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Well, here's something else I don't get -- when someone tells you they're doing pretty well, why do people on this board attempt to tell them that no, they're not, and try to pull them back down? Maybe this is the Universe's way to push me beyond staying on this board. Perhaps being here is what is keeping me "stuck." The post that started out very nice with some kind words from duckylou ended up feeling abusive to me. It left me in tears. I appreciate those who are concerned about me and my journey, but I will not stay here & be abused -- "your posts are not adding up" --"you're using us to get information to write something about us" -- what the hell is that all about? I am officially gutted. What happened to me last night by people I considered to be "friends" is not "tough love," it is abuse. I have been total NC for more than 2 mos. Isn't that what I'm supposed to be doing? I have asked questions. Isn't that what I'm supposed to be doing? For that I am accused of being a fake. Do people here want me saying how hurt I am from xn's abuse? I haven't gone there lately because I haven't had to. Read my earlier posts-- if it's grief you're looking, it's grief you'll find. I've done a lot of grief work. I'm doing better. Why is it now unusual not to see words like "hurt" in my posts? Well, you'll see one in THIS post. I am beyond hurt. I am feeling betrayed and falseley accused. I considered my questioning everything to be a further part of my healing process. Okay, I get it -- we can't understand an n. Does that mean we should quit asking questions? Apparently so. Apparently my questions here are either inflammatory, or they make me sound like a fake. No one here has any idea how I'm doing. I don't even recognize myself from where I was in January. No one here gets to judge where anyone needs to be on their own personal healing journey, nor how they get there. I wish all of you Godspeed on your journeys to healing and happiness.
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HMR, I hope you are not leaving. I have seen you as strong, understanding, loving, and completely aware of the ways of the n. I need you to stay. But I can certainly understand how it is to have ourselves placed in a light that we did not intend it to be. We need support and need to feel we can ask what is on our mind. Every situation is so different. Some posts seem to bring out sharp comments. I realize we all need to receive tough love sometimes. But sometimes we are just wondering the answers. I have been afraid to ask some things myself for fear of being judged instead of being supported in a kind way. That being said I also appreciate every member on this board and all we have been thru and grown by the help of others. Thank you all. |
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HMR-
Two months is nothing in NC - great achievement- BUT I am noting the timeframe b/c I think it is very NATURAL to have questions, be curious. I am NC 18mos. and I write a regular blog on psychopaths/narcissists.
Once I figured out what the heck happened- I began digging. Anyone would- just like victims of crimes don't rest until the culprit is found, tried and punished. We don't have that luxury- there's rarely payback.
So the best we get is knowing why. I am there, I know why- but that doesn't mean I am not still learning from what happened.
I think you are at a perfectly normal place for you if you feel you are. That's up to you- I know I am- I am not crying, I am not craving them- etc. I am getting healthier and even avoiding new Ns so I know something I am doing is working.
If you need to know why- I get it- I did too- and I wish you well your journey. I have site that has links to clinical studies- check it out.
Good wishes |
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http://holywatersalt.blogspot.com/
my blog
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Hi HMR- I see your points. I really do. Deepak Chopra says something to this effect when someone judges him..."Oh, that's an interesting comment." On the board and in life, you take what works for you. Not everything will work for you. |
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| | (1 recommendation so far) | Message 7 of 13 in Discussion |
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Sometimes words set us so free. There was one concept that I struggled with for years that I simply couldn't "get" no matter how hard I tried. It was the serenity prayer. I had a basic faulty concept that blocked my growth. I couldn't understand why I couldn't control or might not have the power or the right to control things that affected me. It seemed to me that if things, anything, created difficulties for me, then I had some rights ir sayso in the whole scheme. Then, one day I read Covey's 7 Habits book, and his concepts about effective people focusing their energy on things they could control made it all clear. He stated that we all have forces that affect our lives that we simply have no control over. That is life. And effective people figure out the difference between the things they can control and the things they can't, and they focus their energies where they have control. This may seem silly to many people, but it was a pivotal turning for me. It was like a huge light went on and chains that held me down were dropped. Another concept I always struggled with, and I mean always struggled with, was that of "judging" others. I got it in the larger sense - that I could not decide the true worth or value of another person, because I could not know the "whole" of the story, not the beginning, not the end, and not the in-between. But I could not understand the small sense of "judging" others. It eluded me. There were really no examples of effective interactions with others that I could find that did not include some form of judgment. The truth is, most people find "judgment" just fine, as long as it is a complimentary or "positive" judgment. But no one wants to be judged in negative or diminishing terms. Then I read Marshall Rosenberg's work on nonviolent communications, and another one of those huge lights went on. I have posted links to his website about half a dozen times here because learning his techniques and hearing the concepts in his words helped me past seemingly unbreachable limitations. His insight and eloquence have been a huge gift to me in my life, and here is the link again for anyone interested. http://www.cnvc.org/ The difference between aggressive communications and non-aggressive communications is the difference between observing and evaluating others. Regardless of how sensitive we try to be, regardless of how pure we claim our motives are, when we evaluate other people rather than observe as objectively as possible what they say or do, we always run the risk of leveling some form of psychological violence toward them. We may justify it by calling it "tough love," or declaring how we only have the other person's best interests at heart, but in our heart of hearts, we know and they know, something is not ringing true. Something about the interaction creates a winner and a loser, a person who is right and a person who is wrong, and if we are really honest with ourselves, it always hurts everyone. There are no winners. On the contrary, diminishing others always hurts me more profoundly than it does them, if I am only able to see it. This was very hard for me to learn. It took many, many years, and many, many mistakes. It took a lot of suffering before I could give up being "right" and "helpful" to other people. The great gift of sincerely trying to be genuinely kinder to others has been that I am less harmed by the psychological violence directed toward me. I see it more truly for what it is. From Rosenberg's site: What is Nonviolent Communication? Imagine connecting with the human spirit, in each person, in any situation. Imagine interacting with others in a way that allows everyone’s needs to be equally valued. Imagine creating organizations and life-serving systems responsive to our needs and the needs of our environment. Nonviolent Communication (NVC) helps connect us with what is alive in ourselves and in others moment-to-moment, with what we or others could do to make life more wonderful, and with an awareness of what gets in the way of natural giving and receiving. NVC language strengthens our ability to inspire compassion from others and respond compassionately to others and ourselves. NVC guides us to reframe how we express ourselves, how we hear others and resolve conflicts by focusing our consciousness on what we are observing, feeling, needing, and requesting. Nonviolent Communication Language: It awakens empathy and honesty, and is sometimes described as "the language of the heart." Best regards, ogf |
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It's a shame if Roar has been chased away.  I don't agree with everything everyone posts on this website but I appreciate that everyone has to make their own journey and do their own evaluation of what happened to them and how to move forward. If I don't agree, I either don't respond or drop it after one post. I know I'm not the most perceptive person so I don't pretend to believe I know what is best for anyone. This site is usually very nurturing, though, like OGF said, there is sometimes 'tough love.' But even the 'tough love' is usually done with a bit of humor or whimsy. I don't think I've ever found a thread where 'tough love' was harsh and judgmental. But I have seen some threads I felt were judgmental, unfortunately. I will miss the the roar from HMR, if she has gone. I remember where she was months ago, as I remember where I was at that time, and I've celebrated her progress. I've enjoyed her perspective. I wish her the best.  |
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Hi HMR. I've been pondering the direction and tone that duckylou's thread ended up taking. I do think some of the posters were hard on you... these same posters seldom respond so stridently to others who have been here longer than you who ask questions similar to the ones you ask. But I think the I know the reason for that, and it isn't that they are mean spirited or have some desire to single you out for criticism.
It is because you, HMR, are so intelligent, so insightful, so quick witted that the veterans who look forward to your "I get it!" posts are troubled by any evidence that you are still spending any time at all on questions about Captain Cockrocket, i.e., the worthless N.
It may be that they are expecting too much too soon. There are many here who can tell you it took a year or more for them to truly come to terms with the reality of who xN was, and begin to feel the peace of mind that comes from really getting, on a gut level, that "It wasn't me... it WAS him." And that is without the provocation of learning that the N has married the OW he left them for.
This board is about healing and moving on. You are clearly doing that, faster than many, slower than some. But you are so bright and articulate that you seem like someone who would just grasp the whole enchilada instantly. Those of us who have noticed this about you are always a little surprised when you post something that indicates you still aren't past asking questions about the N (instead of putting that energy into trying to figure out how you ended up with CCR in the first place). It's a bit like having a truly gifted child and worrying because there is some academic area in which the gifted child seems merely average. I think you *are* obviously gifted, with tremendous intelligence and insight... and I think, because of that, the general expectations for you are higher here than for most posters.
I also think the ones who commented on that thread do care about you and said what they did in the spirit of tough love... but I can also see how it could have felt to you like piling on. I'm sorry for the pain you have been feeling because of the comments... but I truly believe what was said came directly out of the high regard in which you are held by those posters.
I love reading your posts and look forward to the day that you can make your observations from the perspective of someone who has arrived on the other shore; you will be a tremendous beacon of light for the newbies here one day... and it will take however long it takes. Please stay and continue to write. |
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OGF, Thank you for a very meaningful and uplifting post. And the serenity prayer is one of my favorites. I carry a copy in my wallet. |
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Oh man HMR, I can't believe what happened here. I am so sorry. I surely didn't see all of this coming. Hang in there girl, the opinions expressed by some are not indicative of the whole.
ducky |
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| | From:  OzGirl57 | Sent: 17/11/2008 11:48 p.m. |
<WBR>HMR,
I don't post often, but I always love reading your posts. I haven't seen anything you have written to be inappropriate. I still have MANY questions myself regarding n and nc and moving on with my life, ect. I had intended to stay here a long time because I need the support to get me well, where I don't need constant support any more, and where I feel that all my questions have been resolved in my mind. I believe that's what you are striving for. I just wanted you to know that I hope you don't leave.
-----Original Message-----
From: NARCISSISTIC_PERSONALITY_DISORDER <[email protected]>
To: NARCISSISTIC_PERSONALITY_DISORDER <[email protected]>
Sent: Sat, 8 Nov 2008 10:26 am
Subject: Re: msg for HMR
-----------------------------------------------------------
New Message on NARCISSISTIC_PERSONALITY_DISORDER
-----------------------------------------------------------
From: ___HearMeRoar1___
Message 2 in Discussion
Well, here's something else I don't get -- when someone tells you they're doing
pretty well, why do people on this board attempt to tell them that no, they're
not, and try to pull them back down? Maybe this is the Universe's way to push
me beyond staying on this board. Perhaps being here is what is keeping me
"stuck." The post that started out very nice with some kind words from duckylou
ended up feeling abusive to me. It left me in tears. I appreciate those who are
concerned about me and my journey, but I will not stay here & be abused -- "your
posts are not adding up" --"you're using us to get information to write
something about us" -- what the hell is that all about? I am officially gutted.
What happened to me last night by people I considered to be "friends" is not
"tough love," it is abuse. I have been total NC for more than 2 mos. Isn't that
what I'm supposed to be doing? I have asked questions. Isn't that what I'm
supposed to be doing? For that I am accused of being a fake. Do people here
want me saying how hurt I am from xn's abuse? I haven't gone there lately
because I haven't had to. Read my earlier posts-- if it's grief you're looking,
it's grief you'll find. I've done a lot of grief work. I'm doing better. Why
is it now unusual not to see words like "hurt" in my posts? Well, you'll see
one in THIS post. I am beyond hurt. I am feeling betrayed and falseley
accused. I considered my questioning everything to be a further part of my
healing process. Okay, I get it -- we can't understand an n. Does that mean we
should quit asking questions? Apparently so. Apparently my questions here are
either inflammatory, or they make me sound like a fake. No one here has any
idea how I'm doing. I don't even recognize myself from where I was in January.
No one here gets to judge where anyone needs to be on their own personal healing
journey, nor how they get there. I wish all of you Godspeed on your journeys
to healing and happiness.
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Reply
| | | From: OzGirl57 | Sent: 17/11/2008 11:52 p.m. |
<WBR>Weird, I sent this Sat., Nov 8
-----Original Message-----
From: NARCISSISTIC_PERSONALITY_DISORDER <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Mon, 17 Nov 2008 5:48 pm
Subject: Re: msg for HMR
-----------------------------------------------------------
New Message on NARCISSISTIC_PERSONALITY_DISORDER
-----------------------------------------------------------
From: OzGirl57
Message 12 in Discussion
<WBR>HMR,
I don't post often, but I always love reading your posts. I haven't seen
anything you have written to be inappropriate. I still have MANY questions
myself regarding n and nc and moving on with my life, ect. I had intended to
stay here a long time because I need the support to get me well, where I don't
need constant support any more, and where I feel that all my questions have been
resolved in my mind. I believe that's what you are striving for. I just
wanted you to know that I hope you don't leave.
-----Original Message-----
From: NARCISSISTIC_PERSONALITY_DISORDER <[email protected]>
To: NARCISSISTIC_PERSONALITY_DISORDER <[email protected]>
Sent: Sat, 8 Nov 2008 10:26 am
Subject: Re: msg for HMR
-----------------------------------------------------------
New Message on NARCISSISTIC_PERSONALITY_DISORDER
-----------------------------------------------------------
From: ___HearMeRoar1___
Message 2 in Discussion
Well, here's something else I don't get -- when someone tells you they're doing
pretty well, why do people on this board attempt to tell them that no, they're
not, and try to pull them back down? Maybe this is the Universe's way to push
me beyond staying on this board. Perhaps being here is what is keeping me
"stuck." The post that started out very nice with some kind words from duckylou
ended up feeling abusive to me. It left me in tears. I appreciate those who are
concerned about me and my journey, but I will not stay here & be abused -- "your
posts are not adding up" --"you're using us to get information to write
something about us" -- what the hell is that all about? I am officially gutted.
What happened to me last night by people I considered to be "friends" is not
"tough love," it is abuse. I have been total NC for more than 2 mos. Isn't that
what I'm supposed to be doing? I have asked questions. Isn't that what I'm
supposed to be doing? For that I am accused of being a fake. Do people here
want me saying how hurt I am from xn's abuse? I haven't gone there lately
because I haven't had to. Read my earlier posts-- if it's grief you're looking,
it's grief you'll find. I've done a lot of grief work. I'm doing better. Why
is it now unusual not to see words like "hurt" in my posts? Well, you'll see
one in THIS post. I am beyond hurt. I am feeling betrayed and falseley
accused. I considered my questioning everything to be a further part of my
healing process. Okay, I get it -- we can't understand an n. Does that mean we
should quit asking questions? Apparently so. Apparently my questions here are
either inflammatory, or they make me sound like a fake. No one here has any
idea how I'm doing. I don't even recognize myself from where I was in January.
No one here gets to judge where anyone needs to be on their own personal healing
journey, nor how they get there. I wish all of you Godspeed on your journeys
to healing and happiness.
-----------------------------------------------------------
To stop getting this e-mail, or change how often it arrives, go to your E-mail
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Need help? If you've forgotten your password, please go to Passport Member
Services.
http://groups.msn.com/_passportredir.msnw?ppmprop=help
For other questions or feedback, go to our Contact Us page.
http://groups.msn.com/contact
If you do not want to receive future e-mail from this MSN group, or if you
received this message by mistake, please click the "Remove" link below. On the
pre-addressed e-mail message that opens, simply click "Send". Your e-mail
address will be deleted from this group's mailing list.
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<BR/>Instant access to the latest & most popular FREE games while you browse
with the Games Toolbar - Download Now!
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Instant access to the latest & most popular FREE games while you browse with the Games Toolbar - Download Now! |
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