MSN Home  |   Hotmail  |   Shopping  |   People & Groups
Windows Live ID  Web Search:    
go to XtraMSNGroups 
Groups Home  |  My Groups  |  Help  
 
NARCISSISTIC_PERSONALITY_DISORDER[email protected] 
  
What's New
  
  Home  
  Info For Members  
  Message Boards  
  _______�?_______  
  Message Forums  
  General  
  N Relatives  
  Divorce/Custody  
  Anything Goes  
  ______♥_______  
  Pictures  
    
  ______�?_______  
  THE NARCISSIST  
  Is Your Partner a Narcissist?  
  _______�?_______  
  Religious & Spiritual Guidance ++  
  20 Traits of Malignant Narcissism  
  _______�?________  
  N LINKS 1  
  Page 2  
  Page 3  
  Page 4  
  _______�?________  
  Who Gets Targeted  
  Our Caring Instinct  
  Women Who Love Psychopaths  
  _______�?________  
  THE PSYCHOPATH  
  NPD vs AsPD  
  Problems Mistaken for NPD/AsPD  
  Mental Disorders  
  HE SAID WHAT??  
  HE DID WHAT???  
  RED FLAGS  
  _______�? _______  
  Links for GUYS 1  
  Links for GUYS 2  
  _______�?_______  
  Obsessive Thinking  
  _______�?________  
  Questions to Dr. Vaknin  
  Dr. V's Resources  
  Resources 2  
  Dr. V's Snapshots 1  
  " Snapshots 2  
  Relationship Abuse  
  Case Studies 1  
  ______�?_________  
  Abuse Tactics  
  Domestic Violence  
  Effects of Abuse  
  _______�?________  
  Rebuttals from NPs  
  _______�?________  
  Translation Guide  
  Do they admit they're wrong?  
  Devalue & Discard  
  _______________  
  PROJECTION  
  Hoovering 101  
  _______�? ________  
  Abuse Management  
  BullyProof Yourself  
  BOUNDARIES  
  ______ ♥________  
  LEAVING  
  Leaving, Now What?  
  _______�?________  
  ï¿½?NO CONTACT  
  NC Management  
  Letting Go  
  DETACHING  
  _______�?________  
  â–ºSurvival Skills I  
  Survival Skills 2  
  _______♥________  
  Smear Campaign  
  Stalking  
  Critical Errors  
  The Glass House  
  _______♥________  
  DIVORCE/CUSTODY  
  Page 2  
  Page 3  
  Blaming the Victim  
  Divorce SnapShots  
  Avoiding N's RAGE  
  Divorce/Custody XN/P  
  _______♥________  
  Our Children  
  For Parents  
  _______♥________  
  Recovery Tips 1  
  Recovery Tips 2  
  Closure  
  Grieving an N  
  7 Recovery Stages  
  _______♥________  
  HEALING 1  
  Page 2  
  Page 3  
  Co-Dependency  
  _______♥________  
  Love and the N  
  Adult Children of Ns  
  Abusive Parents  
  _______♥________  
  About Ns  
  _______♥________  
  ELLIE'S STORY  
  Ellie's Journal  
  _______♥________  
  Recommended BOOKS  
  _______�?_______  
  Top Picks - Bancroft  
  Brown/Leedom  
  " N. Brown  
  " S. Brown  
  " Carter/Sokol  
  " Fay  
  " Hotchkiss  
  " Leedom  
  " Payson  
  " Simon  
  " Vaknin  
  _______♥________  
  ï¿½?MEMBER PAGES  
  MEMBER RECOMMENDED WEBSITES  
  _______♥________  
  Laughs 1  
  Laughs 2  
  Laughs 3  
  One Liners  
  _______♥________  
  LEARNING PLACES  
  For the Professionals  
  _______♥________  
  Tim Field's Bullies  
  Corporate N/Ps  
  Cons and Cults  
  Ns in Government  
  ______�?________  
  Resources for Ns 1  
  Resources for Ns 2  
  Can We Help Them?  
  _______�?________  
  TESTS & QUIZZES  
  CINEMA PSYCHOS  
  Just for Fun  
  ______�?________  
  If NPs Visit Us  
  Abbreviations  
  Acknowledgements  
  ___♥___ INDEX___  
  Q & As about Ns  
  Meet the Managers  
  
  
  Tools  
 

TOP PICKS -- BROWN/LEEDOM

Excerpts from Women Who Love Psychopaths
Inside the Relationships of Inevitable Harm
Authors: Sandra L. Brown, M.A. & Liane J. Leedom, M.D.
Health & Well-Being Publications, LLC
 
This book can be ordered from our websites at:
www.SafeRelationships.com or   www.WomenWhoLovePsychopaths.com


We hope that we will help women realize there is no reason to wait for a man to be formally “diagnosed�?to make decisions about whether or not they are in a dangerous relationship. If a woman is checking off behaviors on our checklist then she is with someone “psychopathic enough�?to be gravely concerned about. The question of differentiating between a man who has psychopathic traits and a man who is “a psychopath�?is a distraction, and in reality is only important to psychopathy research. The problem is that women often wait for him to be diagnosed “something�?before leaving.

So much of psychopathy flies under the radar of formal diagnosing and therapists who don’t specifically work with this pathology usually miss his signs and symptoms as reported by her. These men are very good at conning therapists and making the therapists believe that it’s the women who have issues. The reason the psychopaths are able to do this is that a positive and “happy�?presentation is often part of psychopathy. Therapists are used to treating depressed people and when they see the happy talkative psychopath and the distressed unhappy woman, they believe the woman is the “sick one.�?From the types of behaviors our women have reported, it is clear that even psychopathic traits (without the full blown diagnosis of psychopath) put women at considerable risk. That is because it doesn’t take much deviant, permanent, pathological behavior to greatly affect an intimate relationship. Men with psychopathic traits are toxic to all those who are close to them.

What’s In a Name?
Experts often disagree about what to call people with the group of personality traits we refer to as psychopathic. Some clinicians call them: Psychopaths, Pathological Narcissists, Sociopaths (those with the diagnosis of Antisocial Personality Disorder.) All of these disorders are similar and result in what we call “Inevitable Harm,�?so we have lumped them together for our discussion. We chose to use the term psychopath in the title of this book because so many people appropriately associate that name with harm to others.

How does a person “get�?psychopathy?
Now that you know more about “the names�?of these types of men let’s take a look at how a psychopath becomes a psychopath. What is it that makes the disordered person different from those we consider normal people? What causes a personality disorder (such as antisocial personality disorder and in the worst case, psychopathy), why are the disorders so destructive to the person who has them, and why can’t they be cured? Personality disorders are a form of “pathology.�?The word pathology doesn’t refer only to a psychopathy. Psychopathy is a type of disorder under the category of the 10 different personality disorders. Personality disorders mean the person’s personality structure is permanently established as disordered. But since this book is focused on the psychopath, our references to pathology will be related to the psychopath. Personality disorders permanently limit a person’s ability to:
1. Emotionally or behaviorally change and sustain the change.
2. Emotionally grow in any meaningful way.
3. Develop insight into how his or her own behavior affects others.

Much like a tree has to “deform�?itself in order to grow around negative things in it’s environment (like a sidewalk, power lines, or a park bench) so does a personality have to grow around the unfortunate negative things in its environment like abuse, alcoholic or violent parents, or pathological parenting. Since there is no going back to childhood and re-developing the whole personality structure and inserting in it what was never developed, there is little clinically that can be done about the condition, which means it’s permanent.

What about counseling for a personality disorder?
Some psychopaths who “attempt counseling�?or who are forced into counseling because of their failing relationships or because of criminal behavior and a court order, “tune out�?and “drop out�?quickly. It is no surprise that they see counseling as boring, stupid, or threatening. They are simply hard-wired against change. What may look like change to an anxious and hopeful partner is just temporary to get people off his back. In reality, the psychopath wants her to change to meet his needs. Part of pathology is the belief that “this current problem�?is someone else’s fault. One other type of pervasive (which means “no way to change it�? disorder is mental retardation. Both mental retardation and personality disorders are permanent. No one expects the mentally retarded to overcome being mentally retarded. Yet, women consistently think one day a permanently and pervasively personality - disordered psychopath will suddenly not be that. He can no more undo his disorder than a mentally retarded person can.

It is shameful that judges give children over to incredibly disordered men and yet they are not accountable for these decisions. The government, which literally represents us all, hands children over to psychopaths to be psychologically tormented and molded. We allow psychopaths to ensure their disorder carries over to the next generation. What the genes don’t fully create, the psychopath makes up for in his provision of an unfit environment. Each time this happens, we are all responsible for another life ruined.

Consistent good treatment of a woman in a relationship cannot be understood by a psychopath. The best he can do is fake it in the beginning, until he feels he has her hooked. The psychopath is a very good faker and deceiver. He can sometimes fake it and completely hood-wink her for a year or more. But since part of pathology is inconsistency, he isn’t likely to be able to fake it into eternity. At sometime, the mask slips and she realizes who she thought she got is not who she really got.

Psychopaths are motivated by power, status, and dominance more than any thing else. The purpose of the extraverted psychopath’s whole existence is to find ways to exert his power, status, and dominance. We refer to these as The Central Three. The only way The Central Three are enjoyed by him is through interactions with others. He certainly can’t get a power-kick if he is by himself. That means the psychopath has to be social in order to be recognized, and recognized in order to be dominant. Every one of his actions, decisions, and words are for the purpose of promoting his dominance—not to have a job, a hobby, a mate, or children. Those are but by-products of his pursuit of The Central Three. Everything is motivated by one goal alone: dominance. This makes the psychopath “machine-like�?in his drive to achieve dominance.

Additionally, one of the hallmarks of pathology is chronic inconsistency and the inability to sustain certain behaviors, especially positive healthy ones. By now, the psychopath is probably straining the limits of his ability to “keep it together�?and only present his positive attributes. By now, he’s tired of mimicking, mirroring, and holding up the mirage. He’s ready to let his guard down and be who he is. This is one of the reasons that the relationship is so fastpaced. He can’t do the faux-functionality forever.

During the luring stage of the relationship, the psychopath totally idealizes her. He indicates he sees her as wonderful, perfect, his soul mate. He notes her amazing abilities, her brilliance, sweetness, and any other personality trait he can hone in on. He did this in order to speed up the sensation of attachment and move the relationship forward quickly. Once the psychopath is assured of her belief that he does in fact idealize her, he exerts The Central Three in the relationship. To do that, he devalues her. In one sentence he may still idealize her. If she displeases him or asserts her self against his dominance he will devalue her—calling her useless, worthless, or compare her negatively to other women he has been with. He may devalue her even if she did not challenge him or he may never idealize her again. Those days of compliments may be gone and she now only experiences his constant devaluing. This leaves her feeling that she needs to do something to get him back to how he felt previously about her. Since she tests very high in relationship investment, she will want to try to make the relationship shift back to its previous dynamics.

Additionally, part of the psychopath’s pathology is his “pathological world view�?which includes how he sees himself, others, and the world. His world view also dictates the issues of truth in relationship to other people. His view on truth is skewed and he may believe that truth is what he thinks it is, as opposed to hard fact. In the beginning, the psychopath appeared to be truthful, although he wasn’t. “His interpretation of events was always the truth. I don’t think he knew what was true and what was really false. Because he believed it, it was hard to tell that he wasn’t telling the truth. �?/EM> Psychopaths tend to mix it up and combine truth with lies, or truth with distortions. In the beginning when a woman is still bonding with him, her ear is not in tune with his concept of truth “Looking back, there was a lot of fiction mixed in with facts.�?“It was always distorted. He thought his truth was above other people because he had this spiritual experience with God.�?“He doesn’t like the real world. He makes up his own reality and then asks me to live the lie with him.�?/EM>

While truth is the bedrock of intimate relationships, a psychopath’s world view of a relationship does not include the concept of truth. He believes, “each person’s truth is how he or she sees it.�?He tells the truth only when he is in trouble for lying and forced to. His world view of manipulating others is seen as a twisted form of “opportunity�?for him. Conning others out of money or things is in his world view, “salesmanship�?and just “convincing them they really wanted to give me that anyway.�?Living off of others, in his world view, is “the fortunate opportunity given to others to be around me.�?Or, “there are givers and receivers and I’m just a receiver.�?/STRONG>

What really occurs is that the women fall in love with a lifesize cardboard cut out which is a “look-a-like�?of a real man. These are the cardboard cutouts of life-size people you see in Blockbuster Video. The psychopath and the stage of his luring are as shallow and phoney as the cut out.

With a complete straight face, he can say one thing and do another, do something and say the opposite, or say and do the opposite of what he did last week. These dichotomies produce serious distress in the women because of the chronic instability in the relationship.

“Our intimacy and high emotions exploded rather than evolved. He seemed to want and need so much from me. But it was a smoke screen—he could also be gone in a flash.�?nbsp; In one sentence he is likely to say how attached and bonded he is and in the next sentence remind her how disposable she is or how he will leave her or the relationship. Some psychopaths don’t say it out right but “hint�?or leave clues lying about that they are thinking of leaving, or they become aloof, detached, disinterested, and distant. “He would draw me in and then push me away with various methods. I was constantly perplexed about why it seemed that he wanted a relationship with me on some levels but not on others. He was committed at times but not entirely. I’ve never been so confused about how someone really felt about me.�?“The intensity—the changeability—how one minute it could all seem good and normal and I would forget the craziness and then suddenly the tables turned and the monster I was living with re-appeared.�?/EM>

Psychopaths are highly pleasure motivated and will excessively seek what they enjoy. However, unlike normal people they are not motivated by pain and don’t learn from painful experiences. If you can’t learn from painful experiences, you are going to repeat the same mistakes over and over again. This is why breaking up with the psychopath and going back later to have “taught him what he’ll lose if he does it again,�?does absolutely nothing to help the relationship.

Many women wonder why psychopaths are never monogamous. In part their entertainment drive is so high that they are always looking for something new, exciting and different. His entertainment drive will push him for the latest and newest woman.

Why don’t more people pick up on this power-hungry psychopath? Interestingly, the social dominance drive operates largely outside of everyone’s awareness. Lack of awareness about this drive is the main reason psychopaths are able to fool everyone�?even trained professionals. Since most people don’t have a reason to become “acutely�?aware of the problems of a strong social dominance drive, the psychopath simply looks like a charismatic leader who is loved by many.

The psychopath hopes that she will tune in to his every need, because when she sets a limit or a boundary he will quickly remind her why his needs are important and should be met.
 
the psychopath gets a “feel�?for her level of tolerance by starting out with small boundary violations and working up to full fledged relationship violations. What is tolerated by her is then pushed as a limit.
Notice: Microsoft has no responsibility for the content featured in this group. Click here for more info.
 MSN - Make it Your Home�