MSN Home  |  My MSN  |  Hotmail
Sign in to Windows Live ID Web Search:   
go to MSNGroups 
Free Forum Hosting
 
Important Announcement Important Announcement
The MSN Groups service will close in February 2009. You can move your group to Multiply, MSN’s partner for online groups. Learn More
FULL BIBLE TRUTHContains "mature" content, but not necessarily adult.[email protected] 
  
What's New
  
  ACT  
  NEW  
  ISLAM  
  ISRAEL  
  BEHOLD  
  ZIONISM  
  LIBERTY  
  POLITICS  
  TEMPLATE FOR A.A.  
  TRUE DOCTRINE  
  -THELYPHTHORA -  
  *** HOT ZONE ***  
  DISCUSSIONS  
  CONSTITUTION CLASS  
  MSN Code of Conduct  
  HOW MUCH MORE?  
  TERRORISM made in U.S.A.  
  IS AMERICA DOOMED???  
  PERSONAL INCOME TAX?  
  MASCULINE ANGLES  
  FEMININE ANGLES  
  PRETTY IN PINK  
  WAR  
  Chinks in the Armor  
  EVIL PATRIARCHS  
  PRESENTATION ON MARRIAGE  
  GENUINE BIBLICAL MARRIAGE  
  CARNAL MARRIAGE  
  Bible Monogamy - A History  
  BIBLE POLYGAMY - AKJV (New Testament Examples)  
  BIBLE POLYGAMY - AKJV (OldTestament Examples)  
  A Baptist Pastor's View  
  Antidisestablishmentarianism  
  Homeboy Security Strikes Again  
  Ancient Landmarks Forgotten (but not gone)  
  Marriage and Divorce - Part 1  
  Marriage and Divorce - Part 2  
  sinful marriage  
  Some Food for Thought...  
  More Food for thought  
  Read it My Way or Hit the Highway  
  Patriarchs in the Bible  
  NWO - by LeahsGrace  
  Links Worth Looking into  
  Think it won't happen?  
  NEO-FEMINIST MATRIARCHY  
  TWO WIVES TIMES TWELVE  
  DOUBLE SPEAK REVEALED  
  Most Pastors Won't Tell You  
  REDEFINING ADULTERY  
  SHE HAS NOT SINNED  
  "Oneness" gone Awry  
  The Monogamy Myth  
  HOW ROMANTIC !  
  SANCTIFICATION  
  FORNICATION & SANCTIFICATION  
  To the Forbidder  
  ONE FLESH  
  BEFORE YOU SIGN  
  REMARRIAGE  
  Matrimony  
  Celibacy  
  HISTORY OF MARRIAGE -- by James Campbell  
  Exposing Monogamy Myths (Treatise on Marriage)  
  DEAR PRUDENCE  
  CONDEMNATION  
  Religous Freedom  
  CALL A SPADE A SHOVEL  
  Inspiring Quotations  
  FULL BIBLE TRUTH  
  NEW AGE BIBLES  
  The Radical Truth  
  BILL OF NO RIGHTS  
  A BOOK WORTH READING  
  SOCIAL RE-ENGINEERING  
  ISLAM - A BRIEF HISTORY  
  Could it be POSSIBLE???  
  A FEW RADICAL FACTS  
  From Freedom to Fascism  
  International Woman's Day  
  ONE GOD JESUS ONLY  
  No Room for Patriarchs  
  One Day I took a Quiz  
  WAKE UP AMERICA  
  FALSE PROPHETS  
  THE FIRE IGNITES  
  IT'S ONLY MONEY  
  DO YOU DARE?  
  Thelyphthora: Reproduction  
  THELYPHTHORA - INTRODUCTION  
  REFUTING FALSE DOCTRINE  
  Examination Time?  
  Sanctified? or "Sanctioned"  
  The Israel CS Lim (website)  
  ARE YOU A POLYGYNIST?  
  APOSTOLIC PROTESTANT  
  Statement to APO GROUP  
  REFUTING CONJECTURE  
  DO NOT MUZZLE THE OX  
  THE HIGHER STANDARD  
  THELYPHTHORA GROUP  
  HABITAT FOR HUMANITY  
  A letter to the Brethren  
  Responses to E-Mails  
  BEHOLD THE MARK  
  What about Wesley  
  and Martin Madan  
  NEW DEVELOPMENTS  
  THE CHRIST MASS  
  RADICAL FACTION  
  THE REPROACH  
  THE COVENANT  
  JEZEBEL SPIRIT  
  NEO-FEMINISM  
  KIKI's KORNER  
  P.W. PURITAN  
  ** SMUT PILE **  
  TOUCH NOT  
  ***KINGSTING***  
  *** RADICAL ***  
  ***ABOUT ME***  
  The Glass House  
  HAVING SOME FUN  
  THELYPHTHORA - COMMENTARY  
  HEAR ME ROAR  
  PURE RELIGION  
  DOUBLE SPEAK  
  PREACH IT  
  ONE GOD  
  07/07/07  
  JESUS  
  Politics and Patriarchy  
  PREPARE  
  IMMIGRATION AND THE RFID CHIP  
  STAY TUNED  
  CALL A SPADE A SHOVEL  
  BAD BUTT ICONS  
  GOD USED HIM  
  
  
  Tools  
 
General : HERBERT ARMSTRONG WAS A FALSE PROPHET
Choose another message board
View All Messages
  Prev Message  Next Message       
Reply
 Message 2 of 3 in Discussion 
From: MSN NicknameJacobs_Trouble  in response to Message 1Sent: 11/15/2008 11:30 PM

Back in the early 80's I used to subscribe to a free publication called THE PLAIN TRUTH MAGAZINE. It had alot of good articles and alot of good doctrine. The FOUNDER of this particular organization was a man by the name of HERBERT W. ARMSTRONG. Today, I was recently researching this person and my findings were nothing short of shocking. I would like to share some of those findings here and also credit my source for this. Any additional input would be greatly appreciated. THANKYOU.

JT

________________________________________

Would you lift up the words of Herbert W. Armstrong? 

 ________________________________________


 

The towering sin of hypocrisy, deceit, lying and immorality continued right up until Herbert Armstrong’s last years. Robinson wrote in 1980, “Herbert Armstrong has been in love�?a number of times during the past decade.  He said himself he had been ‘in love�?with Amy [his secretary on the fourth floor of the Hall of Administration] when she was 25 years old.  He reported this to a group at Big Sandy in 1974.  He did say, when it was over, that he thought it might have been infatuation. “But earlier there had been the young Filipino girl whom he had brought over to this country, according to widespread reports.  However, he never did bring her to church with him!  He apparently kept her under wraps�?(p. 88). Along these lines, a former evangelist in the Worldwide Church of God �?Albert J. Portune �?told me personally that Herbert Armstrong had brought two Filipino girls to the U.S. and had put them in an apartment in Pasadena �?nobody knows what for.  However, later upon learning that one of the girls had found another boy friend, her own age, he grew furious and shipped them back to the Philippines!  Knowing about his preoccupation with sex, the purpose those nubile young girls served for him seems rather obvious.

Another woman, secretary to the head of the Personal Correspondence Department manager some years ago, told my wife and I she was privy to a mysterious secret concerning Herbert Armstrong.  This woman’s credentials and respectability are impeccable.  She told us that one day an elderly woman who was a Church member came into the office to the Richard Rice, the minister in charge.  She later began talking to her.  She had something very serious on her mind.  She told her she lived in an apartment house in Pasadena, and across the hall from her own apartment there lived a known prostitute.  She knew the woman was a prostitute. One day, she saw two men �?whom she says were Stanley Rader and Herbert Armstrong �?go into that woman’s apartment.  She was shocked.  Floored.  So the next time she saw them coming, she stood in front of the other woman’s door, barring their way.  When they asked her why she was there, she explained that she didn’t think God’s apostle should be visiting a prostitute!  They denied that they were aware that the woman was a prostitute, and beat a hasty retreat, and she never saw them there again. However, the incident so distressed this elderly church woman, that she felt she had to confide in someone �?and that is the reason she showed up at the office of the Personal Correspondence Department, to speak with the minister.
 

 Herbert Armstrong Remarries
 
Herbert Armstrong remarried when he was in his mid-80s.  Ramona Martin, his new wife, was a divorcee who was in her forties.  What few realize, however, is that there is evidence which would have come out at their divorce proceedings which would have shown that Herbert and Ramona were sleeping together, having a sexual relationship, as much as THREE YEARS prior to their ‘legalizing�?their relationship! Herbert Armstrong, who was 91 in 1984, divorced his wife Ramona, 45 years of age, on May 11 of that year, after seven years of marriage.  After a bitter divorce fight, the couple settled out of court, thus ending their seven-year-old marriage. In the divorce proceedings, reported the Los Angeles Times (May 12, 1984), “Armstrong’s lawyers had sought to limit evidence of a sexual nature.�?nbsp; Ramona’s “attorneys felt such evidence was crucial, however, to their case.  According to Ramona’s attorney, the couple had an understanding�?about Herbert’s “prior incestuous conduct with his daughter for many years.�?/FONT> Ramona’s own intimate relationship with Herbert Armstrong predated their marriage by a number of years, according to Ambassador Report.  The Report asserted in the April 1984 issue, “In recent months Ramona has admitted to friends that she and Herbert maintained a sexual relationship for THREE FULL YEARS PRIOR TO THEIR MARRIAGE�?(emphasis mine). The Ambassador Report article continues, “At some point along the way Ramona had some misgivings and so asked Herbert what he would do if he discovered some man in the church was involved in a non- marital sexual relationship with one of the church women.  He answered that he would immediately disfellowship them both.  'But, questioned Ramona, ‘isn’t  what we are doing also wrong?�?To her surprise Herbert said, ‘No.�?nbsp; When she asked why, Herbert explained, ‘Because I am an Apostle!’�?/FONT>
 
During the divorce trial, Ramona said she was sterilized in 1976 at Herbert Armstrong’s insistence. (In The Tangled Web, David Robinson claimed Herbert Armstrong admitted this same thing to him personally.)  However, Herbert and Ramona were not married until April 1977! This “footnote�?to the marriage of the elderly “apostle�?to the younger woman provides further insight into the thinking of Herbert Armstrong.  Why did Herbert insist Ramona become sterilized in 1976, unless they were already having sexual relations at that time?  Was he afraid that Ramona might become pregnant, while they were still unmarried, and he might be the father of a bastard child?  Was he remembering the fact that his own son got Shirley pregnant before they were married, and the shame and consternation it caused him at the time?  We can only guess at the answers, until those who were involved are more forthcoming. However, when I stop to think about these shocking, disturbing revelations about a man many believed was “God’s true apostle�?for this end-time generation, I can only shake my head for sadness and grief, at the sad spectacle of a man of God straying so far from God and His commandments! Both David Robinson, author of Tangled Web, and John Trechak, publisher and writer of Ambassador Report, are men of impeccable veracity and truth.  John himself studied at Loyola Marymount to become a lawyer.
 
Truly, as David lamented the fate of Saul, "How are the mighty fallen!" The sex life of Herbert Armstrong would normally be something of a private nature, something the public would not be interested in. However, when a public figure such as Herbert Armstrong preaches one thing and lives in a totally inconsistent manner, that is something else again.  For fifty years or longer, Herbert Armstrong preached the Word of God.  He stood for chastity, fidelity, and thundered against adultery, fornication, and sexual vices.  For many years, he claimed the marriage relationship was a �?FONT size=3>GOD PLANE RELATIONSHIP.�?Yet when it came to his own life, the truth becomes much more mundane, carnal, worldly, and physical.
As shocking and unbelievable as it may seem to many who read this, because of the enormous respect they have held toward Herbert Armstrong, the sad facts of the case are that he was much less than he appeared in public.  His private life reads more like a lurid novel fantasy, than the life of a true, bona fide servant of God.  How long will some allow blinders to cover their eyes?  How long will entire churches build their foundation on this errant “apostle,�?a foundation of quick-sand, claiming to be his divinely-appointed “successors�?  
 
Other men who knew Herbert Armstrong personally, testify to his being drunk and inebriated on many occasions.  One former minister, Dale Hampton, himself a recovered alcoholic, told audiences that in fact Herbert Armstrong was an “alcoholic.�?nbsp; After Herbert heard this, he canceled Hampton’s special ministerial program dealing with alcoholics in the Church. Al Carrozzo sums up the truth in these poignant words: “During this time I maintained a wait-and-see attitude.  It was difficult to make myself believe that the two men I respected most �?Garner Ted and Herbert Armstrong �?were total frauds! 

It was even more difficult for me to believe that Herbert was less than 100% sincere and honest.  However, on May 22, 1973, at 1 p.m., Ted left me with no doubts as to his father's real motivation, intentions, and modus operandi. In a private, three-hour meeting in his office, Ted told me he specifically disagreed with his father on many issues, including doctrine.  He explained that his dad desperately wanted to be accepted by the world, and that was the reason he was traveling around the world continuously, seeking the favor and audience of world leaders.“Ted admitted that he had seen his father 'stone drunk' on dozens of occasions.  He stated that his father had told him that he (Herbert) would do anything to keep the ‘Work�?afloat �?including lying, stealing, and bribery.  I was shocked, of course, but I later saw Herbert 'stoned' on several occasions and caught him in numerous lies.  I began to see those lies in his member and co-worker letters, and these lies have to this very day�?(“The Profligate Son,�?ibid., p.46-47).
 
Shocking as these statements no doubt are, to many people, Carrozzo continued his person account: “The year 1973 was one of revelation for me.  I learned of Ted’s profound and long-enduring sexual activities.  Herbert's total cover-up, corruption at the highest level in the WCG, Herbert’s pleasure blasts around the world under the guise of preaching the true gospel, squandering of vast sums of money on extravagant art treasures, exploitation of gullible and hard-pressed people, gross doctrinal error, and suppression of human beings mentally, emotionally, physically and spiritually.  Yes 1973 proved to me that dishonesty was a way of life with Ted and his father, and that way of life hasn't changed to this very day�?(p.47).
 
Al Carrozzo came to his conclusion back in 1973.  Of course, much more evidence of sin and dishonesty have come to the forefront since that time, over 30 years ago! When I read first-hand accounts of the many “sins�?of a man who claimed to be “God’s apostle�?on this earth during these end times, and who on occasion hinted or led others to believe that he was the “prophesied Elijah to come�?at the very end of this age, I could only shake my head in sadness and utter disgust.  What a legacy! How could such a man be “Elijah�?  How could entire churches today literally revere his memory and idolize him?  Personally, when I think of the evil things he did, and how abusive he often was in the conduct of his ministry, and unfair in judgment, I can only think of the terrible words of Christ Himself who said, in a prophecy for the days just before His second coming,
“But and if that EVIL SERVANT shall say in his heart, My lord delayeth his coming; and shall begin to SMITE his fellow-servants, and to eat and drink with the DRUNKEN; the lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, and shall CUT HIM ASUNDER, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites:  there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth�?(Matt.24:48-51).
 
For years I suffered in silence and said nothing.  I watched as the Church drifted away from some of the foundational principles of the Word of God.  I watched, horrified, as Herbert Armstrong compounded error on error, and at times falsely accused and attacked his fellow servants.  For years I saw his famous volcanic temper work its way.  I saw him threaten, bully, and bluster others in sheer indomitable intimidation.

 
I kept silence.  What could I do about it?  What could I say?  Who would listen to me?

 
SOURCE: http://triumphpro.com/elijah-and-hwa.htm




Replies to This Message The number of members that recommended this message.    
     re: HERBERT ARMSTRONG WAS A FALSE PROPHET   MSN NicknameJacobs_Trouble  11/16/2008 4:15 AM