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General : DR. VAKNIN'S WEEKLY CASE STUDY: CHERI BLOSSOM
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(3 recommendations so far) Message 1 of 17 in Discussion 
From: XtraMSN Nickname·TammyJo·  (Original Message)Sent: 5/04/2004 4:36 p.m.
Congrats to Cheri Blossom!
 
Here is her story:
dear sam.
i met the N 10 yrs ago through friends and we hit it off like a house on fire instantly..  we laughed and laughed and i invited him to my party that weekend,  he showed up early and brought a big bag of groceries from the most elite market in los angeles along with several bottles of the finest wine.. i have to admit i was impressed with his taste and generosity.  we had a nice day and he asked me out to dinner that week.
he was separated from his wife and was so the victim of her and her daughter who were both so very selfish he said.. he had no rights in his own house, had to ask for a friend to visit, could not smoke in the house. had to wear jeans to bed as the 9 yr old could come in to the room at any time.  she was angry that he did cocaine and had humilated him with an intervention, he had just gotten back off the road with a rock band and claimed he had not touched the drug in 9 mos.. they had never gotten along, he nearly backed out of his marriage bla bla bla.  she was leaving for london in 4 mos and a divorce was what they both wanted, it was mutual.. no problem.  he was staying in a hotel..
 
his wife had brain tumors and surgeries where she lost an eye.. he hated her he said but stayed through the surgeries.  she had given him $100,000 down payment on this house.. he did not ever pay her back but lied to me and told me he had put $80,000 into her flat in london which she sold, and that she had never put one dime in for anything. except that loan for the house,, she signed a quit claim too...
 
at one point he moved back home to be near his computer he said but was miserable there..  he did not call for a couple of weeks.. i was sad about it but did not call him.. i really thought he was falling in love with me and did not understand but did not bother him.. i was happy with my life, i had a darling little place right on the beach,  an art studio in my living room, flowers hanging everywhere and my sweet daughters with me.. no problem even though it was disappointing..
soon he showed up at my door all broken and sad,, said he was so unhappy living in the maids room.. i told him if he was that unhappy that he was welome to come stay with us..  he could have the couch if he wanted to be alone.. no problem.. he did come to stay..
we were SO happy, we laughed and laughed and could not disagree on anything.. he wanted to paint with me, he wanted for us to have a big barn on an island someday both painting and having lots of animals and maybe even some kids.. i was 45 at the time.. he was 43..
 
he was a world class artist, very famous in his industry and had made $100,000,000 that year.. yet he was penniless now and someone had stolen his money he said.. he had been on the road for 25 yrs only in one place for 2 weeks at a time.. he had biz managers and had no idea what went on with his finances.. 
yet he took me to europe twice in those 4 mos first class, 5 star hotels. he spoiled me buying me anything i wanted, and two of each if i wanted..we attracted wonderful strangers together.. we had SO much fun , we were the perfect combination.  he thought i was the cutest thing he has ever seen..  he loved the things about me that were really my flaws.. i dropped things was a bit lucy like,, he would come home and yell for me saying he knew his honey was home cuz the cupboard doors were open the dryer open the soup boiling on the stove while i was topless window washing.. he ADORED ME..
 
i began handing him money, he had asked me to marry him, he had a beautiful beach house we were moving in there when his wife left.. well things changed the very night i moved in .. he was controlling. did not want me to even clean the house.  we had our very first fight.. and it was a bad one.. he had wanted to keep both places and i had won the argument as he was not working and it was just crazy to have two places 10 miles apart, both on the beach and him not working..
he liked my daughter who was 12 at the time and was always saying how refreshing she was after his last stepdaughter who was spoiled and selfish like her mother..
soon it started,, he began disappearing at night. would call and say he was on his way home and never got there.. he showed up early in the AM all high on cocaine and would do this again and again each week.. he was spending all his money on this drug and i was having to come up with money out of my savings or work to cover him.. we fought terribly over this.  i worried myself SICK over him,  i did not know if he was alive or dead, he would not even answer his cell phone to say he was ok..  he also would not finish his divorce and marry me.. i was worried about this too. and had not protected myself when i gave him money,, he took my needs as attacks and when i said what if something happened to you your ex could come in here and throw me out he replied you want me DEAD and now says that i beat him up night after night with my demands..  i did not yell or scream, i simply stated my fears and my needs..
things did not get better for years and eventually i was broke and he had tapped out every friend and relative he had.. his parents had given him every dime they had, they were in their 80s and he had used his fathers credit card for those trips he took me on and his father is now in debt to amex for $165,000,, no credit at all anymore.. his mom STILL let him use her cards and even brought over a check for $25,000 after all this, that some card co had sent her.  he took it..
at one point two yrs ago he had an affair on me.. he was cruel and sadistic about it.. made me leave the house and visit my family so he could be alone he had OW here in our home,in our bed, she was wearing my shoes and lingerie.. stole my $500 shoes. and other expensive things.. he denied this.. vehemently, yet she was the only one in this house who wore my size shoes.. she turned out to be a P, for real.. scared him and he came back to me.. i took him back as i loved him so much and i was dependent on him now.. (great)..
my mom had died and left me a small amount of $$,, he quickly got me to hand that over too.. Ã’ill give it back to you famous last words.. he said that every time i gave him money.. i saved this house for us 4 times.  found investors for his project $100,000,
i was getting depressed, he too was very depressed and was now saying that it was me, i was bad luck.. that ever since he had met me his revenue stream had dried up.. he had not worked since he met me..bla bla bla.. he was attacking me for being lucy like, he began to tell me to PAY ATTENTION.. put me down for not WORKING>. yet he did not want me working before,, he wanted me cooking, gardening, topless windowwashing and making dinners and parties.  he had changed what he wanted..  he got meaner and meaner.. and i was trying harder and harder to please him.. i got a little job cooking, it was very small  but i love to cook and it was only an hour a night.. it was pocket money.. he hated it that i was a servant... i asked if he was seeing anyone as he was acting the same way as he had when he cheated on me the first time.. his answer when do i have time to see anyone?.. evasive of course..
then i found the emails.. he was seeing a woman in his industry.. she was VERY impressed with his resume.. he was the top designer in the world, he was down and out, and she wanted to HELP she said..  she would revive his career, she would get his project funded AND have his baby.  which i had refused to do until he stopped the cocaine and disappearing acts.. besides but this time i was too old to have a baby, unless i bought an egg, and he found this WEIRD even though when i still could have the baby and we talked about it, he said that we would find a surrogate to have the baby for us.. he did not want me to have to go through the pregnancy....
i gave this man his fantasy, he liked sex with men. he wanted me there, i agreed and it was always about him.. never ever did he make love to me.. never even once.. it was either his fantasy or nothing..
 
so i was devastated when he again blatantly cheated on me.  got dressed in front of me, put on perfume and shaved and even asked me how he looked as he whistled his way out the door to spend the night with her. ( he was now saying that he was tired of no sex)  huh???.she was demanding that he get me out of the house if he wanted to be with her.. she called on his cell when he was having a deep conversation with me about our relationship. we were at a restaurant and he went to the bathroom saying he had to go.. i went to the door and  i heard him say we are in the middle of it right now she was orchestrating our breakup..  i cried and cried and begged him to go to therapy with me.. he seemed compassionate but still went to her..
he would leave every night and charged his motel rooms for the two of them on my credit card,  he paid the bills but it was still very disrespectful i felt. and it hurt me terribly to see it...  eventually he was called to NY on a 9 mo job.  they got him a place there and a BIG salary as well as $100,000design fee.. and off he went,, ]
he told me we were sort of broken up he was waiting to see changes.. he wanted to see the strong beautiful woman he met 9 yrs earlier, not this sad, depressed, woman i had become.. i was wrecking cars. getting tickets. losing things.. setting wastebaskets on fire lol.. i was a wreck..
he was in NY WORKING he said.. he was also working the woman and when i said i would have the baby he said why dont we let her have the baby for us..  he was putting up hoops for me to jump through and when i did he only put up higher ones.. she moved to NY and in with him.. he called less and less and finally came back 4 mos later and told me it was over.. yet moments before he left he said to me.. i know we love each other cheri. but we are just not good together.. then he still gave me hope.. he seemed jealous wanted to know who i was with, what i was doing, did i have a boyfriend??  it was crazy.. then i found a cancelled check for $9,000 to a jewelry store,, i KNEW it was a ring for her and when i asked he lied totally,, by now if his lips were moving they were lying.. he promised money , but not nearly what i had put into this house.. the house has now gone up in value about $500,000 and he wanted to give me $40,000 period.. he keeps the house.. the girl moves in and i leave with nothing really since i am now $45,000 in debt on account of HIM.. 
he has now married her. i am to be out of here in june and still he has not sent money.. i have no idea where i am going, what i will do.. i have no career was too mentally upset to work, could not even think for a year.. i am better now, working a bit. but can in no way support myself in even the most modest lifestyle,, i need school, i need money to start a new life..  he made $400,000 last year and has just spent it all iimpressing his new wife.. she is  a hard core woman, and i am very afraid of her.  i recently came across a letter from her written in the beginning, he was feeling like a bad person for dumping his best friend and most stauch supporter.. and her words think of your OWN hopeful horizons, if you love her and this is what you truly want, let her go, she will find her path, she sounds like a nice person, but you can not save anyone, lend her the dignity of a woman and let her find her own way
oh brother.. talk about a manipulator. just what he needs, to be encouraged to be any more selfish than he already is and was........
i want justice.. i have no legal rights i am told.. i am at his mercy.. i have bleeding gums and my smile is my best asset.. i gave my ALL to this man,, all my money, all my love, my soul.  why can he not be honorable enough to pay me what he owes me and let me go on.. let me have a chance in life??? does he want to see me suffer??? i feel like he is giving me tough love or something.  like i am a bad little girl.. i am NOT bad and i m not drinking or getting high on drugs.. i am just trying to heal and it has been a HARD one, i have been suicidal over losing my dream home and my best friend.. i miss him, and yet i know he is not there, he was a fantasy.. he is painting now in NY in that big open place with HER.. how much punishment do i get???  is is not enough to break my heart, to dump me and leave me bleeding??? he now has to keep me in limbo for 18 mos not knowing what if anything i am getting.. he has ruined my credit and how will i even find a place to rent with no credit.. i feel like he has destroyed me..  he says he will always love me.. that he will never let harm come to me>>> well now, i think the harm has already been done NO????
do i try to work with him.. do i sell all the furniture?  do i act as if i trust in him.. what is the best way to inspire him to be as honorable as possible??? or is that EVEN POSSIBLE?????  i know he wants to remain on good terms with me.. but his wife wants NOT, i think she knows who he is.. already..and may be worried that he still loves me and is using her.
this mans parents love me very much, i was a member of the family and the first ever they had even liked let alone loved...i used to think he would never throw me out on the street but am not sure now.. i think his wife hates me as i hated his ex, things he tells her and i know she worries inside that he is only with her for what she offered, and she knows that he had much guilt over leaving and he told her he loved me but could just not work it out.. she could and will influence him to think of himself (and her of course)  i am worried sick.. have no support from my family as they are already on the list of debtors..   
 
it now turns out that he lied to me from day one.. i have made contact with his exwife and she tells me that she NEVER wanted a divorce, she was hoping he would sort himself out and ask her back..  she was devastated when she called the house after leaving town and found me there within 3 days..  he never put $80.000 into her apt in london as he told me but more like $5000,, he has taken her for $130,000,,this has shocked me to find that i was OW,, that she suffered the same pain that i am going through now at MY hands.. i suffer from horrible guilt.  i cannot BELIEVE the lies this man told me and that i BELIEVED him..
 
my first question is,, what tactic do i use to get this N to cooperate with me.. and receive what is owed to me..? what is the best way to handle him.?. i have found that if i try to be understanding, i am a doormat, if i cry i am the victim, if i am mean, i get immediate response but am called an angry woman.  


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The number of members that recommended this message. 2 recommendations  Message 3 of 17 in Discussion 
Sent: 6/04/2004 3:08 a.m.
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 Message 4 of 17 in Discussion 
From: XtraMSN Nickname·TammyJo·Sent: 6/04/2004 3:43 a.m.
Question Number Two:
  i had contact today.  every time we have contact i am left in tears
for one reason or another.  i feel like one of the biggest blocks for
me is closure.  there seems to be NO closure just open doors and
confusion.  when i try to reason with him he makes me feel crazy.  i
cannot explain it. but basically he has rewritten history, for instance
today i was in tears while on the phone with him, .. he  is now saying 
"it was My house cheri" i then pointed out to him that he had told me
for 9 yrs that in no uncertain terms it was OUR house and that this was
why i put money in to it.   ----.  his reply "you are a piece of SH_T
cheri "    click-dahhhhhhhhh.   . why is he attacking me when he is the
CLEARLY the winner here????
i am still REELING from how he played me and took me DOWN (, i am not
some chick who just fell out of the crib.)    then i feel CRAZY on the
other hand and wonder if he is just a normal guy and i am CRAZY..  
right now i DO FEEL LIKE I DON T KNOW UP FROM DOWN.. WTF???????  cheri


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Sent: 6/04/2004 6:31 a.m.
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Sent: 6/04/2004 10:23 a.m.
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Sent: 6/04/2004 10:26 a.m.
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(1 recommendation so far) Message 8 of 17 in Discussion 
From: XtraMSN NicknamesamvakSent: 6/04/2004 11:32 a.m.
Dear Cheri,
 
I understand your pain and confusion - but am not sure what your question is ...:o((
 

As I wrote in another weekly case, the Narcissist provides no closure because he (or she) has lost interest in the counterparty but also because the narcissist himself (herself) doesn't fully grasp what has transpired. The narcissist cannot provide the injured ex-partner with explanations, reasoning, justification, or enlightenment. He (she) has none. The narcissist simply IS, without rhyme or reason.

 

Why is he attacking you?

 

Because he is angry and feels threatened. Your assertiveness, critical thinking, and refusal to automatically comply with his demands is, to him, shocking and frightening. Almost unnatural.

 

Read this:

 

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq73.html

 

Take care.

 

Sam


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 Message 9 of 17 in Discussion 
From: XtraMSN Nickname·TammyJo·Sent: 7/04/2004 3:41 a.m.
Sam    thank you so very much for your brilliant strong suggestions to me so far.. i so appreciate the time you have taken to help me..                 some one posted this question on the board last week,  i found it very interesting.  does an N/P ever re=idealize someone after they have been totally devalued ?             i am gathering my information and proof of his lies. in case i should need to need it to follow through with any "unspoken" threats that i make. i am hesitant to openly declare war, since he is a pit bull and may get VERY nasty.  ..a veiled and yet serious threat will be "perceived" by him if i let him know that i will not take this lying down,..
he seems to have taken the stance of the "father" figure with me.. lol.. and if he DEEMS me worthy he will help.. he SEEMS to have more respect for me when i appear to him to have goals to achieve..  does he really want for me to be successful in my  new life.. or is this threatening to him???   thank you sam   cheri



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(1 recommendation so far) Message 11 of 17 in Discussion 
From: XtraMSN NicknamesamvakSent: 7/04/2004 5:35 a.m.
 
Dear Cheri,
 
Thank you for your kind words.
 
Yes, narcissists often re-idealize devalued and discarded sources of supply.

Narcissists act (or refrain from acting) based solely on the availability of Narcissistic Supply (or lack thereof). If the narcissist keeps coming back - he does so because he is convinced that there is Narcissistic Supply to be obtained - or because he has yet to secure an alternative Source of Supply.

Narcissistic Supply is about attention, however thwarted and depraved. Adversity, intrigue, fighting, notoriety, infamy, quarrelling, active rebuffing - all constitute Narcissistic Supply. If ignored consistently for a sufficiently long time, though, the narcissist is likely to let go, if he is not vindictive.

All past sources "qualify" for "re-activation" once the narcissist's supply has been depleted and no other sources are in sight.

Only past sources who made it unequivocally clear that they will allow no further contact are "exempt". But this is very rare. Even a divorce is not the end of the relationship with the narcissist. There is common property, common children, the occasional phone conversation, mail to be forwarded, etc.

Sources of PRIMARY Supply are ranked by social status, fame/celebrity, wealth, power/influence, etc. Narcissistic Supply emanating from a top politician or the CEO of a large company far outweighs anything offered by the neighborhood grocer.

Spouses or girlfriends provide SECONDARY Supply and, as sources, they are utterly interchangeable. Their role is to "accumulate" information about past supply and release it to the narcissist when supplies are low ("Remember how famous you were in 1985?", "Remember how you won the tournament?"). This is called "regulation" of Narcissistic Supply.

Thus, to recap, reversion to old Sources of Secondary Supply is automatically triggered when the narcissist's supply has been depleted and no other sources are in sight.

You ask:

he seems to have taken the stance of the "father" figure with me.. lol.. and if he DEEMS me worthy he will help.. he SEEMS to have more respect for me when i appear to him to have goals to achieve..  does he really want for me to be successful in my  new life.. or is this threatening to him???

Sam:

You are letting yourself be manipulated again. He doesn't give a fig's leaf about you or your life. He most definitely does not hold the slightest respect for you.

Playing the father figure gives him a feeling of smug omnipotence AND allows him to have you exactly where he wants you to be:

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq11.html

There is no negotiating with a psychopath. No "contracts", "deals", "agreements", "promises", or "vows".

And don't kid yourself - he cannot be emotionally manipulated for a very simple reason: he has no emotions (as you know them). He feels only fear, need, jealousy, or hatred. Psychopaths are very basic automata. Don't get mowed down by one.

http://samvak.tripod.com/journal50.html

http://samvak.tripod.com/faq33.html

Sam


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(2 recommendations so far) Message 12 of 17 in Discussion 
From: XtraMSN Nickname·TammyJo·Sent: 8/04/2004 12:34 a.m.
when i look back i see that N has REALLY changed in the past 3 yrs..  
we had MUCH tragedy happen then,, deaths. money problems and i fell 
apart and was not the rock anymore this seems to be where he was not 
the same anymore.. maybe it was my weakness that he could not take.  
maybe it reflected back on him....  but   i would wake up in the night 
and he was stroking my hair and kissing my face.. i always wondered 
what this was all about.  he was not comfortable being intimate with 
me.. and i did not like sex with him.. he was a bad lover.. i was 
happier just cuddling with him,, and he seemed FINE with that for 
years.. then said that he was tired of a relationship without sex. (one 
of his reasons now to leave).  i wonder if it was me?? why did he kiss 
me when i was sleeping and not when i was awake?????. since he clearly 
liked men sexually.  his sexuality has me very confused  he ONLY wanted 
sex on cocaine and only with men.. i was there to watch basically..  i 
thought that since i allowed this and would on occasion do this with 
him that i was providing him with something that no other woman would 
give him..  is he intimate with HER?? was it ME??  she is conservative 
and would never do this i am sure.  how could he want something else??? 
it is just so baffling..   cheri

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(2 recommendations so far) Message 13 of 17 in Discussion 
From: XtraMSN NicknamesamvakSent: 8/04/2004 1:34 p.m.
Hi, Cheri,
 
I fully expected this phase - the guilt trip ...:o))

Self-flagellation is a characteristic of those who choose to live with a narcissist (and a choice it is). Constant guilt feelings, self-reproach, self-recrimination and, thus �?self-punishment typify the relationships formed between the sadist-narcissist and the masochistic-dependent mate or partner.

The narcissist is sadistic because he was forced into expressing his own guilt and self-reproach in this manner. It is his Superego, which is unpredictable, capricious, arbitrary, judgemental, cruel, and self-annihilating (suicidal). Externalising these internal traits is a way of alleviating internal conflicts and fears generated by this inner turmoil. The narcissist projects his civil war and drags everyone around him into a swirl of bitterness, suspiciousness, meanness, aggression and pettiness. His life is a reflection of his psychological landscape: barren, paranoiac, tormented, guilt ridden. He feels compelled to do unto others what he perpetrates unto himself. He gradually transforms all around him into replicas of his conflictive, punishing personality structures.

Some narcissists are more subtle than others. They disguise their sadism. For instance, they "educate" their nearest and dearest (for their sake, as they present it). This “education�?is compulsive, obsessive, incessantly, harshly and unduly critical. Its effect is to erode the subject, to humiliate, to create dependence, to intimidate, to restrain, to control, to paralyse. The victim internalises the endless preaching and criticism and makes them his own. She begins to see justice where there is only twisted logic based on crooked assumptions. She begins to self-punish, to withhold, to request approval prior to any action, to forgo her preferences and priorities, to erase her own identity �?hoping to thus avoid the excruciating pains of the narcissist's destructive analyses.

Other narcissists are less sophisticated and they use all manner of abuse to domesticate their kin and partners in life. This spans physical violence, verbal violence (during intensive rage attacks), psychological abuse, brutal "honesty", sick or offending humour, and so on.

But both categories of narcissists employ very simple deceptive mechanisms to achieve their goals. One thing must be made clear: this is not a well thought out, previously planned campaign by the average narcissist. His behaviour is dictated by forces that he cannot master. Most of the time he is not even conscious of why he is doing what he is doing. When he is �?he can't tell the outcomes. Even when he can �?he feels powerless to behave otherwise. The narcissist is a pawn in the chess game played between the structures of his fragmented, fluid personality. So, in a classical �?juridical sense, the narcissist is not to blame, he is not fully responsible or aware of what he is doing to others.

This seems to contradict my answer to FAQ # 13 where I write:

"The narcissist knows to tell right from wrong. He is perfectly capable of anticipating the results of his actions and their influence on his human environment. The narcissist is very perceptive and sensitive to the subtlest nuances. He has to be: the very integrity of his personality depends upon input from others�?A person suffering from NPD must be subjected to the same moral treatment and judgement as the rest of us, the less privileged, are. The courts do not recognise NPD to be a mitigating circumstance �?why should we?"

But, the contradiction is only apparent. The narcissist is perfectly capable both of distinguishing right from wrong �?and of foretelling the outcomes of his actions. In this sense, the narcissist should be held liable for his deeds and exploits. If he so chooses, the narcissist can fight his compulsive inclination to behave the way that he does. This would come at a great personal psychological price. Avoidance or suppression of a compulsive act results in increased anxiety. The narcissist prefers his own well-being to that of others. Even when confronted with the great misery that he fosters, he hardly feels responsible (for instance, he rarely attends to psychotherapy).

To put it more plainly, the (average) narcissist is unable to answer the question: "Why did you do what you did?" or "Why did you choose this mode of action over others available to you under the same circumstances?" These decisions are taken unconsciously. But once the course of action is (unconsciously) decided, the narcissist has a perfect grasp of what he is doing, that it is wrong with it and what will be the price others are likely to pay for it. And he can then choose to reverse course (for instance, to refrain from doing anything). In one sense therefore, he is not to blame �?in another he is very guilty.

The narcissist deliberately confuses responsibility with guilt. The concepts are so close that the distinctions often get blurred. By provoking guilt in responsibility-laden situations, the narcissist transforms life with him into a constant trial. Actually, the trial itself is the punishment and, therefore, is eternal. A failure, for instance, induces guilt and the narcissist always labels someone else's efforts as "failures". The narcissist then strives to shift the responsibility for the failures thus proclaimed to his victim so as to maximise the opportunity to chastise and castigate him. The logic is two-phased. First, every responsibility added to the victim is bound to lead to failure, which, in turn, induces in the victim guilt feelings, self-recrimination and self-punishment. Secondly, more and more responsibilities are shifted away from the narcissist and onto his mate �?so that, as time goes by, an asymmetry of failures is established. Burdened with less and less responsibilities and tasks �?the narcissist fails less. It preserves the narcissist's sense of superiority, on the one hand �?and legitimises his sadistic attacks on his victim, on the other hand.

The narcissist's partner is also to "blame". Such folies-a-deux can never take place without the full collaboration of a willingly and voluntarily subordinated victim. Such partners have a wish to be punished, to be eroded through constant, biting criticisms, unfavourable comparisons, veiled and not so veiled threats, acting out, betrayals and humiliations. It makes them feel cleansed, "holy", whole, sacrificial. Many of them, when they realise their situation (it is very difficult to discern it from the inside) �?abandon the narcissist and dismantle the relationship. Others prefer to believe in the healing power of love or some such other nonsense. It is nonsense not because love has no therapeutic power �?it is by far the most powerful weapon in the healing arsenal. It is nonsense, because it is wasted on a human shell, incapable of feeling anything but binary and negative emotions, which vaguely filter through his dreamlike existence. The narcissist is incapable of loving, his emotional apparatus ruined by years of deprivation, abuse, misuse and disuse.

Granted, he is unequalled at simulating human emotions and their attendant behaviours. He is convincing, he is deviously successful and sweeps everyone around him into the turbulent delusion which he consists of. He uses anything and anyone to secure his dose of Narcissistic Supply �?and discards, without a second thought those he deems worthless in this �?and only in this �?regard.

The narcissist-victim dyad is a conspiracy, a collusion of victim and mental tormentor, a collaboration of two needy people who find solace and supply in each other's deviations. Only by breaking loose, by aborting the game, by ignoring the rules �?can the victim be transformed (and by the way, acquire the newly found appreciation of the narcissist). The narcissist also stands to benefit from such a move. But both the narcissist and his partner do not really think about each other. Gripped in the arms of an all-consuming dance macabre, they follow the motions morbidly, semiconscious, desensitised, exhausted, concerned only with survival �?their survival. Living with a narcissist is very much like being in a maimum security prison. It is taxing.

The narcissist's partner should not feel guilty or responsible and should not seek to change what only time (not even therapy) and (difficult) circumstances may change. She should not strive to please and to appease, to be and not to be, to barely survive as a superposition of pain and fear. Releasing herself from the chains of guilt and from the throes of a debilitating relationship �?is the best help that a loving mate can provide to her ailing narcissistic partner.

Regarding his sexuality
 
He is a closet homosexual. He is not having sex with her, worry not (though why you should care is not clear to me).
 
Many narcissists - both somatic and cerebral - are repressed homosexuals and, as a result, misogynists (women-haters).
 
He was stroking your hair at night because that was the only time you could not respond to him and threaten him with intimacy. Many men stroke their cars, lovingly maintain their shiny new laptops, and proudly show off their new homes. You were a prized possession and he was proud of his ownership of you. So, he stroked you. But only when you were inanimate (asleep). When we are asleep, we are not conscious. We are objects. Narcissists like objects.
 
Read these:
 
 
 
 
Take care and get on with your life. He is gone, never to return. Count your blessings. Don't mourn the apparition that he was.
 
 
 
Sam

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From: XtraMSN Nickname·TammyJo·Sent: 9/04/2004 3:29 a.m.
i really fear that i have been in relationships with disordered men all my life, starting with my father..  he was at the very least emotionally unavailable.  he cheated on my mother, was reckless to the point of killing himself in a boating accident when i was 18 and nearly killed my two brothers along with him,,  i was sexually molested at 3 by a 75 yr old man.. i worry that i have NO sense of what to recognize as a RED FLAG..
i worry that i could even be an inverted N.. i LOVE the charisma, the excitement..my dad had it.. he had the dancing eyes.. i have the dancing eyes.. i worry about ME..  is this excitement only present in N's???? you say that an inverted N is one who HAS to be with an N... i am alone now and fine with this but did suffer the loss almost as if it were an addiction.. is this normal??? i was paralyzed for nearly a YEAR...  i hope i am not an inverted N..  lol..
i would like any help you can give me to be AWARE.. i know the qualifications of the N,, but are there other RED FLAGS i should know about??
i would also like to say, that i think you are BRILLIANT.. you may be an N, but you are using what you know to help others.. i could care less what else you get from it.. you have really helped me with your insight and knowledge in a subject that is at best sketchy..  THANK YOU AGAIN..  and BLESS your heart as well.. i wish you much happiness in your life.. i hope you DO have some happiness even though......  love and light  cheri



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 Message 17 of 17 in Discussion 
From: XtraMSN NicknamesamvakSent: 9/04/2004 12:36 p.m.
Thank you, Cheri, for your kind wishes.
 
Inverted narcissism is described here in great detail (including testimonies by women who are codependent on narcissists):
 
 
Mourning the narcissist:
 

Is there anything you can do to avoid abusers and narcissists to start with? Are there any warning signs, any identifying marks, rules of thumbs to shield you from the harrowing and traumatic experience of an abusive relationship?

Imagine a first or second date. You can already tell if he is a would-be abuser. Here's how:

Perhaps the first telltale sign is the abuser's alloplastic defenses �?/SPAN> his tendency to blame every mistake of his, every failure, or mishap on others, or on the world at large. Be tuned: does he assume personal responsibility? Does he admit his faults and miscalculations? Or does he keep blaming you, the cab driver, the waiter, the weather, the government, or fortune for his predicament?

Is he hypersensitive, picks up fights, feels constantly slighted, injured, and insulted? Does he rant incessantly? Does he treat animals and children impatiently or cruelly and does he express negative and aggressive emotions towards the weak, the poor, the needy, the sentimental, and the disabled? Does he confess to having a history of battering or violent offenses or behavior? Is his language vile and infused with expletives, threats, and hostility?

Next thing: is he too eager? Does he push you to marry him having dated you only twice? Is he planning on having children on your first date? Does he immediately cast you in the role of the love of his life? Is he pressing you for exclusivity, instant intimacy, almost rapes you and acts jealous when you as much as cast a glance at another male? Does he inform you that, once you get hitched, you should abandon your studies or resign your job (forgo your personal autonomy)?

Does he respect your boundaries and privacy? Does he ignore your wishes (for instance, by choosing from the menu or selecting a movie without as much as consulting you)? Does he disrespect your boundaries and treats you as an object or an instrument of gratification (materializes on your doorstep unexpectedly or calls you often prior to your date)? Does he go through your personal belongings while waiting for you to get ready?

Does he control the situation and you compulsively? Does he insist to ride in his car, holds on to the car keys, the money, the theater tickets, and even your bag? Does he disapprove if you are away for too long (for instance when you go to the powder room)? Does he interrogate you when you return ("have you seen anyone interesting") �?/SPAN> or make lewd "jokes" and remarks? Does he hint that, in future, you would need his permission to do things �?/SPAN> even as innocuous as meeting a friend or visiting with your family?

Does he act in a patronizing and condescending manner and criticizes you often? Does he emphasize your minutest faults (devalues you) even as he exaggerates your talents, traits, and skills (idealizes you)? Is he wildly unrealistic in his expectations from you, from himself, from the budding relationship, and from life in general?

Does he tell you constantly that you "make him feel" good? Don't be impressed. Next thing, he may tell you that you "make" him feel bad, or that you make him feel violent, or that you "provoke" him. "Look what you made me do!" is an abuser's ubiquitous catchphrase.

Does he find sadistic sex exciting? Does he have fantasies of rape or pedophilia? Is he too forceful with you in and out of the sexual intercourse? Does he like hurting you physically or finds it amusing? Does he abuse you verbally �?/SPAN> does he curse you, demeans you, calls you ugly or inappropriately diminutive names, or persistently criticizes you? Does he then switch to being saccharine and "loving", apologizes profusely and buys you gifts?

If you have answered "yes" to any of the above �?/SPAN> stay away! He is an abuser.

Then there is the abuser's body language. It comprises an unequivocal series of subtle �?/SPAN> but discernible �?/SPAN> warning signs. Pay attention to the way your date comports himself �?/SPAN> and save yourself a lot of trouble!

Abusers are an elusive breed, hard to spot, harder to pinpoint, impossible to capture. Even an experienced mental health diagnostician with unmitigated access to the record and to the person examined would find it fiendishly difficult to determine with any degree of certainty whether someone is being abusive because he suffers from an impairment, i.e., a mental health disorder.

Some abusive behavior patterns are a result of the patient's cultural-social context. The offender seeks to conform to cultural and social morals and norms. Additionally, some people become abusive in reaction to severe life crises.

Still, most abusers master the art of deception. People often find themselves involved with a abuser (emotionally, in business, or otherwise) before they have a chance to discover his real nature. When the abuser reveals his true colors, it is usually far too late. His victims are unable to separate from him. They are frustrated by this acquired helplessness and angry that they failed to see through the abuser earlier on.

But abusers do emit subtle, almost subliminal, signals in his body language even in a first or casual encounter. These are:

"Haughty" body language �?The abuser adopts a physical posture which implies and exudes an air of superiority, seniority, hidden powers, mysteriousness, amused indifference, etc. Though the abuser usually maintains sustained and piercing eye contact, he often refrains from physical proximity (he maintains his personal territory).

The abuser takes part in social interactions �?even mere banter �?condescendingly, from a position of supremacy and faux "magnanimity and largesse". But even when he feigns gregariousness, he rarely mingles socially and prefers to remain the "observer", or the "lone wolf".

Entitlement markers �?The abuser immediately asks for "special treatment" of some kind. Not to wait his turn, to have a longer or a shorter therapeutic session, to talk directly to authority figures (and not to their assistants or secretaries), to be granted special payment terms, to enjoy custom tailored arrangements. This tallies well with the abuser's alloplastic defenses - his tendency to shift responsibility to others, or to the world at large, for his needs, failures, behavior, choices, and mishaps  ("look what you made me do!").

The abuser is the one who �?vocally and demonstratively �?demands the undivided attention of the head waiter in a restaurant, or monopolizes the hostess, or latches on to celebrities in a party. The abuser reacts with rage and indignantly when denied his wishes and if treated the same as others whom he deems inferior. Abusers frequently and embarrassingly "dress down" service providers such as waiters or cab drivers.

Idealization or devaluation �?The abuser instantly idealizes or devalues his interlocutor. He flatters, adores, admires and applauds the "target" in an embarrassingly exaggerated and profuse manner �?or sulks, abuses, and humiliates her.

Abusers are polite only in the presence of a potential would-be victim �?/SPAN> a "mate", or a "collaborator". But they are unable to sustain even perfunctory civility and fast deteriorate to barbs and thinly-veiled hostility, to verbal or other violent displays of abuse, rage attacks, or cold detachment.

The "membership" posture �?The abuser always tries to "belong". Yet, at the very same time, he maintains his stance as an outsider. The abuser seeks to be admired for his ability to integrate and ingratiate himself without investing the efforts commensurate with such an undertaking.

For instance: if the abuser talks to a psychologist, the abuser first states emphatically that he never studied psychology. He then proceeds to make seemingly effortless use of obscure professional terms, thus demonstrating that he mastered the discipline all the same �?which is supposed to prove that he is exceptionally intelligent or introspective.

In general, the abuser always prefers show-off to substance. One of the most effective methods of exposing a abuser is by trying to delve deeper. The abuser is shallow, a pond pretending to be an ocean. He likes to think of himself as a Renaissance man, a Jack of all trades, or a genius. Abusers never admit to ignorance or to failure in any field �?yet, typically, they are ignorant and losers. It is surprisingly easy to penetrate the gloss and the veneer of the abuser's self-proclaimed omniscience, success, wealth, and omnipotence.

Bragging and false autobiography �?The abuser brags incessantly. His speech is peppered with "I", "my", "myself", and "mine". He describes himself as intelligent, or rich, or modest, or intuitive, or creative �?but always excessively, implausibly, and extraordinarily so.

The abuser's biography sounds unusually rich and complex. His achievements �?incommensurate with his age, education, or renown. Yet, his actual condition is evidently and demonstrably incompatible with his claims. Very often, the abuser's lies or fantasies are easily discernible. He always name-drops and appropriates other people's experiences and accomplishments as his own.

Emotion-free language �?The abuser likes to talk about himself and only about himself. He is not interested in others or what they have to say. He is never reciprocal. He acts disdainful, even angry, if he feels an intrusion on his precious time.

In general, the abuser is very impatient, easily bored, with strong attention deficits �?unless and until he is the topic of discussion. One can dissect all aspects of the intimate life of a abuser, providing the discourse is not "emotionally tinted". If asked to relate directly to his emotions, the abuser intellectualizes, rationalizes, speaks about himself in the third person and in a detached "scientific" tone or composes a narrative with a fictitious character in it, suspiciously autobiographical.

Most abusers get enraged when required to delve deeper into their motives, fears, hopes, wishes, and needs. They use violence to cover up their perceived "weakness" and "sentimentality". They distance themselves from their own emotions and from their loved ones by alienating and hurting them.

Seriousness and sense of intrusion and coercion �?The abuser is dead serious about himself. He may possess a fabulous sense of humor, scathing and cynical, but rarely is he self-deprecating. The abuser regards himself as being on a constant mission, whose importance is cosmic and whose consequences are global.

If a scientist �?he is always in the throes of revolutionizing science. If a journalist �?he is in the middle of the greatest story ever. If an aspiring businessman - he is on the way to concluding the deal of the century. Woe betide those who doubt his grandiose fantasies and impossible schemes.

This self-misperception is not amenable to light-headedness or self-effacement. The abuser is easily hurt and insulted (narcissistic injury). Even the most innocuous remarks or acts are interpreted by him as belittling, intruding, or coercive slights and demands. His time is more valuable than others' �?therefore, it cannot be wasted on unimportant matters such as social intercourse, family obligations, or household chores. Inevitably, he feels constantly misunderstood.

Any suggested help, advice, or concerned inquiry are immediately cast by the abuser as intentional humiliation, implying that the abuser is in need of help and counsel and, thus, imperfect. Any attempt to set an agenda is, to the abuser, an intimidating act of enslavement. In this sense, the abuser is both schizoid and paranoid and often entertains ideas of reference.

Finally, abusers are sometimes sadistic and have inappropriate affect. In other words, they find the obnoxious, the heinous, and the shocking �?funny or even gratifying. They are sexually sado-masochistic or deviant. They like to taunt, to torment, and to hurt people's feelings ("humorously" or with bruising "honesty").

While some abusers are "stable" and "conventional" �?others are antisocial and their impulse control is flawed. These are very reckless (self-destructive and self-defeating) and just plain destructive: workaholism, alcoholism, drug abuse, pathological gambling, compulsory shopping, or reckless driving.

Yet, these �?the lack of empathy, the aloofness, the disdain, the sense of entitlement, the restricted application of humor, the unequal treatment, the sadism, and the paranoia �?do not render the abuser a social misfit. This is because the abuser mistreats only his closest �?spouse, children, or (much more rarely) colleagues, friends, neighbours. To the rest of the world, he appears to be a composed, rational, and functioning person. Abusers are very adept at casting a veil of secrecy �?often with the active aid of their victims �?over their dysfunction and misbehavior.

Hope this helps! It was great working with you.

Take care there.

Sam


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