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| | From:  ladysinging (Original Message) | Sent: 8/10/2008 1:14 p.m. |
My NPDexH is supposed to have our sons every other weekend (as is common in divorce); however, he wants the boys when it's convenient for HIM. What a surprise, huh? He hasn't seen them in two weekends (work was his excuse) and is supposed to spend Saturday and Sunday (not Friday since this was inconvenient for him) with them this weekend. This morning I get an email telling me that he needs to bring them home at 2 on Sunday so he can play tennis! Are any of you experiencing your NPDex dictating when HE wants the kids rather than what the agreement says. This infuriates me since for the last year, he's berated me for moving 40 minutes away from him and "taking them away from their father". |
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Yes, mine tried all this for several years. Would skip visitations for weeks at a time going to Vegas Atlantic City . And honestly the cusotdy evaluator didn't care. Finally, when I got a court order after about 18 months, I would not budge on any time at all. If he did not keep his children per the schedule on file at the court house then he was in violation of a court order regarding the children and would loose custody. I made this very clear to him. When My N then tried the "your not being a coperative parent" whine, I remined him 1.He got waht he asked for -the court ordered schedule- and follow it. 2. If he wanted me to be his "activities" babysitter/nanny he should have stayed married to me. Do you have a court ordered schedule outlining dates and times? |
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If the current visitation is court-ordered, I would have a lawyer send him a note stating that if he has problems meeting his current visitation, he is welcome to return to court and address it there, but you are not going to be changing your schedule weekly to accommodate him. If he misses a scheduled weekend, he is out of luck until his next scheduled visitation two weeks later. There is a big difference between mutual flexibility and manipulation by one parent to inconvenience the other. This is a control tactic--I see it a lot with my own kids. If XN has something better to do, they expect us to be the ones to jump through hoops to rearrange the schedule. Mainly what it shows is what a low priority their kids are in the N scheme of things. |
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Also, if he misses his weekend and asks you if he can have the kids the next one instead, just say "sorry, no, we already have plans." Then make plans, even if it is just to go out to eat on Saturday afternoon or make cookies together. Keep in mind, even the mundane activities you do with you kids are critically important to their sense of stability, especially since dad is such a jerk. When kids have one N parent who is a flake they desperately need the other one to provide a solid home life. Don't let your XN sabotage that! Fill your weekends waaaaaaaay ahead of time!! LOL |
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| | | From: hip2you | Sent: 12/10/2008 4:56 a.m. |
I get that a lot too. As long as I can take my girls, I do. They are happier and better off here anyway. And I agree with thx-rachel...never, NEVER agree to switch out. Just say "well I can't switch b/c we have plans, but I would be glad to take them that day you can't." Don't be bothered that he bagged out for a selfish reason...just remember you accommodate b/c you are not. You can play the lawyer game, but in the end how far does it really go for all the $$ it cost.
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My ExNH does the same thing. Somewhere along the line he feels I am his free babysitter. It all works out for me in the end.
You have 2 options.
1. Agree and work around his so called schedule, and DOCUMENT, DOCUMENT, DOCUMENT! Someday, when you get tired of it, you can deny a visitation, if its just guidelines, or you will have a book full of examples for the court, when he decides he needs his CS lowered. You can prove you need it raised, as he doesn't take his kids the time they are scheduled with him.
2. Deny. Most visitation agreements in my state are guidelines. If you have a guideline, then do as you feel fit. If you have an order, then adhere to the order. The difference being, you can't be held in contempt with a guideline, but you can for an order, unless you have reasonable and extenuating circumstances, that can be proved in a court of law.
I myself have taken both avenues. Since I have a guideline, when the Ex started changing the agreed upon time to pick them up, I started making sure I had family plans that started exactly 15 minutes, after scheduled time. He was supposed to pick up at 5, if he called me and told me he couldn't make it until 6, I would say, well you will just have to miss this weekend then, as we have plans, that can't be changed. I will just take kids with me. When he said he could get them later, I reminded him of what was agreed upon.
NOW, with that said, someone on here along time ago, gave me the very best piece of advice ever regarding the N and visitation, and here it is.....the Ns only want to make sure that you are the NS. They will do anything to make your life more difficult. When starting a custody battle, with temporary orders in the works, EXNH was to have kids every other weekend. I called him on a Monday, 12 days before his next visitation, told him I was going to Vegas that weekend and wanted to make sure he was going to be taking the kids. He would say yes. That gave him 12 days to stew about it, and lo and behold on Friday mornings he would be calling me and telling me he couldn't take the kids that weekend, with a smirk in his voice. Now, believe it or not, I did this the next 3 visitation weekends in a row. Each time claiming to reschedule my trip because he kept canceling out. Documented I had planned to go to Vegas, which I probably would have, with my BF, if exnh would have taken kids, but he didn't. I documented 4 skipped visitation, and basically the custody thing the judge laughed at.
Now, if I truly have plans, and exnh tries to pick up kids late or wants to bring them home early, I advise him if he wants his visitation he has to take the full schedule. He usually will.
He currently works Saturdays, I know this for a fact, so I am pretty flexible around a REAL work schedule. If he bails of his visits, and I find out he is running around, I bail on his next visit. Usually straightens him out pretty quick.
Of course all of this is dependent on the fact we have a guideline, and if he wants that changed, he has to take me to court, and again, what an idiot he is going to look like.
Last but not least, I always want to spend every minute with my kids, so its never truly a problem, unless I am trying to RSVP something on that weekend.
My Ex usually wants to bring kids back early so he can go party. I used to say sure, and would be so happy in front of him, and would make sure to say in front of him, how happy I was that he was willing to give up his scheduled time so I could have more time with the kids. LOL. It is true, but when he realized he was um, omg, making me happy, he stopped doing that too. Remember his goal is to disrupt and destroy my life. LOL.
And finally, if EXNH tries something crazy like recently telling me he couldn't take kids until 9pm because he was busy doing a job on the side, and the kids and I seen him out with GF and kids, then I do something silly too. Like he was supposed to bring kids home at 6 on Sunday. But since he didn't take them until 9pm Friday, with what I don't consider a very good reason to skip out on your kids, I was conveniently out of town, until 9pm Sunday. He was mad, mad, mad, because he had plans to party with his GF starting at 7. He text me, and I told him I would be back as soon as possible, but since we didn't discuss it, I assumed he would keep kids his full 48 hr schedule. Too funny.
He has always been good with the kids, and never showed me any reason to believe he is not now. Kids love going with their Dad, cuz he is the N Disney Dad. So of course I can do these things, without worry.
So there are a few ideas for you. Sorry you have to deal with this kind of crap. I just make sure exnh never sees me upset. He may make me madder than hell when it comes to how little he really chooses to see his kids, but I always act like he is doing me a favor, and in the end I get what I want. Peace of mind, and probably about 99.9% of the time with my kids. He is the one losing out, for pulling the stupid stuff he does, all just to try to make me mad. |
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Thank you so much giving these ideas!!!!
I am just filing for divorce from NH and still a bit scared what might com up with the visitation thing.
Great insight you gave how to deal with that..
Sarigul
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| | | From: hip2you | Sent: 12/10/2008 2:38 p.m. |
I also found that my N only fought me on things I wanted or showed interest in. He said he wanted a buy out on my car, I said he can have it. Issue dropped. He said he wanted to take half of the antiques in the house. I said he can come in and take whatever he wants (like he knows what is or isn't an antique). Issue dropped. Deep in my heart I know he did not want our girls. He was never home or always trying to pawn them off to my mom or his family for 3 or 4 days at a time so he could go out to dinner with me and engorge, or take a trip to Atlantic City, or whatever. At times I was tempted to say he can have primary residence and custody, just b/c I KNOW he would than back off. But I could never risk that. That was a fight I fought hard on. He is an addict, claims to be recovering but I know better. My heart is in my throat when the kids are with him. He wanted overnights on school days, I refused. My arguement always the same...they need consistency. Remember those words. It was the ONLY battle I won.  |
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I am telling you, in the case of my N, he will do anything and everything to try to make me mad. So of course it has taken about a year and a half to get this all worked out, and I really don't get upset at all anymore. I always EXPECT he will try to pick up kids late, bring them back early, or not visit at all.
The only thing that does upset me, is my youngest 2 are 3, and 4. They get crushed when he does these things, and then I hurt for them. I will say the upside is they are getting taught at a very young age about Ns. Hopefully they grow to be strong individuals who don't let anyone walk on them, as their Dad has done to them.
It seems crazy really, because Ns are supposed to be somewhat unpredictable, but the one constant is they seem to want to do whatever they can to upset you. When you get this line of thinking in your head, as I have done, you really can stay a step ahead of them, or at least beside them.
When I went back and read my post, it seems like a manipulation game, which it really isn't. I just know my N and how little he values time with his kids, and I know how to work around his attitude, to ultimately get what I want, which is all the time in the world with my kids, to teach them and raise them the right way! |
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| | | Sent: 17/10/2008 1:43 a.m. |
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| | | Sent: 18/10/2008 11:43 p.m. |
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| | | From: femfree | Sent: 26/10/2008 4:44 p.m. |
Hi ladysinging Visitation Tips NO!! You MUST not do anything which deviates from the agreement in place and indicate you are not willing to do anything which results in a reduction of your precious time with your children. However - you must appear to be willing to be co-operative. Thus, question your N as to the EXACT details of the exchange difference he needs. His request seems reasonable if: this reduces the amount of time the N spends with his children - who wants their children with a mentally disordered person? Make sure that his "needs" of playng tennis is well documented. Suggested reply to N. "N. you write "I need to return the children by 2:00 pm Sunday as I will be playing tennis (quote him exactly)" - this is satisfactory to me. I have a commitment later that day so you will need to have the children here NO LATER THAN 2:15 PM" cheers, ladysinging! it's a fine line between being co-operative, which the courts will look for and being in a position of having the N constantly change the terms of the agreement. Be prepared to say no while appearing and acting co-operatively - you get the idea. Take Care femfree |
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