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| Hello, Alexader, It seems many people today are getting very concerned with which Bible to study, believe and what to believe about it. That is good. Only a pure FAITH in the TRUTH will save anyone. So it is very important to find out what the truth is and trust in it. Yes, everything is lieral, but not the way people read the actual words. For they read them in a carnal understanding. It is totally SPIRITUAL, and very few seem to understand what being spiritual means. The words have a spirital meaning which only the spirit and other parts of Scripture can reveal. It takes dedicated study of God's word to get into the true spiritual meaning. Yes, God created the world, and everything in it. As far as the days in Gen. one, being 24 hour days, I do not see that in the word. It is not the spiritual way of understanding it. For one thing, that first day is the life and death and resurrection of Jesus. So it is not as people take it. Jesus is that LIGHT. He is the Great Light. He is the Day. There is so much to study and learn, it will take a lot of time. Only those who truly desire to know the truth above everything else, will stay there long enough to learn. Most people just scoff at truth and walk away, out into the darkness of night = Satan, or carnal mind. But I welcome you to our group, and am willing to help you all that I can. If you love the truth, study the Word, pray and ask God for a spiritual mind to understand with. Jo, manager | |
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| What do you mean the first verse in Genesis is the life death and ressurection of Jesus when he was not crucified until St Luke in the New Testament??! I does not make any sense.I have never heard of anything remotly close to this in any church or doctrine. | Reply
| | | Will you help me see how " In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
2: And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
3: And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
4: And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
5: And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day." means is the life and death and resurrection of Jesus. (Anyone) | | |
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| I will help you, and anyone else who can and will 'hear', or listen and try to understand. Now, read all of Isa. 53. Here is part of it: | He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth: he is brought as a lamb to the slaughter, and as a sheep before her shearers is dumb, so he openeth not his mouth. | | He was taken from prison and from judgment: and who shall declare his generation? for he was cut off out of the land of the living: for the transgression of my people was he stricken. | | And he made his grave with the wicked, and with the rich in his death; because he had done no violence, neither was any deceit in his mouth. | | Yet it pleased the LORD to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand. | | He shall see of the travail of his soul, and shall be satisfied: by his knowledge shall my righteous servant justify many; for he shall bear their iniquities. |
That was written by a prophet hundreds of years before Luke, right? Yes. Yet it is the crucifixion of Jesus. Do you understand this? | |
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| Read all of Psalms 22. This also was written by a prophet maybe thousands of years before Luke. Yet it is the crucifixion of Jesus. Here is part of it: | Be not far from me; for trouble is near; for there is none to help. | | Many bulls have compassed me: strong bulls of Bashan have beset me round. | | They gaped upon me with their mouths, as a ravening and a roaring lion. | | I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint: my heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of my bowels. | | My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death. | | For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have enclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet. | | I may tell all my bones: they look and stare upon me. | | They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture. | | But be not thou far from me, O LORD: O my strength, haste thee to help me. |
This is the death of Jesus. Do you understand this? Anyone? | |
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| Now, for a less obvious one. Read all of this chapter. It also is the crucifixion of Jesus: | I am the man that hath seen affliction by the rod of his wrath. | | He hath led me, and brought me into darkness, but not into light. | | Surely against me is he turned; he turneth his hand against me all the day. | | My flesh and my skin hath he made old: he hath broken my bones. | | He hath builded against me, and compassed me with gall and travail. | | He hath set me in dark places, as they that be dead of old. | | He hath hedged me about, that I cannot get out: he hath made my chain heavy. | | Also when I cry and shout, he shutteth out my prayer. | | He hath enclosed my ways with hewn stone, he hath made my paths crooked. | | He was unto me as a bear lying in wait, and as a lion in secret places. | | He hath turned aside my ways, and pulled me in pieces: he hath made me desolate. | | He hath bent his bow, and set me as a mark for the arrow. | | He hath caused the arrows of his quiver to enter into my reins. | | I was a derision to all my people; and their song all the day. | | He hath filled me with bitterness, he hath made me drunken with wormwood. | | He hath also broken my teeth with gravel stones, he hath covered me with ashes. |
This was also written by a prophet, for it is ALL PROPHECY, DO YOU UNDERSTAND?/ Prophecy, about the death of Jesus. The entire Word of God is FULL OF THIS. It is from the first words of the Word, till the end. Until people learn that the Word of God is ABOUT JESUS CHRIST, they will forever miss its true meaning. God declared the END from the Beginning. JESUS IS THE BEGINNING. So inside Jesus, God made a new heaven and a new earth. IT WAS AT THE RESURRECTION. the first, or old heaven and earth (body and soul) was done away with at his death, and the new heaven and earth (glorified life or body and soul) was born at his resurrection. So Jesus was the END of the old heaven and earth. HE WAS THE BEGINNING OF THE NEW CREATION OF GOD, a MAN IN THE LIKENESS AND GLORY OF GOD. This was at the RESURRECION of Jesus. So in Gensis one, God shows the death, life and resurrection of LIGHT, Jesus. (compare this chapter with Isa. 53. Look at the similarity.) Do you understand? | |
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| Now, let's prove Gen. 1: 1, is the death of Jesus: Bringing it together with explaining Scripture: Gen. 1: 2. And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. Void means an indistinguishable emptiness. Jer. 4: 20. Destruction upon destruction is cried; for the whole land is spoiled: suddenly are my tents spoiled, and my curtains in a moment. Who or what dwelt under tents and curtains? The Old Testament Covenant, of course. So this is the destruction of the OT. Covenant 21. How long shall I see the standard, and hear the sound of the trumpet? 22. For my people is foolish, they have not known me; they are sottish children, and they have none understanding: they are wise to do evil, but to do good they have no knowledge. 23. I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light. 24. I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly. 25. I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled. 26. I beheld, and, lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the Lord, and by his fierce anger. 27. For thus hath the Lord said, The whole land shall be desolate; yet will I not make a full end. 28. For this shall the earth mourn, and the heavens above be black; because I have spoken it, I have purposed it, and will not repent, neither will I turn back from it. Now verse 21 -- the trumpet meant wrath or judgment struck the O.T. V 22--shows why it happened. V23--I beheld the ‘EARTH�?and it was without form and void. Remember the earth is the human body of Jesus. In the BEGINNING God had created both heaven and earth. So this is the earth that was without form and void = the humanity of Jesus. Proof? Yes. Isa. 52: 13. Behold, my servant shall deal prudently, he shall be exalted and extolled, and be very high. 14. As many were astoned at thee; his visage was so marred more than any man, and his form more than the sons of men: 15. So shall he sprinkle many nations; the kings shall shut their mouths at him: for that which had not been told them shall they see; and that which they had not heard shall they consider. God’s servant spoken of here is Jesus. His visage (face or appearance) was so marred, more than any man and his ‘FORM�?more than the sons of men. Thus his ‘earth�?or human body was without form and void = no beauty that we should desire him. Isaiah 53:1. Who hath believed our report? And to whom is the arm of the Lord revealed? 2. For he shall grow up before him as a tender plant, and as a root out of a dry ground: he hath no form nor comeliness; and when we shall see him, there is no beauty that we should desire him. Verse 2 - ...he hath NO FORM NOR COMELINESS = without form and void. So this is the ‘earth�?which was without FORM AND VOID. It was the crucifixion of our wonderful Saviour, Jesus. Yes, that is what is being spoken of in Genesis 1: 1. The earth was without form and void - it is speaking of the crucifixion in the very beginning of the Word of God; thus he was ‘SLAIN FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD�? Now lets go back to Jer. 4. V 23--the heavens had no light? This was at the crucifixion when God turned his back on Jesus and forsook him. All the heavens turned dark; darkness was upon the face of the deep. The light (life of Jesus) went out. It turned dark in the middle of the day showing this. V.24--The mountains and hills moved-- both in the natural as the earthquakes hit and the storms struck at the time of Jesus�?death, and also this is the changing of times = the closing of the O.T. and the starting of a new day, the Day of Grace, the N.T. Now go back to verse 25, this also shows the complete change of God’s dealings with mankind; the O.T. being done away with, all that method of serving God. So there was no man or spirits at work now. V 26-- is still showing the change being made at the crucifixion -- all the ‘cities�? meaning the old way of serving God, were broken down by God’s anger. He is angry at their sins and his son having to die this way. | |
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| If this does not explain it to any and all, seek for a spiritual mind. Stop trying to interpret the Word of God as a baby, carnal, minded dead person. Open up and let LIGHT come into your heart and mind. THE WORD OF GOD IS ABOUT JESUS CHRIST, FROM THE START TO THE FINISH. The earth, is his body. Heaven is the spirit. without form and void = no glorification = no beauty that we should desire him. = no glory till after the RESURRECTION. the LIGHT is the Word of God he gave us. earth was in darkness = being under law. law is death, darkness. God, my Saviour, I pray for this group who reads here. Open their eyes and let them see into this and all your glorious truth. Let them come to understand. Let the darkness be past, let the LIGHT (understanding) now shine for them. Open their understanding to the truth in this thread. Help Eric, Litty, Alexader, Pillar, Tweety, Bill, and all others here understanding this truth and this message. May others read this and understand. In Jesus Name I pray. Jo | Reply
| | For the complete message on this go to: | | |
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| I always saw the Bible as a history of biblical times about many diffrent people. Now I understand that it is solely about Jesus. Now the Bible will be considerably simpler and easier to understand. I guess I just never thounght of the Bible as being about a single person. Thank you for revealing this to me. My wisdom has truely grown today. And again thank you for explaining this to me. | |
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| You are very welcome, Alexader. Now when you can understand HOW it is all about Jesus, then you will have come into great light. when I have more time, I will show you more on this. tonight I must get to bed early, get up early tomorrow and work all day. Wanna is sick, and I must take her place tomorrow and work two shifts with a dying woman. groan! When you read the accounts of people's lives in Scripture, it is to reveal truth about Jesus. David showed Jesus. Abraham showed Jesus. Joseph showed Jesus. Job showed Jesus. Lamentations is about Jesus.etc. Some showed Adam, the devil. Goodnight. Jo | |
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| Dear Freeborn, I read Isa. 53 and it is the Crucificition of Christ. I have read that so many times before. Thank You for opening my eyes. Tweety | Reply
| | Jeremiah 18: 1. The word which came to Jeremiah from the Lord, saying, 2. Arise, and go down to the potter's house, and there I will cause thee to hear my words. 3. Then I went down to the potter's house, and, behold; he wrought a work on the wheels. 4. And the vessel that he made of clay was marred in the hand of the potter: so he made it again another vessel, as seemed good to the potter to make it. What vessel was this, which was marred in the hand of the Potter. Link it to Isaiah 53 Isa. 52: 13. Behold, my servant shall deal prudently, he shall be exalted and extolled, and be very high. 14. As many were astonied at thee; his visage was so marred more than any man, and his form more than the sons of men: Jesus was that vessel which was marred in the hands of the potter, God, and then made into a new vessel of honour. He was declared to be the only begotten Son of God in the likeness and glory of God by the Spirit of Holiness by the resurrection from the dead. Rom. 1:3. Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; 4. And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead. | | |
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| Hi Tweety, I am so glad you saw this wonderful truth. What a shame and pity it is to me, that so many have missed all this glory in the Scripture, about Jesus. I tell people, you learn a lot about Jesus from the OT Prophets, which are not really revealed in the NT. When I have time, I have lots more glory to show on this subject, which will trill and feed the true Sheep of God. Axs, than you for this beautiful message. It is so true and so wonderful when one sees it put together this way. Love ye all, Jo (Pray for me this evening, as I will be doing a feeding tube, which I have never had experience with this before.) | Reply
| | Oh boy, it seems that msn is causing trouble again.
Great message Freeborn and Axs.
I have a question about Isaiah, but I'll do it tomorrow.
It's too late here.
eelya | | |
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| From: Isaiah | Sent: 10/6/2006 5:01 AM | | More proof that Isaiah 53 was speaking of Jesus
| And the angel of the Lord spake unto Philip, saying, Arise, and go toward the south unto the way that goeth down from Jerusalem unto Gaza, which is desert. | | | | And he arose and went: and, behold, a man of Ethiopia, an eunuch of great authority under Candace queen of the Ethiopians, who had the charge of all her treasure, and had come to Jerusalem for to worship, | | | | Was returning, and sitting in his chariot read Esaias the prophet. | | | | Then the Spirit said unto Philip, Go near, and join thyself to this chariot. | | | | And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest? | | | | And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him. | | | | The place of the scripture which he read was this, He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth: | | | | In his humiliation his judgment was taken away: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth. | | | | And the eunuch answered Philip, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? of himself, or of some other man? | | | | Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus. | | | | Reply
| | | That is a wonderful message, Isaiah. Thank you for this PROOF that Isa. 53 is the crucifixion of Jesus. All Scripture is about Jesus. How sad that so few know this! ************************** | | Reply
| | | I was reading this and looked at this verse. I see that it is showing the same thing here that you are speaking of. see what you think. It seems to me this verse is talking about Jesus, for he said he was the tree and the followers were the branches. so he was by the river of life and we are his fruit. | And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper. | | | Reply
| | | now if you want a good laugh, read the book called Zechariah cp12 v4. i read that today and thinking of this literal stuff, i had a good imagination and laughed good and hard. think of this: God said he would smite every horse with blindness and his rider with madness. he will smite all horses with astonishment. so picture this. everyone riding on horses, suddenly the horses go astonished because (guess, they went blind) and then they are all blind and their rider goes mad. some more funny pictgure. does this mean every horse in the world? and everyone riding on them suddenly goes mad? boy that is a funny one, if you take it literal. is it literal? will god suddenly smite all the horses in the world with blindesss? | | Reply
| | | Dear Rolling Stone, That verse applies to the Millennium. God will blind all riders and horses that are in the anti-christ's army that will fight against Judah. This is how God will protect the people. Now since I have explained this verse-is it still funny? Or does it show God's power that he has? Tweety | | Reply
| | | well, thanks, tweety. but what I am really wondering bout... is this real, literal horses? and does God truly make them literally blind? how do you know the anti-christ's army will actually ride on horses? do you think that the white horse which Jesus comes back from heaven, riding on, is a real, literal horse, like we know 4-legged horses? I mean, does he come riding down through space on a horse? or a cloud? why would Jesus ride down on a horse? did he go up on a horse? it said he would come back in like manner as he went up. so did he go up on a horse. me not trying to be a smarty or anything like that.... just wondering about these things. i was kind of wondering if these horses and their riders might have to do with those four horses in revelation. do you have anything on that? sure would appreciate you explaining that to me. i am just starting to learn a little about all of this, so please be patient with me. thanks. | | |
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| From: Isaiah | Sent: 10/13/2006 10:47 AM | | And Nathan departed unto his house. And the LORD struck the child that Uriah's wife bare unto David, and it was very sick. | | | | David therefore besought God for the child; and David fasted, and went in, and lay all night upon the earth. | | | | And the elders of his house arose, and went to him, to raise him up from the earth: but he would not, neither did he eat bread with them. | | | | And it came to pass on the seventh day, that the child died. And the servants of David feared to tell him that the child was dead: for they said, Behold, while the child was yet alive, we spake unto him, and he would not hearken unto our voice: how will he then vex himself, if we tell him that the child is dead? | | | | But when David saw that his servants whispered, David perceived that the child was dead: therefore David said unto his servants, Is the child dead? And they said, He is dead. | | | | Then David arose from the earth, and washed, and anointed himself, and changed his apparel, and came into the house of the LORD, and worshipped: then he came to his own house; and when he required, they set bread before him, and he did eat. | | | | Then said his servants unto him, What thing is this that thou hast done? thou didst fast and weep for the child, while it was alive; but when the child was dead, thou didst rise and eat bread. | | | | And he said, While the child was yet alive, I fasted and wept: for I said, Who can tell whether GOD will be gracious to me, that the child may live? | | | | But now he is dead, wherefore should I fast? can I bring him back again? I shall go to him, but he shall not return to me. | To me this proves that a child goes to heaven when it dies | |
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| Rollingstone, when the bible speaks of horses in Revelation, like Jesus coming back on a white horse, this is not a real horse of course.
A horse is an image of a powerful noble animal.
Horses were for conquerors, and Jesus will come back as a conqueror.
Remember, when Jesus entered Jerusalem He rode a donkey.
But by His death He conquered satan.He is no longer the Lamb for the slaughter, but the conqueror.
When Revelation was written, horses were the only way of transportation (for the rich, the poor walked or used donkeys) and horses were used in warfare too.
I hope this helps a bit?
Perhaps Isaiah or Freeborn or someone else see it different??
eelya
eelya, that is very good that you said. and it is true. But here is what I see that the Word of God is really saying about these kinds of 'horses'. See this is spiritual this is why I say we must find the answers in Scripture and it must be spiritually discerned. Of course what you said is spiritual and means this same thing. : | Now the Egyptians are men, and not God; and their horses flesh, and not spirit. When the LORD shall stretch out his hand, both he that helpeth shall fall, and he that is holpen shall fall down, and they all shall fail together. |
The above verse has a lot in it. It shows here that God is not a man, as some people think. It said, the Egyptians are MEN and not God. so this is showing that God is not men. It also spiritually identifies what 'horses' means, spiritually. See it said that their horses are FLESH, and NOT SPIRIT. So, horses, to God, shows SPIRIT. But the natural people, were looking to FLESH, as their source of power. so their 'horses' or power, was in flesh, and not in spirit. This also explains why most people claim that we must discern Scripture literally. their 'horse' is flesh. See? It is their way of understanding things = fleshly. But the True Christain, spiritually discerns things. So our power-source is Spirit. Our horse or power, is Spirit. So I say yes, to what rollingstone suggested. The horse represents the power. This is what eeyla was saying. Jesus comes back on this (white -- shows righteousness)---- power is horse--- so He returns in righteous power. He came in weakness the first time, but never again. He died in weakness, but never again. Yes, those horses in Rev. shows a certain POWER. It is NOT REAL OR LITERAL HORSES AND LITERAL CHARIOTS. Scripture shows that chariots are angels. Those four horses, are certainly NOT four-legged earthly horses. Pity anyone who has such a carnal idea of the Word of God, especially if that person is sincere and just being deceived by carnal minded people who have no idea of Spiritual things. I hope to find time, someday, to explain what I see on those four horses in Rev. | |
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