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| | From:  Freeborn551 (Original Message) | Sent: 12/12/2007 3:23 AM |
Isaiah,
I also see it like you, babies are not born in sin.
When they grow up in this sinful world,then they become sinners.
If a baby was born in sin, and die after a few months, it would be lost forever.
This brings me to the question: what is the age of accountability?
Twelve years,eighteen??God only knows, children of ten years old also commit murders.Doesn't happen so much, but it happens.
Rollingstone, when the bible speaks of horses in Revelation, like Jesus coming back on a white horse, this is not a real horse of course.
A horse is an image of a powerful noble animal.
Horses were for conquerors, and Jesus will come back as a conqueror.
Remember, when Jesus entered Jerusalem He rode a donkey.
But by His death He conquered satan.He is no longer the Lamb for the slaughter, but the conqueror.
When Revelation was written, horses were the only way of transportation (for the rich, the poor walked or used donkeys) and horses were used in warfare too.
I hope this helps a bit?
Perhaps Isaiah or Freeborn or someone else see it different??
eelya
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| Reply # 26 Isaiah Tweety is right ! Eric
Stay in the know. Pulse on the new Yahoo.com. Check it out. | Reply
| | | well, thanks to all of you for your good information. I am truly interested in learning about these things. I have no one to teach me. so I am trying to learn here. I read lots of web sites, gbut none of them had much to learn from. they mostly just play games and stuff which does not amount to a thing. i lean that kind of junk in school. it is nothing to me.l I want to know about tjhese mysteries such as Jesus riding on horses, I mean in the sky. that is kinda funhny. not hahha funny, but strange. Now I learned something good from Eeyla. thanks you. that was good information. but about babies dying and going to hell, i do not think so. hope not anyway. for i had baby brothers who died and don't believe Jesus sent them to hell. nope. he loves them and they are innocent. | | |
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Rollingstone,
I hope you didn't misunderstand me.
i didn't say that babies go to hell.Oh no!!
I only meant the following: that babies aren't born in sin, because if this should be so, they would go to hell.And this is not true.Babies are innocent.
And like Isaiah already said: Jesus loves little children,they are very precious to Him.
Sorry if there was a misunderstanding.
eelya | |
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| From: Isaiah | Sent: 10/13/2006 10:47 AM | | And Nathan departed unto his house. And the LORD struck the child that Uriah's wife bare unto David, and it was very sick. | | | | David therefore besought God for the child; and David fasted, and went in, and lay all night upon the earth. | | | | And the elders of his house arose, and went to him, to raise him up from the earth: but he would not, neither did he eat bread with them. | | | | And it came to pass on the seventh day, that the child died. And the servants of David feared to tell him that the child was dead: for they said, Behold, while the child was yet alive, we spake unto him, and he would not hearken unto our voice: how will he then vex himself, if we tell him that the child is dead? | | | | But when David saw that his servants whispered, David perceived that the child was dead: therefore David said unto his servants, Is the child dead? And they said, He is dead. | | | | Then David arose from the earth, and washed, and anointed himself, and changed his apparel, and came into the house of the LORD, and worshipped: then he came to his own house; and when he required, they set bread before him, and he did eat. | | | | Then said his servants unto him, What thing is this that thou hast done? thou didst fast and weep for the child, while it was alive; but when the child was dead, thou didst rise and eat bread. | | | | And he said, While the child was yet alive, I fasted and wept: for I said, Who can tell whether GOD will be gracious to me, that the child may live? | | | | But now he is dead, wherefore should I fast? can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he shall not return to me. | To me this proves that a child goes to heaven when it dies | |
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| Oh, no, dear Eeyla. It was not you who said that. I saw that you were saying babies were innocent and so would not go to hell if they die. Now, it was to those who say we are born in sin and therefore, it follows that if one is born in sin and dies at birth, then they would go to hell, for they are in sin. is that what you were saying, who said we are born in sin? I believe Isaiah showed a very good proof that babies are not hell-bound. | |
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| Rollingstone, when the bible speaks of horses in Revelation, like Jesus coming back on a white horse, this is not a real horse of course.
A horse is an image of a powerful noble animal.
Horses were for conquerors, and Jesus will come back as a conqueror.
Remember, when Jesus entered Jerusalem He rode a donkey.
But by His death He conquered satan.He is no longer the Lamb for the slaughter, but the conqueror.
When Revelation was written, horses were the only way of transportation (for the rich, the poor walked or used donkeys) and horses were used in warfare too.
I hope this helps a bit?
Perhaps Isaiah or Freeborn or someone else see it different??
eelya
eelya, that is very good that you said. and it is true. But here is what I see that the Word of God is really saying about these kinds of 'horses'. See this is spiritual this is why I say we must find the answers in Scripture and it must be spiritually discerned. Of course what you said is spiritual and means this same thing. : | Now the Egyptians are men, and not God; and their horses flesh, and not spirit. When the LORD shall stretch out his hand, both he that helpeth shall fall, and he that is holpen shall fall down, and they all shall fail together. |
The above verse has a lot in it. It shows here that God is not a man, as some people think. It said, the Egyptians are MEN and not God. so this is showing that God is not men. It also spiritually identifies what 'horses' means, spiritually. See it said that their horses are FLESH, and NOT SPIRIT. So, horses, to God, shows SPIRIT. But the natural people, were looking to FLESH, as their source of power. so their 'horses' or power, was in flesh, and not in spirit. This also explains why most people claim that we must discern Scripture literally. their 'horse' is flesh. See? It is their way of understanding things = fleshly. But the True Christain, spiritually discerns things. So our power-source is Spirit. Our horse or power, is Spirit. So I say yes, to what rollingstone suggested. The horse represents the power. This is what eeyla was saying. Jesus comes back on this (white -- shows righteousness)---- power is horse--- so He returns in righteous power. He came in weakness the first time, but never again. He died in weakness, but never again. Yes, those horses in Rev. shows a certain POWER. It is NOT REAL OR LITERAL HORSES AND LITERAL CHARIOTS. Scripture shows that chariots are angels. Those four horses, are certainly NOT four-legged earthly horses. Pity anyone who has such a carnal idea of the Word of God, especially if that person is sincere and just being deceived by carnal minded people who have no idea of Spiritual things. I hope to find time, someday, to explain what I see on those four horses in Rev. | |
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Thanks Freeborn,
for this expalantion on horses.It becomes very clear to me now.
Yet, I know several fellow christians who think that these four horses will appear in the sky!!!
Looking forward on your explanation about the horses in Revelation.
eelya | |
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| eelya, it is a pity that so many are caught up in such carnal and foolish doctrine. Those horses in Rev. have already been manifested here. They will continue to be manifested. It takes a spiritual understanding of Scripture to see into these things. to think these horses come down in the sky is soooo foolish, there is no words for it. how can so many people just accept these foolish concepts of carnal men and reject real truth? carnal men trying to put everything in Scripture, down here at the end of the world is what has caused all this misunderstanding. All these things have been happening all along the way. | |
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| Freeborn makes some very good points here. Almost all of the images described in Revelation are symbols of one type ort another, and not to be taken literaly. Horses are for conquerers it is true, for it is the Cavelry of any army that is its strength and it's speed. We can tell from the use of these symbols that indeed what each of the 5 horsemen represent will come with power and with strength. I want to expand a little on some commonly held misconceptions regarding the horses of Revelation. - There are 5 horses not 4
- The horses are spirit/ symbols of power and speed.
- The first horse represents the AntiChrist. Who will conquer and rule for the time of the tribulation. Rev6
- The crown and bow given to the first horseman signifies that God will allow him to go forth and conquer and rule as king, he is NOT Christ!
- The fifth horseman is Christ, upon whose robe and thigh is written Lord of Lords and King of Kings. He will come swiftly and with power. He will imediately judge and make war in righteousness, bringing the tribuulation to its end. Rev19
Rev5 tells of the lamb, and clearly identifies Him as Christ. Then in Rev6 the lamb opens the 7 seals, and John watches as each seal is broken, and what unfolds at that time. As the first seal is broken, the first white horse comes forth, then the second seal is broken bby the lamb again. So the lamb is clearly not one of the first 4 riders. No similar case may be made for the rider of the fifth horse. In fact scriptures go to some length to ensure we do not misinterpret the identity of the angel who is standing with John when the fifth rider comes forth. In Rev19:10 John fallls at the anngels feet to worship him, but is rebuked. This angel is not God nor Christ. So even in the spirit, we are not so confused as to have Christ in two places at one time. Stephen | |
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| Thank you, Stephen, for your thoughts on this. I had forgotten this, as I have had so much else going on. I truly do need to try to write up some of the things God shows me concerning this matter. man, in his carnal understanding, has gone ahead and taught the world so much false stuff, till when God does reveal the truth, everyone, almost, thinks it is crazy. Remember, always make sure you find another Scripture which CLEARLY reveals the one you are expounding on. Always make sure you explain with Scripture. the men who taught before us did not do this. They just read what the carnal minded men ahead of them had said, and went along with it, for they did not have the anointing (Holy Ghost) teaching them. they did not seek the answers from the Scriptures. They looked out around them, at things in the world, and tried to 'interpret' from that. It has brought forth only lies, which blind people to the real truth. These answers are written in Scripture and must be proven with written Scripture. Jo | |
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| Alexader546 >>>>>>> got in touch with me and told me he no longer has access to a computer, and asked me to remove his membership for now. Also another member said they lost their password and cannot sign in any longer, and asked to be removed. i hated to lose these two new members. Hope things will work out so they can return someday. Just wanted you all to know. Sorry to see them go, but thank them for letting me know. So many times, people join, leave and we never know why or that they do not intend to be back. Wish more people would be this considerate. Wish them well. Jo | |
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