacraficed in the effort, but in every good movie at least one hero dies.)
  8. On the eighth day, God farted, and there was conflict in the land. blame it on the rich food. 

hey, where did #8 come from?  Ethyl!!!!

Krow - you have a valid point. ....... But don't give up; never give up hope, or you flirt with the loss of your humanity.


Reply
 Message 90 of 98 in Discussion 
From: EvonneSent: 8/26/2004 8:51 PM
Beans...  Lol. 

Reply
 Message 91 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN Nicknamekrow0884Sent: 8/30/2004 6:32 AM
thank you kellog, nice to know someone understands the "insanity" in morality.

Reply
 Message 92 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameKellog_bluffSent: 9/23/2004 8:29 AM
msg to the StoryTeller-ette:  thanks Very much for the books.  they are especially appreciated by two special folks now reading them.
von-bon

Reply
 Message 93 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameEvonneTheStorytellerSent: 9/28/2004 8:04 PM
You are very welcome. 

Reply
(1 recommendation so far) Message 94 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameKellog_bluffSent: 11/18/2004 9:04 AM
you are hereby advised that this message is crafted to elicit a response from you.  Sourced emotive response is an effective communication medium.  seed hereby planted.
carry on.

CNN and network news are said by their detractors to dim the broadband of reporting in the Iraqui conflict to favor US military political ambitions.
 
alternative reporting groups like Flashpoints (from New york) and Pacifica Radio consistantly report the news from a somewhat biased viewpoint that the US military is an occupational illegal force - and everything said has the flavor thereof.
 
I've heard a few comments on the war recently.  I'll print them here for you.

When a child dies in a city street gunfight because the crossfire pierced the walls of the house he was hiding in --- does it really matter what viewpoint the political reporting is done under?
 
At what point in the conflict will there be enough resistance fighters (or terrorists, you choose) killed to make the streets of Faloosha or Iraq "safe"?  Is there a body count goal to be reached?  IF the armed resistance groups no longer use RPG's - but can only use car bombs and pistols...will that be the determinant?
 
Why has it been so difficult to get red cross/red crescent supplies and services to the civilians in the battle areas?
 
I'm american, and I respect the authority of the president and congress to send our troops into a foreign country to fight against aggression or terrorism.  But I have to stop and wonder about the idea of taking the battle to groups of people who Want to die fighting exactly like this, for religious reasons.  Religious Fervor can hardly make a logical and objective environment to talk alternatives to political and economic hardship and disagreement on the strongest of topics.  When the oppositon you wish to bargain and debate with has no respect for you and has decided it is a matter of religious righteousness to oppose you --- doesn't your entrance into the scene ensure a military confrontation?
 
Why are we required to respect the religious perspectives of the Iraqui terrorists while we are not given the same respect?  Why shouldn't we drop pig urine on every terrorist fighter and dump pigfat on their bodies?

It's another day in the US of A, and I'm trying to keep my hands steady and my eyes dry as I hear of more children dying because the adults couldn't figure out how to decide things without playing with guns.

Is collateral damage a term used too easily by those not bearing the cost?

What ever happened to the war correspondent who would report on the insanity of war without lacing the report with the predjudice of politics?

it's all about values - that's what I tell my child.  But she wants to know why children are getting shot and not getting back up again.

"some values are worth dying for.   My values - are worth your children dying for."

 

--- for the children, Ethyl

Reply
(1 recommendation so far) Message 95 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameKellog_bluffSent: 1/23/2005 8:11 AM
I agreed to post this letter under my pen name, as a request from someone I respect and owe many thanks to. If it stirs you in some way - then my promise to him is kept.

. "...Children are dying, not just in iraq, but in America too, and I know why, and even though I do some things to keep some of them alive, there are more dying than I can harbor. Why would anyone kill children just to make a political point? I know the answer to this one, too - and it makes my stomach twitch because I know of better ways to solve the problem, but those military idiots making the decisions don't listen to me; they don't have to.
I no longer need to teach detachment to the psy classes or anyone else; they already perform it daily when they see what I feel on the news, and they change the channel to "friends" or " Sci-Fi channel" instead of demanding an alternative to violence as the Only workable solution in a political crisis."
 
"Who is accountable? children are dying. Who do I go to, to ask it to stop? the President says on TV that it's the alternative best used for a strong tomorrow. What does the Pope say? What do the heads of other religions say?"
 
"I know the answer to that one, too.  'If it is of this world, then let it stay in this world.'  These are the among the powerful religious and spiritual minds in this part of the world, and this is their response."
 
"it stinks. this is the performance of left-handers and pigs, and I'm done working in filth".


Excerpted from a letter of a former teacher of mine, who will no longer teach his chosen path because he feels it no longer useful for his energy in the wurld. This letter is about a week old, and I expect to hear of his croaking (death) any day now. 

Don't kid yourself, ladies: the stakes are high in this kind of match. Folks are here to help or hurt - and it is deathly important you keep hope and strength alive for your daily performance, and for your families. You as individual spirits are not here to give up because it gets too hard. You are here to learn just how hard it can get. There is a storm coming.

You cannot give up. this is what performance of your values is all about.

yeowza


Reply
 Message 96 of 98 in Discussion 
From: EvonneSent: 1/23/2005 3:35 PM
Spiritual Economics.
 
 
There is some positive movement too and I think we have to look to that for momentum. There are investors that help people look for the "green" companies and people who want to invest that way.  Some businesses are very concerned about running in a way that helps the local people and economy. 
 
I read the Buddhist book Instructions to the Cook: A Zen Master's Lessons in Living a Life That Matters by Bernard Glassman and Rick Fields. 
 
Glassman offers us a vision based upon these hungry ghosts:

"There is an ancient Zen scroll that shows heaven and hell. In hell, the hungry ghosts are all sitting at a great banquet table filled with all kinds of delicacies, trying to feed themselves with very long spoons. But no matter how hard they try, they cannot reach their mouths.

"In heaven, the hungry ghosts are sitting around the same banquet table. But these hungry spirits are feeding each other with their long spoons, so that they all can eat.

"This is the way to transform our world from a hell to a heaven. Only when we offer a portion of our food to our fellow hungry ghosts can we satisfy our own deepest hunger."

 
The book has lots of spiritual principles presented, but it is offered in the context of the growth and development of the Greyston Bakery, a successful business.  This was a project offered to support the monastery but it also gave to the community.  The bakery developed recipes for wholesome foods that were very different from a standard bakery.  They set up the bakery, managed the bakery, brought in people to learn the skills required and they set up teams so that the teaching of the skills and philosophy is continued on.
 
They did not simply end their vision at the business either.  They branched out into the community.  They got involved in developing the affordable housing for people.  But they just did not fix up the buildings! The leadership developed the community with teaching that made the buildings nice places to live in.  They hired people as the bakery developed and got contracts from other businesses such as Godiva.  They gave people who had drug and alcohol problems counseling and opportunity to get out of the rut that kept them there. People learned skills and obtained jobs which gave them pride and helped their familys.  The management developed a whole dynamic of business and community which I think is a wonderful spiritual business lesson on a small scale.
 
On a larger scale the world economy is really shaking out.  I am one of the shaken, of course... The world community is very difficult.  World economics blows my mind with all these treaties, tariffs, boycotts, standardization...  It begins to look like fancy names for bribery and corrosion!  Taiwan can produce shrimp for half the price, so they have a large export tariff so the countries that do produce shrimp can still compete.  Now that they have taken a huge wipe out... they are paying for contracts with shrimp.  Pretty creative...       http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/international.cfm?id=66782005  The article is amazing in a shocking way with all sorts of... interesting twists in prices, tariffs, fines, and... threats giving an interesting view of the twisted difficulties in world economics.  I should not talk though, I have no solution.
 
I once thought I had the solution.  I always taught to put yourself in a place of power, and lead nicely.  Once a person is in a position to make decisions, their leadership ways are of great interest.  It is my personal belief that a strong leader can change good hunks of the world and network with lots of other strong leaders to change things.  If they are running companies, etc., they can also put their money where their mouth is.  It was my intention to be there, and even looked like I was well on my way, but my secret, unknown plan must be different.  I also must admit, my ideas did not seem to really catch interest with the other business students.
 
I still think it could work if we focused on leaders who did this though.  We need to lead in a way that helps the world.  Easier said than done.  Criminy. 

Reply
 Message 97 of 98 in Discussion 
From: EvonneSent: 4/18/2005 5:47 PM
Maybe it is time to sponsor another INTOLERANCE WEEK on SLC!  And in special celebration of this week, I AM NOT PUTTING UP WITH YOU PEOPLE!  Lol. 

Reply
 Message 98 of 98 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameKellog_bluffSent: 7/29/2007 8:40 AM
War is not something you have to get used to. It's not something you have to teach the children to get used to. Children know when adults do stupid things, because they see us sweat and get angry at their questions to us about why Ali is getting bombed and there is a robed man screaming to kill them from the television. They know that Elmo loves them, but they don't know what the screaming adults have in store for them.
 
But they'll learn, Ethyll - and it won't be something they get used to. They'll hate it or love it or fear it- but they won't get used to it.
 
What they get used to - is how we lie to them.
 

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